mentalhealth

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: I fully support this forward progression.

[Singing]

P: Da Dum Da Daaaa!

M: Da da da da, da dum da daaaa

P & M: Da da daaaa!

[End singing]

P: Oh wow. You went to the refrain straight away.

M & P: Laugh!

P: God bless John Williams. Is that John Williams? I think it’s John Williams. [Yes, it is]

M: I’ve got no idea.

P: Laugh!

M: I didn’t even realise what we were singing, I just know it. Star Wars? What are we doing?

P: That was Raiders of the lost Ark, laugh.

M: Oh, yeah. Okay. Alright. It was one of those things from deep within my childhood.

P: Laugh!

M: It just came flooding back to me and I was like, I don’t know why I know this, but I do. Laugh.

P: Someone today at our IT meeting said does anyone here remember Xena Warrior princess? I’m like a, duh, laugh!

M: I dressed up as her for Halloween.

P: Laugh!

M: Do I remember her, psht! I have photos.

P: Laugh.

M: So, I’ve decided on today’s episode that we’re not going to mention the C word.

P: Oh! Not the See you next Tuesday?

M: No, not that “See” word.

P: Laugh!

M: The C word that has taken over our entire life.

P: Exactly. I’m all for not saying it ever again.

M: Well, I do think there are times where you need to acknowledge that things aren’t okay. But I also think focusing on bad things too much can just make you get stuck in a rut.

M: So, today we are going to talk about breathing your way to happiness.

P: Oh, you just stole my intro, Laugh.

M: And we’re not going to mention the C word.

P: Laugh!

M: We’re going to talk about breathing.

P: We’re going to talk about the B word, laugh.

M: The B word. Yes. Which as a cynic, and cynic is not the C word we were talking about.

P & M: Laughter.

M: As a cynic, breathing kind of seems a bit far-fetched.

P: I love that you brought this up Marie, because the way I was going to segway into this was actually talking about meditation.

M: Yep…

P: So, in a way, this is,

M: …

P: Uh okay, hold back. Just give me a second, laugh.

M: Go on. Change my mind, Peter.

P: Laugh, I have to explain this to our listeners. Sometimes Marie needs a bridal, laugh. You’ve just got to pull back a little bit and go ‘Okay, hang on. Let me have control here for a second.’ Laugh.

M: Or you could just join in?

P: Laughter!

M: I like to think it is passion and energy.

P: Oh, I support it, yeah.

M: And generally, people just come along for the ride, laugh.

P: True. True.

M: Laugh.

P: You get dragged along kicking and screaming. Both work! Laugh.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Anyway, moving on.

M: Breathing.

P: So, breathing. Well, it melds into meditation. And in the light of some of the episodes that we’ve done the last few weeks, this is this is an episode with a coping mechanism. So, we’re talking about things that you can actually do. And it got me thinking because I’ve recently been exposed to this, I actually realised that I’ve been using breath for a very long time –

M: Me too.

P: and breathing, actually –

M: Since I was born, I’ve been breathing.

P: Laugh, down Bessie!

M & P: Laughter.

P: Once again, bridal moment!

M: Laugh, sorry. As you were.

P: Laugh.

M: As you were saying, you’ve been breathing for a while?

P: Yes, I have been, but using breath, it was something that we did in my dance training. There was a lot of work around breathing, and we did a lot of Alexander technique and Feldenkrais technique and applied kinesiology, which is all about using the breath. These are terms that may not be familiar for a lot of people, but breathing was actually part of our training, if you like.

M: I think you might need to tone it down a bit, Peter.

P: Thanks, Marie. Laugh.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m pushing on here.

M: I love these episodes where I just get to jump in with snide comments or I prefer to call them witty comments.

P: Laugh, witty!?

M: When you’re trying to teach our listeners something.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Anyway, a bunch of fancy names for breathing.

P: Yes. Alright, then meditation comes along, so we know that Marie isn’t a meditator I’m speaking out, I’m looking out into my room here as if I’m speaking to the audience.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m choosing to ignore the person on the computer screen.

M & P: Laughter.

P: Using my nonverbal communication skills here.

M: Laugh.

P: So, we know that breathing is part of meditation. That breath is something that people who meditate train a lot with, and there is science behind it. We’re about to explore that science. So, there is a link between breath and stress, and so there’s been a lot of work in this and as far back as the 1950s. There was a gentleman called Walter Hess who coined the term the trophotropic response.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Now this trophy trophotropic response is about the integration of breath and how it works with the brain and in particular the hypothalamus, which is our sort of brain centre. It takes information and processes and sends it out to different parts of the brain and coordinates how the brain responds to information that’s coming in and out. So, the messages that are coming in from sensory and messages are going out, which is action.

M: And that’s what regulates this [stumbling over the word] tropho-tropic response?

P: The trophotropic response talks about the influence of the breath on the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system.

M: You’re getting really techy.

P: We are getting techy, I’m going for it with my study notes here. Sympathetic is the fight or flight response. So, when we are running away from the lion, we are in the sympathetic response. Our brain is going, ‘there’s a threat we need to run away. Let’s get all the blood and send it to the brain, because we need to activate the muscles. Let’s get all the blood and send it to the muscles because we need to perform running motions and get away. We need to elevate our adrenaline response because we need lots of energy to get moving to run away from the lion.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: The parasympathetic response is the opposite. It’s what happens when we sleep. It’s the rest and digest. So, when we rest were lying on the couch. We’re watching a movie. The blood doesn’t need to be out in our skeletal muscles. So, it goes internal. It goes to our digestive organs. It goes to our immune function. It goes to our defecation muscles down into our bladder and our urethra and things like that, so that we’ve got this resting and digesting.

In Eastern Medicine, they talk about it being descending Chi. So, the Chi goes from the outside, inwards into our organs. Are you with the mouse?

M: I feel like I’m having a science lesson. But how does this relate back to breathing? And what is trophotropic response again? Laugh.

P: Laugh. So, the trophotropic response is coined by Walter Hess to demonstrate an organism’s natural response to relaxation. What happens in our body when we relax, the science of relaxing.

M: And how does that relate to breathing?

P: So, what Walter talked about was looking at the ways that we could influence our relaxation. What do we do when we relax? What is the first thing you do when you finish work and you sit on the couch. What’ s one of the first things you do, Marie?

M: Scratch my ass?

P: Yep, then?

M & P: Laughter!

P: Grab a drink.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Hold on, I will sit with the vodka, generally.

P: Laugh!

M: Alright, I’ll play along, I’ll play along. Take a big, deep breath.

P: Take a big, deep breath. When we’ve finished a project, or we finished a block of study, or we finished an event. You take a big [long deep breath].

M: Mmm.

P: Now if we all just do that. If everyone takes a big breath and lets it out.

M: [Big breath]

P: What does that feel like?

M: [Whispers] Like a deep breath.

P: Notice your voice. It just went quiet. So, it brings us back to centre. If it takes us away from being this, ‘I’m on show and I’m gonna do this and that1,’ it’s like, Okay, let’s bring it all in internally. There were other scientists that explore this in the 1970s Schwartz, Davidson and Goleman and they looked at relaxation techniques which have a relation on cognitive and somatic components of anxiety. So, they’re looking particularly at anxiety and how relaxation techniques can influence what happens in our brain to downgrade anxiety.

M: What’s a somatic component of anxiety?

P: Somatic is movement basically. So, we’ve got cognitive, which is thinking.

M: Ok, yep.

P: And somatic, which is more movement, and this was coined by I’m going to get this wrong, Meryem Yilmaz, who is a Turkish PhD professor. She was talking about this and took this a step further when she was talking about exploring relaxation techniques with post-operative patients. So, patients who have gone in for operations.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Even pre-operative going into operations, using relaxation techniques and seeing how it affected their recovery from an operation. And she found that there was a positive correlation between breath and better recovery from operations. So, really, what you’ve said here is breath impacts, relaxation and relaxation can have impacts on anxiety both mental and physical, as well as pre and post-operative outcomes.

P: Yes.

M: Sorry. Not pre-operative outcomes as in… Okay, we get it though, laugh.

P: The intervention at the pre-operative stage.

M: Yep, helps with post[-operative] outcome.

P: Doing something pre-operatively helps with recovery, yeah. So, we’re talking about things that actually can help you with your health and bring you out of a situation in a better position. Agreed?

M: Got it.

P: Okay, so here comes the science.

M: But what’s the breathing, though?

P: Well, I’m so glad you asked this, Marie. Laugh.

M: I’ve been breathing since, you know, probably a few seconds after birth.

P: Laugh.

M: As has everyone else I know who’s alive.

P: Alright, I’m excited about this, I’m excited about this.

M: Laugh

P: So, if we actually go back to breathing and we look at the science, we’ve got a thing called tidal volume. So, tidal volume is the rate of oxygen and carbon dioxide that is exchanged in a single breath. Now, if we exercise and we breathe, what do we do?

M: When we’re exercising? Breathe.

P: Yeah.

M: You breathe faster.

P: Exactly. A lot of us take short, sharp breaths.

M: Yep, cause you’re trying to get oxygen in quickly.

P: Exactly. So, the other way that some of us will do when we’re exercising or we’re trying to breathe better is to breathe deeper. So we use forced inspiration to bring more oxygen into our lungs and then forced expiration to force more air out. Which do you think is more efficient?

M: Deeper versus shorter breaths.

P: Absolutely right. I’ve got some figures here.

Tidal volume is the amount of air that is exchanged on inhalation and exhalation. Okay?

So, according to percentage, 85% effective to slowly deep breathe as opposed to 40% on shallow and rapid breathing.

M: So, if you’re running or working really hard at the gym.

P: Yep.

M: Even though you might feel like you need to breathe faster and suck air in.

P: Yep.

M It is going to serve you better to slow that down as much as possible.

P: This is one of the things that we’ll come to later, and there’s a gentleman that we’ll talk about that’s actually trained in this. He’s trained his breath and training his body so that he can endure fitness by use of his breath, [and] he can make his oxygen/carbon dioxide transfer more efficient. Obviously, if you’re working at a high level, you need to breathe quickly and you need to expel air quicker. So, there is a certain point where your rate of breathing will increase.

M: Mmm.

P: If you’re under really heavy load and you’re going for it and half way through your marathon you’re having to go up a hill, you need to breathe quickly and you need to forcefully expire and inspire. We can’t change that. But if we look at the ways that we can actually control our breath, there are a couple of things that go on in the body. And the big one that is involved with a lot of research recently is this thing called the vagus nerve. Here we go with more science. I’m getting so scientific, I’m so proud of myself.

M: I know!

P & M: Laughter!

P: You created a monster, Marie! Laugh!

M: Accessible science, Pete.

P: Oh, oh.

M: Without the jargon, laugh.

P: Okay. So, one of the things that this deep breathing can do is it can stimulate the vagus nerve. The vagus nerve is our 10th cranial nerve. Okay, so when we’re talking about the vagus nerve and what it does essentially, if we can tap into the power of this vagus nerve, we can actually control how our body reacts to stress.

M: Ok.

P: And this is where the link with breathing comes in. So, if we can, when we are emotional and we’re suffering [from] stress and we’re running around and we’ve got things going on and I’ve got this deadline due and you start to get all hyper, you start to breathe really shallowly. One way that we can control that is to tap into our deep breathing which, according to the science, activates our vagus nerve, slows down our heart rate. We can use our breath to effectively calm our system.

M: Oh.

P: And there’s a gentleman who’s done this really well. And he’s well known in some of the extreme endurance athlete circles. Wim Hof, who is described as an endurance athlete and a Dutch philosopher.

M: Laugh, Dutch, I tell you, they’re all philosophers.

M & P: Laughter.

M: All those long, long winter nights.

P: Laugh, yeah. So, he’s known colloquially as the ICE MAN, because he goes and sits himself in the ice and snow and this is one of the ways that you can stimulate your vagus nerve. That and cold showers.

M: Hmm.

P: Yeah.

M: Again, another reason why this is just not for me.

M & P: Laughter.

P: But have you ever done that, when you come out of a really heavy volleyball tournament, and you’ve gone for a nice cold shower?

M: Look, we used to do ice baths when I was in college, and at the AIS. So yes, I know, really cold!

P: Laugh!

M: Not comfortable, you know, to the point where it’s painful, but I’ve never been a cold shower person. Never done it for me.

P: Yeah, so this guy has explored this whole idea of cold exposure and stimulation of the vagus nerve and says that this can actually ease yourself into stimulating your vagus nerve and calming your system down and creates better health and better understanding and better mental clarity after a very stressful event.

M: So, have a cold shower or breathe, and you’ll be able to reduce your stress. Is that kind of a summary of what we’re talking?

P: That’s pretty much it. Yeah.

M: Ok, I’m following. Laugh.

P: Laugh.

M: I got it. I got it!

P: Laugh! Took us a while to get there and lots of fancy words in between. I blame Marie.

M: I feel smarter.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Don’t ask me to repeat anything you just said.

P & M: Laugh.

M: But I feel smarter.

P: So, if any of our listeners want to go forth. I’ll get I’ll get this in the show notes. But you can look up Wim Hof and have a look at some of his stuff. They have been researching these claims in the last five years, and out of this research has come treatments for epilepsy. They insert, like a pacemaker into the vagus nerve, which stimulates the vagus nerve and helps people who suffer from epilepsy from having attacks. And they’re exploring this for other conditions, even down to Parkinson’s.

M: Interesting.

P: Yeah, so there is science behind this. So, the takeaway message is that if we can practise and be more aware of our breathing, we can actually breathe our way to better health and better happiness. And we did this a couple of weeks ago in one of our podcasts, where I asked everyone to do a little breathing exercise where we sat down and I asked everyone to take some belly breaths. Do you remember that one Marie?

M: Yeah. So, how much breathing do you have to do? How much like not normal breathing?

P: Laugh.

M: Visual… mindful breathing?

P: I’d have to look up some figures on that one, but it’s like anything. It’s about training, training the breath so that you can pull on this skill when you need it. So, if you feel like you’re just so pent up and you want to hit something because you’ve had a really bad day at work.

M: Because for some reason the idiots and my work are multiplying.

P & M: Laugh!

M: I don’t know if anyone else is experiencing this. Over time, there are more and more of them, I swear.

P: Laugh. We’re not naming Marie’s workplace in this episode.

M: Laugh.

P: Ugh, corporate. Corporate in general, laugh. So, if you’re dealing with annoying colleagues or just stress or you’ve got projects on or the C word is happening. If any of that’s going on, you can train yourself to recognise that and breathe in order to help reduce your stress response.

P: Definitely, yep. According to this, you can breathe your way out of it.

M: And does Ice Man, what’s his name? Wim Hoff. Talk about training yourself to breathe more deeply overall? Like, can you make this a subconscious behaviour? Can you train how you breathe in general?

P: Yes, yogis have been doing it for centuries.

M: So, yogis don’t only breathe deeply when they’re doing their exercises.

P: No, no they don’t.

M: They take that through their life. Do they breathe differently when they’re sleeping?

P: Laugh. Ooh, good question. That would be interesting. Well, it would be because there is a measurement of vagus nerve stimulation. So, you know, I would be interested to see the science behind it.

M: My watch tells me how deeply I sleep at night, how I breathe at night.

P: Aah!

M: It measures my breathing. I think there’s something, I think there’s different value in this. I know for myself that if I can tap into my breath when I’m involved in exercise, when I’m doing a particularly difficult workout. Sometimes I do tell myself, ‘control your breath, use your breath’ because that was, coming full circle, that was part of my training as a dancer, and it’s remarkable how it actually can. For me, it brings me very centred, and it makes me go. Yes, I can achieve this task that I’ve set for myself.

M: If I tried getting it in in volleyball. It would just be too much. There’s already so many things running through my head.

P & M: Laugh!

P: Which is why you’ve got to train it.

M: I think singing would be a great way…

P: Yeah, true.

M: You’re still thinking of a lot of things while you sing.

P: You are, which is why you need to train it so it happens naturally.

M: Yeah, yeah.

P: So, that’s the crux of it. And just as a finishing note, there is little exercise that you can do for this. A lot of people talk about belly breathing and how we should belly breathe and not chest breathe. We should breathe into our diaphragm, which is very true.

M: Yeah.

P: A lot of people associate belly breathing with blowing your belly out, and that’s actually not the best way to do belly breathing. The best way is to:

M: [whispers] I’m doing it right now.

P: Laugh. How do you feel, Marie?

M: Um… A little uncomfortable now!

P: Laugh.

M: But I think, yeah. I could do that.

P: I challenge you. I challenge you to try it and see how you go, laugh. There endeth the lesson.

M: Laugh. Thank you, Peter Furness.

P: Laugh.

M: Professor Furness.

P: Definitely not Professor!

M: It was a pleasure as always.

P & M: Laugh!

P: See what you’ve done?

M: Laugh!

P: Can’t take it back now. Laugh.

M: I’m still going to challenge you. Now you’ve gone the other way.

P: Laugh.

M: And I’m like… nah. Too much thinking, this is a podcast, Pete.

P: Where’s the gongs and incense and sarongs?

M & P: Laugh.

M: Exactly.

P: Laugh.

M: All right, well, I think we could all use a little bit of stress reduction in our lives at the moment. So, I will definitely be looking at breathing.

P: Yeah. Have a look at the website. See, if you can have a practise.

M: Okay. Will do, alright until next week.

P: Have a happy week.

M: Thanks for joining us today if you want to hear more, please remember to subscribe and like this podcast and remember you can find us at www.marieskelton.com, where you can also send in questions or propose a topic.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Are You Getting the Rest You Need? (E82)

30/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics

This week, Marie and Pete discuss the latest research on different types of rest, and pose the question are you getting the rest you need?

Show notes

Rest Quiz – What type of rest are you not getting?

Go to: https://www.drdaltonsmith.com/ and complete the free Rest Quiz on Dr Dalton’s website

Physical rest
Mental rest
Sensory rest
Creative rest
Emotional rest
Social rest
Spiritual rest

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: Hi, hi, hi 😊

M: How’s this for country hospitality. I ran away from Sydney just before the latest lockdown and have joined my husband, who’s been working up in Tamworth, which is in regional New South Wales in Australia. And instead of knocking on our door during these covid times, I got a handwritten note from our local Mormon.

P: Yep.

M: Inviting me to join them.

P: I’ve heard of this! Laugh. I like it, I think it’s funny.

M: Country hospitality, laugh!

P: Exactly. Good on them for being adaptive. I think it’s great. I think we should take note.

M: Absolutely, a handwritten note and in beautiful cursive writing. I was like wow.

P: There we go.

M: Nice, laugh.

P: But we know that church is good for us because Self-care is church for non-believers.

M: Absolutely. The rituals that church provides, absolutely.

P: Or did provide, yes.

M: Yeah. Or does for those who attend, Yep.

P: But we’re not talking about church this week, what are we talking about this week, Marie?

M: Rest! I’m tired, Pete!

P: Laugh.

M: Always tired.

P: Have a rest and a lie down.

M: Ah, that’s a really good point. A while ago, if people said they were tired, maybe, you know, have a cup of tea and then go to bed.

P: Absolutely.

M: So really, sleep is the way that we have always thought to solve that question of tiredness.

P: Mmm.

M: But today we’re going to talk about how sleep alone isn’t enough.

P: Oh!

M: And there’s so much more to rest than maybe we’ve been led to believe in the past. And we’re really taking a lot of the tips and hints and research in today’s episode from Dr. Saundra Dalton-Smith. She has just written a book called Sacred Rest: Recover Your Life, Renew Your Energy, Restore Your Sanity.

P:That’s a New Age slogan right there, laugh!

M: It sure is.

P: Now Marie, having known you for a little while, I reckon if I had read that out to you about three years ago, you would have scoffed and walked off.

M: Yeah. What a waste of money. Why would I buy that?

P: Laugh!

M: I’m gonna take my $10 and by a martini, thank you.

P & M: Laughter!

P: How we have changed, laugh!

M: Absolutely.

P: So, what does Dr. Saundra have to say about rest?

M: She says that there are seven types of rest and that really between all seven. If you take care of all seven types of rest, that impacts how you show up in the world. It impacts how you get out of bed.

P: Mmm.

M: It impacts your mood throughout the day. It impacts whether or not you drop after lunch.

P: Oh, so true!

M: It impacts whether you’re tired at night. You know, the first one to go home after a good night out with friends, it impacts your happiness levels as well.

P: Mmm.

M: So, in impacts how you show up each and every day.

P: Yeah, What I like about this approach as well is that she’s not just looking as sleep as being the only factor that’s at play here. There are so many factors that affect our sleep.

M: Yeah.

P: And what I think this this premise does is it addresses some of those lifestyle characteristics that contribute ultimately to our sleep. We know that a one-hour loss in sleep results in a 30% drop in immune function. That’s my little catchphrase from some of the stuff that I’ve read. What I like, about what Dr. Saundra is talking about is there’s always other elements in there which we can address as rest.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And changing our lifestyle habits, that really does have an impact on how we get to sleep in the positive.

M: It’s all interlinked, isn’t it?

P: Yeah, so much.

M: And so for me, with my medical history, I’ve had a long and bumpy ride with food allergies and food intolerances, and it is amazing to me how much my sleep quality is impacted by what I eat. Now that’s not everyone and that obviously we all have our own issues, and you know what you know, and you think it applies to other people.

P: Laugh.

M: When people have sleep issues, I’m like, Have you looked at your diet?

P & M: Laugh!

M: There are many reasons why we might not be getting a great night’s sleep. But for me back again and three years ago, I may not have been saying this either.

P: Laugh.

M: Mind and body are just so interlinked and everything is part of the same ecosystem. I’ve just written an article on my blog on gut health, actually, and how that your happiness.

P: Oh, yes. Yes.

M: So, I’ve got a great quote and then we’ll go into the seven types because I know everyone’s just wanting to know what seven types we’ve spoken about are.

P: Laugh.

M: So, a quote from Dr. Saundra, she says “Rest is not simply the cessation of activity, the core of rest has to be restorative.”

P: Oh.

M: And that really opens everything up to more than sleep, right?

P: Mmm, it does.

M: Which is exactly what we’ve been saying.

P: Yeah.

M: All right, so we’ll start with the first one physical rest.

P: Mmm, you need to take a break. This one applies to me actually.

M: This one is the one that we’re probably going to spend the least amount of time on is the most self-evident. There are two types of physical rest. One is passive, which is sleep.

P: Yep. Easy.

M: Right? Lay down, sleep, physical rest, tick.

P: Yep.

M: The other is an active physical rest, and this includes things like yoga or stretching or light walking. It’s just resetting your body. Gentle, rhythmic, you could probably put swimming in there maybe, gentle physical activity that is not exciting your system.

P: Mmm, downgrading.

M: Exactly, exactly.

P: She actually does list massage therapy in her Ted talk on this subject, So that’s a big tick for me! Laugh. Come get a massage, people!

M: I will do A massage over an hour of yoga any day.

P: Laugh. Ahh… good if we could get massages though… sigh.

M: Yeah. Laugh.

P: Laugh, Ok. Moving on the second type of rest is mental rest, and she talks about irritable and forgetful people, people who find it difficult concentrating at work. All these sorts of people just can’t seem to turn themselves off. What she says is, the good news is you don’t have to go on a vacation or quickly job to be able to do this. Scheduling short breaks into your day are vital. This I have to definitely put my hand up having been the person that you know works from eight o’clock in the morning, through to seven o’clock without a lunch break.

M: [Judgemental tone] Mmm hmm.

P: Laugh, this is me. Making sure that you’ve got some time where you stop and rejuvenate. Allow your energy levels to re-jig and to get some, some focus back to get some ingestion going on. Slow yourself down.

M: Slow your brain down.

P: It really helps. Yeah, it really helps.

M: Yeah, and this is also more difficult in today’s society because we are pulled in so many different directions. If you’re not sitting at a computer all day, you’ll definitely nowadays have a phone and we say we know we should turn off notifications, but so many of us don’t.

P: Yep.

M: And even when you do, you know that that little red dots sitting there after lunch.

P: Laugh!

M: You know it’s there, even though you haven’t heard a ping or buzz at you.

P: Yep, laugh.

M: So, it’s really also mental rest is about mindfulness and stopping and taking a big, deep breath. And just letting your mind wander for a bit, doing the dishes without any TV or music on and just focus on doing the dishes.

P: Mmm.

M: Or, you know, washing your hair.

P: Mmm.

M: There’s many activities during the day that we add unnecessary noise into. And our mind is just being bombarded with stuff and noise and sensory input.

P: Information overload.

M: Yeah, let your mind focus on one task or on no task.

P: This is where the cup of tea comes in really well. Having a cup of tea is the old English way of stopping.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: You stop for a cup of tea and you sit in the office, in your backyard, I sit on my balcony when the sun’s out and I have a cup of tea and it makes you stop, lovely.

M: So, this fits well into number three, which is sensory rest.

P: Mmm.

M: So, you’ve got mental rest, that’s really stopping your mind from having to think.

P: Yep.

M: But just as important. And this one really made me look at my habits.

P: Yeah.

M: I would finish a long day at work. So, I get up, I try and get some exercise in then do some writing or you know, editing the podcast or blog writing.

P: Mmm.

M: All of that kind of stuff and then I start a 10-hour workday.

P: Yeah, woah.

M: And so, at the end of the day, all I want to do is crash in front of the TV, and that doesn’t take into account the fact that you can overload on sensory input.

P: Yeah.

M: So, at the end of the day, what my brain needed was a book, or for me to have a shower and wash my hair or for me to do something that was really not going to continue to overload me from a sensory perspective.

P: Yeah, I was going to say that that sensory stimulation is coming in through your eyes, like that light pollution that we talked about before.

M: And it is. So, you sit yourself down in front of the TV and your brain is like, Oh, gosh more.

P: Again!

M: So, while you might be sort of zoning out in front of it, your brain is still processing all of those images and noises.

P: Yep.

M: Plus, you know, the dog wants to be let out for a walk and is scratching at the door, and your kids are not going to bed. And you know your husband’s asking when dinner will be ready.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Like all of this stuff, the life stuff that adds to sensory input. And it’s really important to find some time away from all of that sensory input and get your sensory rest.

P: Yep, schedule it.

M: And then find the time. So, just to be clear, that’s no devices, no noise, no screens and no people, either. No demands on your mind.

P: Oh really? Oh.

M: This is really about shutting down, and meditation would be great, just going into the garden or just somewhere that you can really reduce your five senses.

P: Mmm.

M: Reduce the assault on those five senses and just take some quiet time. And it could be 20 minutes once a week if that’s all you can manage.

P: Yep.

M: It doesn’t have to be daily, but do you find time to, to shut down all that sensory input sometimes.

P: I like it.

M: Number four, Pete?

P: Number four, creative rest. Ah hah, creative rest is about happiness. It’s about having fun! It’s a little bit of activation, in a way. Creative rest is about taking inspiration, finding awe, so remembering the first time that you walked and saw a cliff face into the ocean. For me I’ve got images of Southern Italy with my niece and doing a trek and getting to this nunnery that looked out over this blue, blue ocean. That is creative rest.

M: Mmm.

P: That is inspiring awe and wonder and allowing yourself to take in some beauty and revel in that moment.

M: The easiest way to get this is to just get out into nature, isn’t it?

P: Yeah, she talks about that a lot, and she says that’s not the only way. But it’s the easiest, the easiest way because it makes you stop. It makes you breathe. It makes you pause because you’re in front of this incredible scenery.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And what Dr Saundra talks about as well is having that in your daily life as well. So, if you’re around on your desk having those images up and around you make a big impact. I was doing some work recently on all the supportive things that go towards making a therapeutic environment; and being a health care professional, I was sort of being informed about all these elements, and there’s a reason why you put images of greenery and rocks.

M: And Buddhism candles!

P: And Buddhism candles, laugh, in your space because that placebo effect is scientific. It has a scientific reaction on someone’s receptiveness to a treatment or therapy. So that’s another way of gaining some creative rest.

M: I remember the first apartment I ever had or rented, and I decided I was going to use red and black.

P: Laugh.

M: You know, it was cool, it was funky. I decorated with red and black, and it was aggressive.

P: Laugh!

M: I think it lasted about two days, and I was like, not happening, you know, coming back into that space.

P: Aaahhh!

M: Laugh, a murder scene had gone on in there, right.

P & M: Laugh!

M: It was just palpable the way it made you feel because it was so aggressive in its colour scheme.

P: Mmm.

M: I 100% agree with you, Pete.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s so important to get it right.

P: You know a really nice thing? Get a pot plant. Put a pot part in your workspace. It can be really small, a tiny little one, a little succulent that you don’t need to take too much care of pop it on your desk and have two and rotate them between the sun. Really good way to bring in some green.

M: I have a plant here with me in my study. And the only reason it’s here is because this is where I spend my days and otherwise the cats eat them.

P & M: Laughter!

M: So, it’s the only way I can have a plant, keeping it with me during the day so I can keep an eye on it. Laugh!

P: So the cats don’t eat it! Laugh.

M: And then at night, I close the door to my study and the plants get closed in there too.

P: Laugh. Funny.

M: So recently, as part of my certificate in happiness studies, we did a week studying meditation, and one of the –

P: Ha, ha, ha.

M: – Yes, I know you’re laughing at me because I’m still a cynic when it comes to meditation, it’s just not my jam.

P: Laugh.

M: But one of the ways you can meditate. And this is actually something that does come from studying this stuff is actually getting a deeper understanding of all the different types of meditation, and one of them is music meditation.

P: Yep.

M: And so, to this creative rest category here. A great way to get rest, creative rest, is to put on a track of music and close your eyes, sit down and really listen to it in a deep and meaningful way that you haven’t before.

P: Yep, really engage with it.

M: Yep, and that’s just a three minute exercise. And it’s part meditation, so you’re getting a bit of mental rest in there, but you’re also getting a bit of creative rest. And it’s amazing when you do it, how much you can reinterpret a song or a piece of music that you’ve known your whole life and hear new things that you’ve never noticed before.

P: Music without lyrics actually works really well for that, because it is that depriving of the senses. So going in like a violin piece or a piano piece.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: It’s really easy to engage, and it’s a type of meditation. We talked about this in a meditation episode, right in the very beginning I think it was, Marie.

M: I wasn’t listening back then.

P: Laughter!

M: That was your show, laugh.

P: Delete, laugh. Anyway.

M: I did it cause Pete wanted to do an episode on meditation and I was like ‘why?’

P: Laugh!

M: And I have to say for everyone out there listening, meditation has so much research, so much research into the benefits for you, particularly in today’s day and age, which is, you know, as we just said, such a sensory overload kind of world. So, it is not that I am arguing against the validity of it as a way to increase your health and wellness. What I’m saying is, it just doesn’t work for me. I haven’t really found my type of meditation.

P: You’ll get there, oh budding grasshopper.

M: Laugh.

P: Emotional rest.

M: Yes, number five, emotional rest. Find a good friend. Well, you know, a therapist.

P: Laugh.

M: Find a good friend or therapist, be authentic and vulnerable with and let your guard down.

P: Mmm.

M: And really, there’s still so much more research. I was just reading another piece of research that was in an article today on psychology today again saying that close relationships are so important and there’s so many reasons why and this is one of them.

P: Mmm.

M: Emotional rest, if you are constantly wearing a mask, you cannot let go or be the true you.

P: No authenticity.

M: Yeah, and sometimes it’s dangerous for you to be the real you. The environment you’re in would not allow that.

P: Yep.

M: Other times it’s emotional or mental barriers and scarring from, you know, growing up. There’s a lot that can play into this. So, we’re not saying that you have to all of a sudden come out or be authentic, but it’s worth understanding that that lack of authenticity in your life has a huge impact on your mental well-being.

P: Mmm.

M: We did also do an episode on this before, Pete.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: And really, if you can keep searching for your tribe, the people that you can find who you can be authentic around.

P: Mmm.

M: People like Pete.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Who love you for who you are.

P: Aww, stop it I’m going to cry.

M: Aww.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Then that provides so much emotional support and so many benefits outside of rest, which is what we’re talking about now. But so many benefits in so many different ways.

P: Yep, definitely.

M: So keep searching for your tribe if you haven’t yet found those people and make sure you spend the time because it takes a good 2 to 3 years to make that deep friendship and time and effort over time to do that.

P: Yep, mmm.

M: So don’t give up too early on people either. But keep looking, because the benefits when you find your tribe are amazing.

M: Number six-

P: Last one.

M: – is social rest.

P: Oh, missed that one.

M: And this one is big for me.

P: Mmm.

M: So if you’re an introvert. Social rest is so important and you’ll crave it and fight for it and hopefully protect it as much as you can, fight for it. And this is really about getting away from negative people and spending time with people who renew your energy rather than take it. And in a work environment, when things are stressful, a lot of the time we can spend 40 hours a week or more around people that we’d rather not prefer to spend time with, and oftentimes around people who are negative.

P: Yeah, it’s a hard one, but it’s really important.

M: All right. Now you can take us to the end.

P: Now I can do the last one.

M: Number seven.

P: I can drive it through the end, I’m the finisher. Spiritual rest, the ability to connect beyond physical and mental and feel a deep sense of belonging, love, acceptance and purpose. It just rounds it out so beautifully.

M: [vomit noise]

P: Laugh! Marie just threw up a little bit in her mouth.

M: Laugh, eeuggh.

P: It’s about finding something bigger than you, and we talked about this again about in terms of awe and inspiration. It’s finding a process of connecting with something that’s beyond. That takes your focus out of your issues, your life, Mrs. Blogs down the road who keeps throwing her rubbish in your flower bed or whatever, and looking for some awe and inspiration on a different level perhaps.

M: Is that happening to you? Someone throwing their garbage in your flower bed? Laugh.

P: No, I was actually thinking about my mother, laugh.

M: Is she throwing rubbish in someone’s flower bed?

P: No, someone’s been throwing rubbish in hers.

M: Oh dear!

P: And apparently some in the rose bushes. Apparently or alleged, laugh.

M: Geez, and she’s out in the country!

P: Yeah, she’s not far from you.

M & P: Laugh.

P: Anyway.

M: So spiritual rest, I think for me I get from helping others.

P: Mmm, interesting.

M: That, for me is a really easy one to tick off. I get that good, warm and fuzzy feeling, when I go donate blood. Or if I coach volleyball or you know there’s a whole range of things for me that make me feel I’m giving back to society and people around me and to my community, and that’s really important to me.

P: Mmm.

M: And again, it doesn’t have to be religious. A lot of people jump straight to religion, and that’s what turns them off, exploring this element of rest.

P: Mmm.

M: So, there are other ways that you can feel connected to community or to nature or the world around you. It’s just about finding what works for you.

P: Oh, lovely. So, it’s not all about sleep? Laugh!

M: No. So, physical, mental, sensory, creative, emotional, social and spiritual. And we’ll finish up by letting you know that Dr Dalton-Smith Saundra Dalton-Smith has a free rest quiz on her website that you can complete.

P: Ooh, homework! Yay.

M: Laugh.

P: Audience participation, yippee!

M: And if you do the quiz, you can get a bunch of feedback into areas that you might be able to improve on. So, her website is Dr Dalton-Smith, d r d a l t o n s m I t h . com. Really simple. I think I’ve got some rest I need to maybe address in my hectic life at the moment.

P: Laugh, we could probably all do that. So, get some rest people.

M: And stay happy. We’ll see you in a week.

P: Bye.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Emotional Reframing and Happiness (E81)

23/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about emotional reframing and happiness– it’s not about what happens, but how you frame it.

Show notes

Cognitive Reframing

Link to article on cognitive reframing

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: And we’re back again.

P: Howdy, howdy, howdy.

M: Hi, hi, hi.

P & M: Laugh.

P: I’m trying to be really nice and open because it’s a miserable day here in Sydney. Laugh.

M: I think it’s miserable everywhere in Australia.

P: It’s so cold! Eh, true.

M: Yeah.

P: Even if it was sunny.

M: Yeah, pretty much… Well, no… Look, Brisbane might get out of lockdown today.

P: Yay!

M: Possibility?

P: Laugh.

M: Everyone else is going into lockdown. So, you know, poor Melbourne back again. More areas of Sydney, Newcastle, Armidale.

P: Mmm.

M: Yeah. So, this is actually a really good time for us to be talking about emotional framing and reframing.

P: Ooh, reframing. Let me get out my chemistry set, laugh.

M: I kind of go more towards like the pretty pictures on my wall. Do I want a white frame or a black frame?

P: Laughter! Whichever analogy works for you folks.

M: Laugh.

P: This is exactly what we’re talking about reframing. Looking at things from the other point of view, laugh.

M: Exactly. So, I think what we’ve just proved Pete is exactly what this conversation is about.

P: Laugh.

M: Which is that the same event, can be perceived differently by two different people. So, the difference is due to internal factors, and it really comes down to the fact that we’re all unique. We’re all individuals, and we all bring with us a whole lot of emotional baggage, which shapes who we are in both positives and negatives.

P: What are you talking about? I’m not emotional at all!

M: Laugh.

P: She says, casting a thing [rucksack] over a shoulder.

M & P: Laugh.

M: Yes, so we all come with our life experiences and that shapes how we see everyday events and how we live our lives.

P: Very much,

M: So, we all subjectively evaluate our experiences, and we can, unfortunately, shade experiences with negative emotions because we’re seeing things through a negative lens when they’re not actually negative.

P: So true, and it’s interesting that that’s the first place that I went to when you spoke about this reframing. I went, ‘Oh, it’s about the negative, half cup full [empty]’ kind of thing. Let’s flip that on his head, but it goes a little bit deeper than that, Muz. You sort of mentioned that this is not just about being negative and positive.

M: Yes, and look, we’ve had an episode on positive affirmations before, which really kind of rubbed the cynic in me.

P: Laugh!

M: I just felt uncomfortable the whole episode.

P & M: Laugh!

M: And cognitive reframing or emotional reframing also is that borderline. But I think everyone out there knows someone who is just negative, so negative.

P: Mmm, mmm, mmm.

M: And my heart goes out to them in theory in the safety of this conversation, because there has obviously been something that has made them feel that they need to respond that negatively to everything that happens.

P: Yes.

M: And that thing can’t be a good thing.

P: No.

M: Right?

P: Definitely.

M: But gosh, their hard work those people in practise.

P & M: Laughter.

P: They’re energy suckers. If we put it into an energetic context, they are the people that just drain you physically and emotionally, and you come out after 15 minutes with them like Oh my God, I need a martini!

M: Uh huh.

P: Laugh.

M: And you feel like crap sometimes too!

P: You do! People who are aware of this energetic transference call it energy suckers. And it’s this whole thing of pulling from your belly button and they just drain everything from the bottom of your reservoir. Laugh.

M: Absolutely. Yeah. So, for those people, welcome to the show.

P & M: Laughter!

M: Good for you.

P: Can you identify yourself as an energy drainer?

M: Laugh.

P: I don’t think anybody would.

M & P: Laugh.

P: I’m one of those people, I suck… [internet issues]

M: Laugh, you suck.

P: Oh, this is hard. Laugh!

M: Um, I will apologise for everyone. I think we’re doing OK at the moment, but we are having Internet and bandwidth issues in lockdown. So, there might be some conversations that end with Pete saying, “I suck.”

P: Laugh!

M: You know.

P: This could be fun.

M & P: Laugh.

M: All right. So, cognitive reframing it is transforming specific negative events into more positive ones.

P: Mmm.

M: Which sounds like throwing out a memory and recreating it. And it is not that at all. It is not about distorting reality. It is about understanding the bias that we apply to reality and looking through different lenses.

P: Dare I say it? That’s again, the hard work. You can’t just paste something on top of it and go, ‘Oh, I’m just going to change this from an orange lens to a green lens.’ Doesn’t work that way, unfortunately. You’ve actually got to dive a little deeper into that and actually do the work of understanding. And that can be confronting because that brings into play your biases, your prejudices, all those conditional elements that can go right back to your childhood.

M: Oh, absolutely. And that oftentimes are formed in your childhood in your early formative years.

P: Yep.

M: You know, when Sallie Mae dumped you in front of the football team.

P: Laugh!

M: That sticks with you, that hurt. It’s embarrassing. And it’s part of how you’ll relate to other women moving forward.

P: Mmm.

M: Things like that, for instance.

P: Yeah, definitely.

M: I don’t know why I went there specifically.

P: Sally Mae, what a mole.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Mole.

P: Laugh.

M: Alright, so from Sallie Mae, we’re going to jump to Lester Levenson. I’m going to tell a little story. There was a gentleman called Lester Levenson, and at the age of 42 he found himself in hospital following his second heart attack.

P: Oof.

M: And the doctors pretty much said, ‘you might have a couple of weeks to live.’ And with no, no additional hope to give him.

P: Mmm.

M: He had major liver problems, ulcers and was also depressed, so he was sent home for bed rest and pretty much told to prepare for the end.

P: Okay, all right, yep.

M: And so, he got home and you know, he was obviously very depressed and contemplating suicide, and that, that really is a shock to the system. That type of thing, right?

P: Mmm.

M: So, he was contemplating life and death and realised that he had so much knowledge that he gained over his 42 years of life. He had been a successful person in life, but he had no knowledge about how to live a good life. And what living a good life meant.

P: Ah. He was following the formula.

M: He had this realisation that, Yep.

P: Laugh.

M: He’d gone to work. He was a typical, I think 1950s or 60s man who had the promising career and a lot of stress and none of the tools at that stage to discuss emotions as many men in that generation, also had.

P: Mmm, very much.

M: And so, in that moment, he decided to dedicate what little of his remaining life he could to understanding what life is actually all about and how he could find happiness.

P: He gave it two weeks?

M: Exactly. And, you know, if it was only going to be two weeks, it was only going to be two weeks.

P: Oh.

M: But, you know, it lit a fire. That death sentence lit a fire in him.

P: Mmm.

M: And he decided he needed to know what lead to happiness and a good life.

P: Mmm.

M: So through – Here’s the good part story.

P: I was about to say we’re going down a really negative path here. Let’s bring some light and colour back in. Laugh!

M: Through years and years of research, and he found that the path to a good life is internal, not external.

P: Mmm.

M: And he started by looking at what made him happy. And he realised that through his very successful life that success has only led to temporary happiness. He thought about being loved as happiness, and we’ve spoken a lot about social bonds and relationships.

P: Yeah, mmm.

M: But he was loved by his friends and family, but he was still unhappy.

P: Mmm.

M: Still depressed. He thought about the joy of camping with his friends and the joy of being with his ex, and he found the unifying theory. So, it’s not being loved. He thought

‘Happiness is when I am loving.’

P: When you’re giving love.

M: And so, he resolved to be loving towards everybody.

P: Fabulous.

M: So, he directed his love towards the doctor that had told him he only had two weeks to live, and he sought to turn the anger that he felt towards that Doctor into love.

P: Interesting.

M: And once he realised that it was about him and not the doctor, he felt that weight lift off his chest.

P: Mmm.

M: And he continued to release the anger, moving slowly to resentment and then finally moving to love and realising that that doctor was trying to do his job and deliver news that he didn’t want to deliver either, that he felt helpless delivering that news.

P: Yeah.

M: And so, this really triggered a cascade of, uh, you know, cognitive reframing within him, which wasn’t a term at that stage.

P: Laugh.

M: And through the rest of his life, he kept asking again, ‘Can I replace this painful emotion with love?’ So, he started looking back through his entire life, and sometimes it took minutes, sometimes it took days to release those negative feelings.

P: Mmm hmm, yeah.

M: He went through his whole memory and transformed his anger to love for all people. And then once he practised that and spent all this time doing that, he’s developed the ability just like training a muscle to do it in the moment.

P: Uh, yeah, that’s a gift. That’s such a gift. And there are people like that who are out there who have this innate ability to look at a situation and go hang on pause. Take the emotion out of it. Let’s look at that a bit more objectively and they turn the situation around. They turn the emotion around and they stop their emotions from ruling their consciousness. And I think that’s the crux of what we’re talking about here. It’s like, Let’s just pause. Let’s not react. Let’s address.

M: Yep, absolutely. So in a way, he healed his heart.

P: Mmm.

M: That broken heart.

P: Laugh. Yeah, though it’s interesting, Marie, because you’re saying he had a two week sentence. And yet now you’re talking about the rest of his life. I mean, how much longer did he live for?

M: So, he did heal his heart and as he let go of that negativity and that anger and resentment and other people and all the things that they had wronged him with. And the things they did wrong at work and the bus driver who was late and all of that. He eventually became a spiritual teacher on all of this, and he died in his eighties.

P: No way.

M: So, almost twice as long as he had previously lived.

P: That’s great.

M: So, he was 42 when the doctor gave him a few weeks to live.

P: Goodness.

M: And we’ve spoken before about happiness, and one of the biggest blockers or stoppers of happiness is negativity and negative events.

P: Oh yeah, oh yeah.

M: And negative affect and if you’re in that spiral and circle of negativity, it’s really hard to be happy. And so, what Lester Levenson did was create a whole movement and books and followers and really kick-started cognitive reframing.

P: Yeah, wow.

M: And he did that by asking himself. So, his technique about reframing is,

‘Can I change this negative feeling into a positive one?’

‘Can I change this feeling of X into a feeling of Y?’

P: Yeah.

M: When he looked at his doctor? ‘Can I change this feeling of anger towards the doctor who gave me information that was bad –

P: Negative and horrible.

M: – to a feeling of love?’ And eventually, when the bus driver was late, he didn’t take that personally.

P: Laugh.

M: He didn’t even get upset about it because he had refrained how he looked at life.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: By doing this activity deliberately over time repeatedly.

P: There’s a really contemporary aspect of this argument who hasn’t got mad at the call centre person.

M: Oh, yes.

P: So you ring up the call centre and you’re so frustrated and I think a really practical example of this is when you’re in that moment, ‘I just want to yell at you!’

M: Laugh, mmm hmm.

P: You have to take it back and go, ‘It’s not this person’s fault.’ This is a person on the other end of the line. So, I think that is an opportunity to exercise this cognitive reframing and go ‘ah, it’s the situation that I’m angry at and frustrated by.’ I need to dial it back, bring the emotion out of it and address how I’m going to overcome the situation rather than trying to make this person on the other end of the line who I don’t even know work with me as opposed to against me. And I think that’s a really practical application of this entire concept.

M: And to take that even further, why are you angry in the first place?

P: Ah, yeah. Well, that’s more of an existential question, isn’t it?

M: Well, not really because if… Do we expect people to be perfect?

P: Mmm, yeah…

M: Do you think that the banker or the bank that you work with or the telco or the power company deliberately cut power to your house this Saturday afternoon.

P: Laugh.

M: Or decided that their technology wasn’t going to work when you needed to make your transaction.

P: Yep sure.

M: There’s actually nothing deliberate and malicious about a lot of the things that make us angry when we call into a call centre.

P & M: Laugh.

P: Yeah.

M: And it’s not about you at all. And some poor person who caused the problem is having a far worse day than you are I’m sure.

P: Laugh!

M: But reframing that into – again what we spoke about a few weeks ago with layers of control, control versus and influence.

P: Yeah.

M: When we talk about that, just letting go of the anger and knowing that there’s nothing you can do about it, especially not at the time.

P: Mmm hmm. Yep.

M: And that it’s not within your control to do anything to fix a lot of these things and that it wasn’t personal at all, that that can be really empowering. So, you don’t have to yell at the person.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: You don’t even have to try and control that emotion because it’s not there.

P & M: Laugh!

M: I’ve got a quote here from Lester Levenson, I do love that name.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s just old-school.

P: It is.

M: Especially with the black and white pic.

P: Yeah, definitely. It’s this sort of, you know, Clark Gable-esque kind of vibe.

M: Mmm hmm.

M: So he said, Lester said:

P: It’s very Buddhist Marie. It’s a very Buddhist concept as well. The Dalai Lama talks a lot about this in terms of forgiveness and how to approach conflict with a forgiving heart. And, you know, he talks about it a lot in his dealings with the Chinese leadership over Tibet and being able to stand opposite someone and still come at the situation with a forgiving heart. It’s, it’s a huge lesson to learn.

M: And it’s more than anything, when I started looking into forgiveness and it’s one of the chapters in our book, actually, just checking that in there.

P: Laugh!

M: When we started researching forgiveness, one of the things that I’d never stopped to think about was that forgiveness is not about the other person. It’s not about the person who harmed you or hurt you.

P: No, no.

M: Or whatever it is that they did. It’s about you, releasing that pain and that anger.

P: Absolutely.

M: Yep.

P: I’ve got a great quote from the Dalai Lama on that, and he says, he’s talking about forgiveness, and he says,

“We won’t often get the closure from another that we desire. This means that we must discover it on our own. Forgiveness is how we find peace, no matter if they want to give it to us or not.”

M: I love it.

P: Mmm.

M: It’s about taking back control and not letting that other person dictate your emotions.

P: Completely.

M: But you saying, ‘no, enough is enough. I’m going to be at peace with this and I’m going to move on and not let it be part of my emotional baggage that shapes and taints the way I view the world.’

P: There’s a lot of talk about surrendering and releasing that with behavioural therapists. They talk about standing in the midst of the storm and surrendering to it. Yeah you’re going to get buffeted around you’re going to get blown off your feet. You’re going to get picked up like Dorothy in the vortex of atmospheric pressure.

M: Laugh.

P: Out of Kansas, and dumped down in the land of Oz. Laugh. But if you go, if you don’t fight against it, sometimes it’s best to surrender to it and in that becomes a certain amount of peace and understanding. And with that and then out of that comes opportunity.

M: Absolutely.

P: That’s another conversation, laugh.

M: I guess. Look, we haven’t gone into the how and all of the workings, but there’s a great article which deep dives into this, which we will put into our show notes. So, the article is called cognitive reframing. It’s not about what happens to you, but how you frame it.

P: Mmm.

M: And really, how you frame your life has such an impact on your life.

P: Yes, definitely.

M: Walking around with rose coloured glasses. Even if the world is not rosy right now, it can definitely help with resilience and mental well-being.

P: Yep, hugely.

M: Or even if you’re just kind of in neutral, better than negative.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Because there is a lot going on right now and a lot of people are struggling with their mental health. So, it is really important right now for us to just be a bit more aware, more cognizant of our emotions and of things like this, so that we can potentially make things a little bit better and nicer and shiny.

P: And as the story of Lester Levenson proves:

Unhappy people die!

M & P: Laughter!

P: Our little mantra, laugh.

M: Our mantra? Unhappy people die? Oh dear, laugh.

P: Get happy people!

M: Laugh. I think we need a tag line, Unhappy people die on Happiness for Cynics.

P: Laugh.

M & P: And on that note – Laughter!

P: Have a happy day!

M: I can’t even say it, bye folks.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

Please note that I get a small commission if you buy something from my site. Your support helps to keep this site going at no additional cost to you. Thanks!

Roller Coasters, Time to Let Go! (E78)

02/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about the thrill of Roller Coasters, good stress and when it’s time to put up your hands and just let go!

Show notes

The Science of the Thrill Marvin Zuckerman

4 personality types

Adventure seekers
New experience seekers
People seeking to lose inhibitions
People susceptible to boredom

Grey matter vs. white matter

Kelly McGonigal Ted talk on good stress

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: And we’re back!

P: Ta da! Here we are again. It’s like Groundhog Day.

M: Thanks?

P: Same day, same spot.

M: I thought this was bonding?

P: Yeah.

M: But you think of it as Groundhog Day?

P: Laugh, it is. I look forward to this every single week because we always do it at the same time. Laugh.

M: Same bat time, same bat channel.

P: [Pew] Laugh.

M: We age ourselves every week, you do know that, laugh.

P: Hey, I’m 48 proud of it. I’m not quite 48 but I’m nearly there. Laugh.

M: And I’m 28 and keeping busy.

P: Laugh! I went, I went with the real factor.

M: Laugh! So, what are we talking about today Pete?

P: We’re talking about roller coasters. Woo hoo, what fun!? Laugh!

M: Yay!

P: Who doesn’t love roller coasters? …Aah me.

M: Really?

P: Well actually, we have a mutual friend that converted me from a non-roller coaster lover to a roller coaster lover. God Bless him.

M: It’s all about opting in.

P: Yeah, it totally was. I got forced. I got dragged through the gates of a theme park and hearing “we’re going here!” And I’m like, “Oh, shit.” Laugh!

M: I wouldn’t recommend forcing people who are not inclined onto rollercoasters because it can be petrifying and that could actually be quite traumatic.

P: Exactly. Yeah, it was. It was, I was that person that doesn’t scream. I’m the one that just sits there with this panicked expression on their face, holding their breath for the three minutes.

M: Oh, I love watching those!

P: Laugh.

M: Because when you’re on the other side and loving it, watching people who are petrified is just like a whole other thing that you just don’t wrap your head around.

P: Laugh. It was, Jeffrey was very good, though. He took me on one that was indoors, which was great.

M: Nice.

P: Yeah, it was good. So, it was just black. We got out of the roller coaster and I said, “Did we go upside down?” He said, “I think so.”

M: Laugh!

P: We better, we better do it again just to check. So, we did, laugh.

M: Space Mountain? The best indoor, dark.

P: No, actually it wasn’t Space Mountain. It was something, something else. It was at the MGM one in Miami, and it had it had Aerosmith playing that’s all I remember.

M: Oh! The Aerosmith ride! That’s awesome!

P: Yeah, yeah. That one.

M: Ok. Alright, I’m with you.

P: That was my first roller coaster.

M: That’s a big roller coaster, too.

P: It is.

M: So, Space Mountain at Disneyland is small compared to Aerosmith.

P: Yeah, I take it hard core. Laugh!

M: So, I’m feeling happy just talking about roller coasters.

P: Laugh. There’s a reason why Marie, there’s such a reason why.

M: There is.

P: You are hard wired for this.

M: There’s a child inside me, I’m sure.

P: Yeah.

M: Disney, roller coasters, I’m there every time.

P & M: Laughter.

M: But please explain more. So, what is the draw of roller coasters?

P: Thrill seeking.

M: I’m down.

P: Yeah, we as humans are hardwired to go thrill seeking and have that almost petrifying response in our bodies because it does stuff to our system. And by our system, I mean our brain and also a physical system.

M: I feel like it wakes you up.

P: There’s a huge release of dopamine and adrenaline [epinephrine] and norepinephrine [noradrenaline] and all those lovely happy hormones –

M: Mmm hmm.

P: – after an event like this. And this is why we go seeking it, because that high that you have afterwards is intoxicating and you want more!

M: It’s legal drugs.

P: Yep, completely. There’s lots of science and research behind this.

M: And we don’t even have to pay for the drugs because the body produces them naturally.

P: Laugh, it does. And so, it’s that whole idea of having a hit, and we want to go and get more of it. And this comes from a real primal idea of taking on the woolly mammoth with a spear. You know, something –

M: The fight or flight response.

P: Yep, completely. It’s an absolute primal mechanism, which we love. And this is the weird thing, it’s the concept of the thing that may kill us but that doesn’t that actually makes us want it more. It’s like, ‘Oh wow, cool. I survived that. Let’s do it again!’ Laugh!

M: I love it. Well, actually, there’s a lot to this. So, when I was doing public speaking training, we learned that public speaking is one of the biggest fears.

P: Yes.

M: In the world. Number one fear for a lot of people, and there’s a way that you can train your brain to see that fear as not fear but excitement and your response that fight or flight reaction that your body has to a threat can be controlled and redirected into a positive psychological experience.

P: Ok.

M: So, someone who gets on a roller coaster and who is petrified and they’re the person at the front who somehow got shuffled into the front even though they didn’t want to be there and has a look of sheer terror and doesn’t scream.

P: Laugh.

M: Research shows that people who are enjoying themselves are the ones screaming the ones who shut up wish they weren’t there.

P: Laugh!

M: And so, with public speaking, you know you’re about to get up on stage, you check that you’re wearing your pants –

P: Laugh!

M: And you’re feeling jittery, and your stomach is tied in knots. And if you do some power poses – have we talk about power poses on the podcast before?

P: Is that the bicep flex in front of the mirror of the gym.

M: That works. Yes, it’s about expanding your stance. Spread your legs a little bit –

P: Oh! Oof.

M: Shoulders up, and make yourself big and do some jumping or exercise to get the blood pumping even more.

P: Yep, yep.

M: But you could be going down the wrong path if you’re directing this new energy or increased energy into more fear.

P: Yep.

M: And the big one, put a big smile on your face, even though you might not be feeling it.

P: Yeah, fake it. Laugh.

M: Right, So yep. And you’re going to tell yourself I’m excited, I’m pumped, this is going to be awesome. And if you do that enough with that big smile on your face, which starts to release those chemicals as well the positive chemicals, you can trick your brain into not thinking of your physiological reaction as fear.

P: Yeah.

M: Yet actually, start to think of it as excitement.

P: Mmm.

M: And so many speakers you’ll see come bounding onto the stage. Not because they’re just super cheery, happy, crazy over the top people who need more ADHD meds.

P: Laugh!

M: But because they’re trying to control their public speaking fears.

P: Yep, it’s the Tony Robbins effect.

M: Absolutely. Oh, I’m not sure. I think Tony Robbins actually might need those ADHD meds.

P & M: Laughter!

M: A lot of other people aren’t that naturally hyper, laugh.

P: Well, I don’t think he is. He’s not naturally hyper, but he gets himself into that hyper state. And the interesting thing that I think Tony Robbins has clocked is that he gets his audience into that hyper state. It’s all about the fluffer Marie.

M: Oh, the fluffer, we’re back to the fluffer.

P: The fluffer.

M: And for those of you who have joined us recently –

P: Laugh!

M: – there was a whole sidebar conversation very early on, where Pete had to explain what a fluffer does.

P: Google it, it’s fun.

M: I now know.

P & M: Laughter.

M: Back to roller coasters, laugh.

P: Back to roller coasters, so are roller coasters good or bad for us?

M: It comes down to the good or bad stress argument.

P: Ah, which is?

M: That stress is not bad or good. It’s both.

P: Now we’ve talked a little bit about this before in a previous episode about eustress and I love this eustress is spelt EU stress. I kind of think of it as European stress.

M: Laugh!

P: It’s like, ‘Eustress doesn’t kill me because I look fabulous while I’m smoking in my French beret and my Jean-Claude Gaultier T-shirt.’ Laugh.

M: Insert disclaimer here about smoking. Yes, laugh. Eustress got it. And that is the positive stress and roller coasters fall into that bucket, right?

P: There we go, yep. So, you don’t have to be a CEO of a company and thrive on having deadlines. You’ve just got to jump on a roller coaster.

M: Love it, or there’s a range of other things you can do. So, this isn’t just roller coasters. You can watch scary movies, for instance, and I’m out of ideas. [literally any thrill-seeking activity!] You got anything else? Laugh.

P: Bungee jumping.

M: Laugh, there you go.

P: Bungee jumping.

M: Laugh.

P: Well this brings me to a little bit of research that I found when I was looking at some stuff behind this of a gentleman by the name of Marvin Zuckerman. And Zuckerman has been studying The Science of the Thrill for the last 40 years. He started in the 1970’s, actually 1960’s and got through to the 1970’s, and he came up with the four personality types of humans.

Now, apparently, we all fit into one of these four types, and number one is the adventure seeker, and these are the people that seek physical challenges. The second is the new experience seeker. These are your travellers, the people that go to exotic places, try new foods, have chilli. Yeah, Marie’s ticking the box on both of these.

Right now, laugh.

M: I am. Especially the second one, but both laugh.

P: Laugh.

M: If you can do them together, I’m in.

P: Laugh, you usually do.

M: Laugh.

P: The third one is people seeking to lose inhibitions. Now I find this an interesting one.

M: I don’t have any of those.

P: Laugh. Neither do I, I get naked at a moment’s notice? I’m happy, you know.. let my inhibitions loose. Laugh.

M: I’d just like to say that Brené Brown taught me how to be vulnerable. Not that I have no inhibitions, laugh.

P: Laughter!

M: Moving on, yes.

P: Moving on.

M: Those people in that group they’re got no inhibitions – oh, they’re trying to get rid of their inhibitions?

P: They’re trying to lose their inhibitions. So, these are the ones –

M: Oh, ok. I love it.

P: – they thrive on making social connections, so they love the crowds, they love the groups. They like being in touch with people or dinner parties and things like that. They enjoyed meeting new people.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Because it allows them to open themselves up a little bit more.

M: Yeah.

P: And the final group are the people who are susceptible to boredom. People who get bored easily.

M: I think I’ve got three out of four.

P & M: Laugh!

P: These people crave novelty. They crave new stimulus.

M: And so many people do. For anyone who’s ever been in a long-term relationship, you can’t tell me that you look at your partner 10 years later and feel the same butterflies and honeymoon excitement to that person as you did when you first got together.

P: Laugh.

M: It just doesn’t happen. If you do know the secret, though I’m all ears.

P: Laugh, that could be another episode.

M: Laugh, but it’s the reason why there’s a period called the honeymoon period, because when there is novelty with someone new that you click with and connect with.

P: Mmm.

M: That’s you know, I’ve just got this huge grin on my face, and I can’t talk now, right?

P: Laugh.

M: Like it’s a great feeling. It’s an absolutely amazing feeling to be falling in love with someone. But then, once you know that they never put their socks in the hamper and they like to go the bathroom with the door open –

P: Laugh.

M: Like all of that stuff, laugh.

P: Laugh, not naming any names, of course. You only have one husband, don’t you Marie?

M: Yep, only one. I’m working on that.

P: Laugh! We love you, Francis.

M: I do, one is enough.

P & M: Laugh.

P: So, Zuckerman talks about these four personality types and that, yes, we all fall in the middle of these, and you can be part of more than one. So, there is that type, but I think it’s an interesting one to put your if you had to choose one. It says something about your personality, but also something about your brain makeup.

So, there are certain – all our brains are different. We all have different ways of using our brain. Some of us have more grey matter than white matter. And I found this really interesting.

M: But what does that mean?

P: Being the newly developed scientist that I am.

M & P: Laugh.

P: So, grey matter are nerve cells.

M: Yep.

P: They are on the outside of our brain because they’re the neurons, the cells that do all the connections and make all the connections. Whereas the white matter is the axons they’re the terminals, the nerve conduction is they take the pathways through. So, our spinal cord has white matter on the outside and grey matter on the inside, our brain is inverted.

M: Ok.

P: It has the grey matter on the outside because we need all those neural connections to be firing off each other. We don’t want them protected by axons and tucked away where they can’t form connections.

M: And the grey matter is smarts?

P: …Well, yeah. If you’ve got more grey matter. So, this is why the human brain is more developed and say are primates and birds, for example, it’s the folds of our brain creates more surface area. And that’s why the grain matters on the outside of our brain because it allows us so many millions of connections, which is why our brains are so well developed.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And if you compare a human brain with a chimpanzee brain, it has less folds. So, the dexterity of those connections is less. And then, if you look at a bird brain, for example, it’s almost smooth.

M: Mmm.

P: So, the ability to have those different connections is reduced by the shape of the brain if you like.

M: What’s the name of the dog breeds that have all the folds? [Shar-Pei]

P: Laugh. Oh, is it Shih tzu, no… what are they called? Oh, I can’t remember.

M: I’ve got a dog in my head, laugh.

P: Fluffy with wrinkles.

M & P: Laugh.

P: So, some of us have more grey matter than others, and that determines our personality type, so that might determine what kind of a thrill seeker you are. And if you’re, if you know someone that is constantly putting themselves in harm’s way, this could be the reason why they actually need that sense of excitement or that adventure of nearly dying to stimulate all those lovely fear and flight responses which do wonderful things for their happiness levels.

M: So, my risk taking, and lack of self-control is purely biological and not my fault.

P: Yep, yep. Completely, I absolve you of all responsibility Marie, Laugh!

M: Shar-Peis.

P: There we go! You are a Shar-Pei.

M: Love it.

P: Laugh!

M: So, there’s an actual physical need, then, for that novelty and thrill seeking.

P: Definitely, you can fall into that adventure seeker personality type, which means you have to be going, you should be going on roller coasters lots. Whereas if you fall into one of the other categories, like people who are susceptible to boredom. You don’t necessarily need to go and jump on to roller coasters, you could just read a new book or find a new game to play or take up a new sport. So, it’s different horses for different courses if you like.

M: Always. I do have one last, – before we wrap up – one last study that I thought was really interesting. Researchers put a bunch of asthmatics on roller coasters.

P: Oh, I like this one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, laugh!

M: I don’t know how they got permission to do this one.

P: I think there were some very enthusiastic volunteers.

M: Laugh.

P: It was like, ‘we’re going to take you to a theme park and study your brain, woo!’

M: Study your asthma reactions?

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: So, when asthmatics feel short of breath, that can be a really, truly traumatic feeling and can spiral into very negative feelings and reactions and physiological reactions that often lead to attacks.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: So, researchers took a bunch of asthmatics and put them on roller coasters to recreate that shortness of breath, but they wanted to see whether or not they would go down that negative thinking and physiological response.

P: Consequential response, yeah.

M: Or whether the release of – so this is the difference between good stress and bad stress.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: -the good stress from the roller coaster, whether the release of all the endorphins and the dopamine and…

P: Serotonin. [Not scientifically backed]

M: All of that would have an impact in another way. And lo and behold, it did.

P: Yay.

M: These guys had the same types of initial physiological reactions when they were excited. So, shortness of breath, faster heart rate, etcetera, blood pressure. But the positive emotions that we’re going along with it meant that they recovered and moved on. Got off the roller coaster went and got a hot dog.

P: Laugh. It’s good. There’s a positivity to stress, and I’ll throw this one in there as well. There’s a speaker called Kelly McGonigal, not Professor McGonigal out of Harry Potter.

M: Laugh, yep.

P: She does a lovely Ted talk that talks about the positive you eustress’s and how it’s all about our response to stress and how we can use stress in a real positive way. I really will put this in the show, notes Leandra, laugh.

M: He says that every week and then doesn’t, just so you know listeners.

P: Yeah, I know…

M: Laugh.

P: But she does actually talk about the Harvard University stress tests and how they turn stress into a real positive reaction for us. So that’s worth having a little look at if you’re interested in what we’re talking about today.

M: And on a final note on that one. If you are a procrastinator, like most students, a lot of students and you wait until the last minute to get your assignments or to cram for your exams. There’s two ways to view that.

One is ‘Oh, my gosh, I’m never going to pass. I have so much to do.’

Or two, ‘I’m G’d up and I’m going to do this and let’s just power through it and get it done.’

P: Yeah, I can fly by the seat of my pants, and I can still ace this, yeah.

M: Exactly. And again, I come back to all of that positive affirmation and positive self-talk and glass are full and we’re seeing themes here Pete.

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: You’d think our podcast is about happiness, wouldn’t you?

P: Laugh!

M: Absolutely. All right, well, that wraps up our discussion of roller coasters with a resounding yes.

P: Laugh and being a former/ newly subscribed person to roller coasters, I say go for it. Loads of fun. Go with a friend and just remember, screaming is obligatory, laugh!

M: Oh, absolutely. You’ve got to let loose, and you’ve got to let go. Hands up!

P: Oh, let loose! Let go! And hands up!

M: Hands up!

P: Have a happy week.

M: See you next time.

M: Whether you should actually be letting them take up that space in your brain.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Sphere of Control and Chaos! (E77)

26/07/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week Marie and Pete talk about your sphere of control and chaos, and how to focus on things you can control or should just let go.

Show notes

Exercise in letting go.

Write down all your worries and concerns that you have right now.
Put a mark next to each one for:
- within your control,
- within your influence, or
- out of your control.
Acknowledge where most of your worries and concerns are and think about whether you should be letting them take up that space in your brain.
Read aloud the worries/concerns that are outside of your control and notice how they make you feel. How does your body react to those issues and concerns that are outside of your control? Analise them and try to look at them differently or reframe them.
The next step is hard, you need to make the decision to let them go.
Imagine putting them in a balloon and having them float away, this is hard for people who have never done visualisation before but well worth the effort.
Make this an annual event with a close friend or family member.

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

[Intro music fadeout]

M: Hey, hey.

P: And we’re back.

M: And we’re back.

P: (High voice) Hi Muz, how are you?

M: I am good. How are you?

P: I did sound like Mickey Mouse there. [Mickey Mouse voice] Hi Muz, how are you? Woo hoo!

M & P: Laugh!

M: I’m going back to the, like the thirties, the real original Mickey Mouse.

P: Yeah, the really high pitched Mickey Mouse.

M: My mind is on the steam train. [Steam boat!]

P: Yeah.

M: [Failed attempt at whistling] …

P: I’m going to let that go.

M & P: Laughter!

M: And how are you?

P: I’m going crazy, laugh.

M: Obviously. You’re in week three of lockdown, aren’t you? It only took two and a half weeks.

P: [Horror movie voice] The walls are bleeding.

M & P: Laugh!

P: I am going slightly so crazy. It’s not good for my mental health, laugh.

M: So, so far in lockdown. Because even though I’m up in Tamworth, I have been locked down because I was in Sydney within the last two weeks. So, been locked down up here. I have started growing four plants that I can’t pronounce, and I have no idea what I’m growing.

P: Laugh!

M: I have made rock cakes.

P: Oh, wow.

M: Which really brought back memories from being a child.

P: CWA recess lollies.

M: Right? They even had actual CWA jam on them, thank you very much.

P: Oh! Wow, wow.

M: It had a handwritten note with when it was made.

P: Ohh. My mum does that, ohh.

M: Laugh.

P: Memories, there so good.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Anyway! Getting onto the story.

M: We are talking about spheres of control –

P: And chaos!

M: Bah, Bow..

P: Ha, ha, ha! Chaos theory! [Extremely high-pitched voice] Everything is vibrating at very high frequencies.

M: We’re absolutely not talking chaos theory. That would be biting off way more than we could chew, laugh.

P: Yeah, laugh. Existential scientists would be raiding my house.

M: Mmm hmm. Yeah. I picture like the crew of Big Bang theory-

P: Yeah, pretty much.

M: – going “you’re wrong!”

P: Very much. But we’re not talking about that, we’re talking about the sphere of control. What is this supposed, sphere of control that you talk about, Marie? Enlighten me.

M: So, if you imagine an M&M-

P: Mmm, num num num.

M: – in the middle, so the smallest.

P: Ok.

M: And that is what you can control in the world.

P: Ok, yep.

M: And then you have an orange.

P: Wow…

M: The M&M is in the middle of the orange, right?

P: Ok.

M: This is a really bad analogy.

P: Laugh!

M: So, what you can control is the M&M, the orange is what you can influence.

P: Oh.

M: And then the orange is in a watermelon.

P: Woah!

M: And the watermelon represents everything else outside of your control and influence.

P: Oh, my lord. Are they all inside each other like a turducken?

M: Yes, like a turducken.

P: Ahh. Got it.

M: Yes. Now, where crazy things us humans.

P: Laugh.

M: And unfortunately, we are wired to worry. We’ve talked about wired for negativity wired to look out for us and our kind. And we have this nasty habit if it’s left unchecked of worrying and being anxious about things that are in the watermelon…

P & M: Laugh.

M: That are outside of our control and influence.

P: [Life coach/instructional voice] Be the watermelon. No! don’t be the watermelon.

M: Don’t be the watermelon. Leave the watermelon alone.

P: Laugh.

M: Yeah. What you should, in a controlled and measured way, worry and be anxious about is what you can control.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: And I would argue that you should get through your worry and anxious phase quickly into action rather than dwelling in a negative mind space.

P: Yep.

M: What you can again spend time worrying about is the orange, what you can influence. But again, you need to give up a little bit of control there and understand that you may be able to influence things in that sphere, but they still may not go your way.

P: Oh.

M: And there’s nothing you can do about that sometimes.

P: Ok, all right, all right.

M: Everything else. Don’t worry about it. Let it go!

P: [Singing] Let it go, let it go…

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Laugh.

M: Now, that is far easier said than done.

P & M: Laugh!

M: For myself included.

P: So, it’s be the M&M. Don’t be the watermelon.

M: Yes.

P: And try to recognise the orange.

M: I really need to work on my stories before –

P: No, I like it. It’s working for me, it’s animated.

M: – we go on air.

P & M: Laugh!

M: So really, what we’re talking about is something that, if left unchecked, can lead to people having high anxiety and worrying unnecessarily. And if any of you have ever known someone who worries all the time, it can take over your life.

P: Definitely, that obsession over… and again, obsessions are one of the elements that are outside of your control.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: They’re unattainable. Why do we spend so much time worrying about it when we actually have no control over what it can do?

M: Yep, and not only that, if you’re worrying about all of those things, you can’t control your probably not moving through the concerns of issues that you can control and getting to the point where you actually just take some action and drive it to a conclusion that’s satisfying for you.

P: So, is this a case of distraction? Are we being distracted by our external worries or things outside of our immediate control?

M: It can be that. It can be distraction. There is always the procrastinator amongst us, laugh.

P: Yes, yes. Laugh.

M: So, it could be that. But a lot of people are not good with uncertainty.

P: Ahh.

M: And so, the fear of what could go wrong stops them from taking any action.

P: That’s beyond risk takers?

M: Absolutely. Generally, risk takers and just move forward.

P: Yep.

M: That’s a very big generalisation there.

P: Laugh.

M: But it’s the people who worry and who are anxious that we’re talking about here.

P: Hmm.

M: And day to day, if you’re on a healthy mental health spectrum, people worry and they get anxious all the time. But they move through it quickly and they don’t dwell. And they tend to have enough self-understanding to know when to let some worry go and just go ‘Meh, what are you going to do about it.’

P: Yeah.

M: You know covid, ‘what are you going to do about it.’

P: Mmm, yep.

M: Covid has been paralysing for some people.

P: Mmm, definitely.

M: Yeah. So, we do have an exercise you can do –

P: Ooh, audience participation. Yay.

M: – if you find yourself too tied to that watermelon.

P: Laugh. I love the watermelon analogy. You’ve got to keep that in, that’s brilliant, laugh.

M: Oh dear.

P: I can just see a big room full of people with a watermelon and an orange and an M&M just going, “What the?”

M: Laugh!

P: Where are we going with this? And then you’ve got to start stuffing things inside each other, it’s gonna get messy. It’s gonna be awesome.

M: Laugh. Oh, dear. All right. Well, the exercise.

P: Laugh.

M: So, if you find that you are anxious just as a rule.

P: Yep.

M: Or that you’re feeling a lot of anxiety or worry at this particular point because we can definitely have triggers or things in our life, periods of our life where we’re more anxious or worried than others.

P: Yes, I agree.

M: Particularly if there’s a lot of change happening around you. This is a great little exercise. So, the first thing you want to do is get a pen and paper and write down all the things in your work and personal and different lives, all of your life, laugh.

P: Laugh, ok.

M: All the things in your life that are crappy or that are not going well or that you’re not happy with.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: So, for me right now, if I had to do this thing on my list would be: I’m not getting enough exercise.

P: Yep.

M: I’m feeling tired from work a lot of the time, you know, and so on and so forth.

P: Ok.

M: And so, you write them all down and then next to them. You’re going to write M&M, orange or watermelon.

P: Laugh!

M: In my control –

P: Still laughing.

M: Within my control. [M&M]

P: Okay,

M: Within my influence; [Orange]

or Outside of my control and influence. [Watermelon]

P: Can we just digress a little bit there Marie, and can we define the difference between control and influence?

M: Sure. So, I can control what time I wake up in the morning.

P: Yeah.

M: 100% control over that.

P: Ok.

M: I can. Some people may not be able to.

P: Yep, ok.

M: I can’t control how high my rent is. I can potentially influence it by having a conversation and seeing if someone can reduce my rent because I’ve lost my job during covid.

P: Ok, yeah.

M: So, I could influence that possibly.

P: Mmm yeah.

M: There are steps I can take.

P: Yeah.

M: Or I could move house.

P: Ok.

M: I cannot at all – The watermelon is covid a great example.

P: Yep.

M: I can’t control that, outside of my control and influence. Can’t do anything about it.

P: Yeah, yeah.

M: All right. The influence is a bit, it’s the one in between, the grey area, where you may be able to do a whole range of things that still don’t lead to any change in situation.

P: Mmm hmm. Yep, ok.

M: All right, so you are going to write your list, and then you’re going to mark next to it control, influence or outside of control and influence, and have a quick look at what the majority of your complaints and issues fall into.

P: Ok, yeah.

M: So, that’s a good just first step to see whether your anxiety or complaints or annoyances or things that are… it’s like having a million thorns stuck in your hand just getting to you in your brain.

P: Yep.

P: Right.

M: The complaints that are outside of your control read them out loud and notice how they make you feel.

P: Oh, that’s a good one.

M: And if you’ve ever done meditation, this will line up quite nicely.

P: What are your feeling when you say them?

M: Yeah.

P: Tap into that feeling.

M: Are your shoulders tight? Do you breathe differently?

P: Hmm.

M: How does your body react to those issues and concerns that are outside of your control.

P: Yes.

M: And really get to know them. Have a look at them, and are there any of them that you can look at differently? Reframe.

P: Be honest in assessing.

M: Mmm hmm. Yep. And once you’ve had a look through them and really looked under the covers at what they are and how they make you feel.

P: Ok,

M: The big work is, can you let them go?

P: Oh! …How do you do that? Laugh.

M: Once your rational brain has written them down, identified them, you’ve acknowledged the way they make you feel, but you know that they’re outside of your control. Can you let any of them go?

P: Mmm.

M: A great way to do this is with a bit of visualisation.

P: I like this one.

M: Yeah. What you can do is picture in your brain that you’re putting your concern, so covid, into a balloon. Blow up your balloon, you pop it in there and you let it go… You don’t blow it up sorry, you’ve got helium, sorry.

P: Laugh.

M: You let it go up and watch it float away and disappear.

P: Ahh. It’s like the Disney movie Tangled. When they do the lights, they send them all up into the sky.

M: Yes, yes, the Chinese lights.

P: And there’s a festival in Thailand, isn’t there where they do that as well? With, um, with I’m not sure if I’m quoting the right one is the Lantern Festival? [Magical Lanterns Festival in Thailand]

M: They definitely do it in Vietnam.

P: Oh, sorry Vietnam. My apologies.

M: I have a feeling it might be part of quite a few different cultures.

P: Mmm, mmm. It’s a lovely image because it’s a real releasing and letting it go. It’s like going into it into a big paddock and screaming stuff out to get it out of your body. I like the peaceful image of a balloon and, you know, writing things on a piece of paper and then watching it waft off into the nether lands and saying goodbye to my lost long lost obsession.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Your anxiety or something that was keeping you up at night.

P: Yes.

M: Yeah, and there’s power in writing these things down.

P: Yeah. I was just about to say the exact same thing Muz, because there’s so much power in that.

M: If Pete can do it?

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: Yeah, again if you’re prone to anxiety and worry, sit down with the pen and paper is the first step.

P: Mmm.

M: Really just labelling it, understanding it, mucking in and getting dirty and feeling it and putting a name on it.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: All of that stuff is really valuable to then being able to let it go and understanding the subconscious reaction that was maybe happening in your brain. Making it conscious and letting your rational brain throw it away.

P: Yeah.

M: And go “Actually, that’s really silly, I can’t do anything about that.”

P: Not necessary.

M: Can’t do anything about Covid.

P: Yeah. So, find your path through.

M: Now there’s a few things in there –

P: I’m going to jump in.

M: Yeah, I was going to throw to you, laugh.

P: Yeah, laugh. See we’re in sync tonight Muz.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m going to jump in because I came across this wonderful little concept and this is to do with the sphere of influence. So, this is the orange section of the Watermelon M&M and Orange scenario, and this is the concept of Sisu and Sisu actually comes from the Finnish culture in Scandinavia, and it’s described as stoic determination.

M: Mmm.

P: Now, apparently, the Finns take this as a bit of a national pride in terms of being able to display this quality in moments of great, great trial or great adversity. There isn’t actually an English equivalent for sisu, but they say the word gutsy invokes the same sort of character. So, it’s that stoic determination. It’s standing in the face of great adversity and taking action.

M: Mmm.

P: And this action may not actually be the best step, but it’s a step. It’s a step forward. So even by taking this action and adhering to it, you may continue to fail. It may still not bring about the right result.

M: You’re not selling it for me, Pete.

P: Hang on.

M: Laugh.

P: Go with me here. Come with here.

M: Laugh, alright. Alright, I’m with you, the orange, go!

P: Laugh, but it’s that idea of taking action and taking a step. And with that step comes refinement. So, you go ‘okay well, that didn’t work, but let’s change it slightly, let’s approach it from a slightly different perspective.’ And it’s actually taking control by doing actions and steps. Eventually, you reach that point where you’ve taken the right step that brings you out of the sphere of orange and into the sphere of M&M.

M: Laugh.

P: Was that nicely tied up?

M: It’s not out of the sphere of Orange into M&M. Because you still can’t change their external factors? What you are getting out of, is that place of anxiety because you’re shifting from the purely emotional, primordial, gutsy reaction to a controlled, rational thinking, proactive action, and that really can get you out of that anxious space.

P: Yes, definitely.

M: That reactionary space, yep.

P: And again because you’re taking a level of control.

M: Yes.

P: And that’s the most important part of that, that concept.

M: I love it. Sisu.

P: Sisu. Yes. Not to be confused with the character out of Raya and The Last Dragon, which Marie and I both watched this week, and loved.

M: Laugh. Mmm hmm.

P: Who was also called Sisu. [The last dragon – Sisudatu. Nicknamed Sisu]

M: Good movie, you should watch it.

P: Yeah.

M: Even if you’re not five.

P & M: Laugh.

P: There was another reading that I did around this subject, which was done by John Leland, who’s a journalist in America, and he’s written a book called Happiness Is a Choice You Make, and he talks about framing and how you can frame different ideas. And for me, this was the glass half full/ half empty scenario. Marie, you don’t look quite on board with that analogy, but you sort of understand where we’re going with this idea-

M: Oh, definitely.

P: – of looking, looking at issues in a certain light and trying to find instead of trying to find the positive or negative, find the element that you can control.

M: Yep.

P: So, there’s got to be one element in the issue, and there are lots of elements that you may not have any influence over. But there’ll be one that you do or one that you can actually exert some control on. So reframing that idea and looking at a problem in a slightly more creative or lateral way than being linear could possibly bring about a different approach, which again gives you a sense of control, gives you a sense of action, which reinforces your process of addressing it as opposed to being stuck in a circle of anxiety.

M: Yeah, absolutely. And we’ve spoken before about reinforcing neural pathways.

P: Mmm.

M: So for all of those people who are experiencing high levels of anxiety, particularly with covid, which absolutely not judging.

P: Mmm.

M: It is completely fair to be experiencing high levels of anxiety right now.

P: Yeah.

M: If you are experiencing high levels of anxiety and you let that run rampant, what you’re doing is reinforcing anxiety as a way to cope with life in general.

P: Yeah.

M: So, covid may move on.

P: Mmm.

M: We may get herd immunity with vaccines. Borders may reopen, you might win lotto. Everything will be great. And what you’ve done is reinforced that neural pathway that makes you go to anxiety as your default.

P: Yep, exactly.

M: So, for every time that you’ve gone to anxiety as your default reaction over the last year or over your life or over a period in your life, you’ve got to do the exact same amount of work on the flip side to get yourself out of there. And reframing, as you said Peter, glass half full glass or half empty –

P: Mmm.

M: – that reframing is a great way to start to break or build that new neural pathway.

P: And it is breaking that other habit. It’s finding an intervention that actually works against that negative habit.

M: Yep. And if that habit has been reinforced for a very long time. You have got to put just as much work in, unfortunately.

P: Yep, totally agree.

M: I’m going to take 10 days, 20 days, 30 days. It will take just as long to make that new neural pathway the stronger and more dominant one.

P: Yep, unfortunately. Laugh, nothing’s ever easy.

M: [Exasperated voice] Nothing is ever easy.

P: Laugh.

M: Unless you’re a dragon called Sisu.

P: Laugh! You could have a dragon called Sisu, that makes a difference. I’d do that, laugh.

M: I’d do that.

P: So, we’ve got homework Marie?

M: Homework?

P: Yeah. Didn’t you have homework for us?

M: We went through the –

P: Oh ok.

M: We’ve done the homework.

P: So, we’ve done the homework. We’re going out. We’re writing out our issues. We’re addressing the M&M and the Orange.

M: Labelling them.

P: Labelling them, putting them in a balloon and floating them up in the air, laugh.

M: Before you do that, though. Really look at how they make you feel. Say them out loud and identify the ones to let go.

P: It’s going to be ridiculous for some people who have never done visualisation or that kind of action before. You’re going to feel stupid. And yes, it’s good for you.

M: Let me just say as the cynic on this show, you wouldn’t catch me dead doing these.

P: Laugh, that’s it.

M: There is a scientific theory behind this, but there’s no chance in hell that I would be doing it.

P: Laugh.

M: I would be stubborn and dig my heels in and be a cranky old fart until I died before I was visualising stuff in balloons. I have to throw that out there.

P: We’re so doing it. I’m coming to Tamworth and we’re doing it. I’m so going to come and make you do this and we’re going to make this an annual thing. We’re going to have a balloon night once every year.

M: Although, a visualisation of balloons because releasing actual balloons is bad for the environment and animals choke on them.

P: It is, yeah.

M: Alright.

P: On that note, folks imagine balloons have fun, fun with it, and we hope you’re all going well and staying strong and safe during this time.

M: And that you have a happy and safe week, we’ll see you next time.

P: Bye.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Self-Care, Are You Doing it Right? (E75)

12/07/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about how self-care has become a buzzword with bad repercussions and ask the question, are you doing it right?

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!

P: Laugh.

M: It’s round one, Pete.

P: Oh dear, I don’t look forward to these ones and where Marie’s all, you know motivated to strip me bare of any –

M: Laugh!

P: – challenges that I might have. This is going to get ugly, folks.

M: Laugh. So Pete, you have the topic for today’s show.

P: I have the floor, laugh.

M: And I am in the other corner, laugh. It’s like high school debate team. I’m just arguing for the sake of the other argument. You know, sake of the other side.

P: As we know, in terms of competitiveness. We know that I’m a competitive person, but I am nothing compared to the onslaught that is Marie Skelton when she’s motivated.

M: Laugh.

P: So, gird your loins people! Laughter!

M: Yep.

P: Today, we are talking about, are you doing self-care, right?

M: No!

P: Laugh.

M: Or am I yes? Am I the affirmative?

P: Let, me put my argument forward first, Laugh.

M: Laugh, put your argument forward.

P: Ahh, pressure.

M & P: Laugh.

P: So, I’ve been doing some research on the social media. I came across this rather wonderful article by a woman called Brianna Wiest, and she’s in Philadelphia, and she is a self-awareness and self-understanding author. She’s written several books in the early 20-tens and early 2020’s, Essays That Will Change The Way You Think (2016), The Mountain Is You (2020) and Ceremony (2021). It’s an interesting concept because she talks about self-care is often a very un-beautiful thing.

M: Mmm.

P: So, Marie and I are both proponents of the whole hygge concept that getting yourself into pyjamas, having a nice cup of tea, watching some Disney or something indulgent is really fantastic. We both agree on that, yep?

M: We even wrote a book on self-care Pete?

P & M: Laughter.

M: Why don’t we just go back a little bit further? Laugh.

P: Ok, we agree that things that are a little bit indulgent are good for us to do because they do contribute to our happiness, and it is good to reward yourself. Remember that phrase because we’re going to come back to that. It is good to reward yourself.

M: Hmm.

P: What I like about what Brianna is talking about is that there’s a certain part of self-care that is not the sitting in the bath having a chocolate cake frenzy and eating doughnuts. That’s not necessarily what you need to do to have self-care. Neither is it going on a shopping spree and spending lots of money on your credit card or indulging in over-eating snacks.

M: You’re really going hard on the doughnuts.

P: I’m going hard on it, yeah, but we’ve got to give you some fodder here Marie.

M: Laugh. Mmm hmm. So, she’s saying it’s not any of those things and it shouldn’t be any of those things?

P: It’s not the only part of self-care, and I’ll just paraphrase here. I’ll try and read out… try and surmise the article and what she talks about.

The opening statement is that self-care is making a spreadsheet of your debt and enforcing a morning routine, cooking yourself healthy meals and no longer just running from your problems and calling the distraction a solution? So, we agree on that. We’ve talked about that before. It’s about doing the hard work, putting things in place to make sure you address the issues rather than just going, ‘I’m going to tell myself to be happy.’

M: No, disagree. [Fail noise]

P: Ok.

M: Round One has started! Laugh.

P: Laugh, unpack this. Go for it, Muz!

M: I think that self-care is about listening to your body and your mind and your emotions and giving it what it needs and what it needs doesn’t have to be boring, hard, you know it, it’s framing it differently.

So doing your finances isn’t shitty and horrible. It’s, you know, looking after yourself. So, I think it’s a framing thing for me more than is it actually… like semantics, maybe we could argue.

P: Yeah, ok I’ll give you that.

M: I think that listening to your body and your emotions and all of that and going, I need to stop my diet and have five doughnuts –

P: Yep.

M: – and feel guilty about it and next time only have three.

P: Laugh.

M: And feel guilty about it next time, maybe have two when I’m needing that outlet that sugar rush or whatever it is on knowing that those adjustments and behaviour come sans-guilt and judgement and that we’re all growing and learning.

P: Yep.

M: I think that self-care is about when you’re feeling depleted in any way, as happens so often. Being kind to yourself and listening to what your body needs.

P: I definitely agree with the being kind to yourself.

M: Sometimes… The 1% means overindulgence, right? But the things you’re talking about is not. I wouldn’t say self-care is doing your finances, eating healthy, doing your exercise. That should be a day-to-day how we prioritise living.

P: I agree.

M: Not the stuff we do on top that we need to ask special permission from our bosses to leave early to go the gym… or any of the other things we shouldn’t be excusing all of those other behaviours as secondary to work or family, or you know, whatever else, your partner, it should be up there and just as important.

P: Yeah.

M: And this is the mind shift that I’m waiting to happen at the moment that all of those activities that make life worth living and make life happy and that are critical to our mental health should not be second class citizens in our schedule.

P: Yes, one of the other things she brings up is that becoming the person you know you want to and are meant to be.

M: Yep.

P: And someone who knows that salt baths and chocolate cake are ways to enjoy life but not escape from it.

M: Yes. It’s not escaping, it’s just going ‘Oh, I’ve had a crappy day, I got fired from my job and I don’t know how I’m gonna pay next month’s rent.’

P: Yep.

M: Life’s good apart from that, but today I’m eating the cake.

P: Yep, laugh.

M: And maybe having that extra glass of wine.

P: Yeah, true.

M: Yeah.

P: And this comes back to rewarding yourself and the way that we choose to reward ourselves. There is an escapism in having the doughnut, having the bath, having the red wine. And that’s, I guess my question is, is that self-care? Or is that just a momentary reprieve?

M: Again, If your definition like mine of self-care, is that it’s listening to what your body needs.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Then it is self-care, I think. Because for me, eating well, not drinking too much, taking care of your finances, being physically active, journaling, doing gratitude, practicing love, all of that stuff is how you should live.

P: Mmm.

M: Self-care is above that, and beyond that, and amongst all of those ways that you should live there are… We’ve talked about negative affect and positive affect, and I think it’s when those spikes hit, where your up or down, where self-care comes in.

P: Yep.

M: I’ve been working on a project that today has finished!

P: Oh, congrats!

M: And for the last month I’ve been exhausted just trying to get to this day. But I’ve booked a holiday for the end of this month and that self-care for me. I need that time at the end of this month to unwind, decompress and during that time I’m not going off to theme parks and travelling the world. Not that any of those are options for me at the moment.

P & M: Laughter.

M: I intend on going somewhere really quiet where I can write and read.

P: Yeah, right.

M: And that’s self-care. That’s special.

P: It is. You’re right, you’re absolutely right as well Marie. I don’t want, I don’t want to sound like I’m saying don’t reward yourself because we know that reward is important.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And we’ve got people like Gretchen Rubin, I think she’s one of your mates, Muz.

M & P: Laugh!

M: I wish she was one of my mates! I’ve mentioned Gretchen before, that’s probably where you got that, laugh.

P: Yeah, laugh. She talks about the importance of reward, the importance of the little treat, the receiving of the surprise gift or watching a funny video gained in self-control.

“The secret of adulthood, give more to myself so I can ask more from myself.” [Gretchen Rubin]

M: Yes.

P: I like that quite from her.

M: So, self-care is looking after yourself so that you can give more, be more, do more, etc.

P: Mmm. And you want to keep going into those periods where you are working hard because you know that there’s a little reward in the end.

M: Or a big reward?

P: Big reward, yeah.

M: There’s satisfaction in kicking these goals and getting stuff done.

P: Yeah. Susan Biali, who is also a medical doctor, also talks about reward and she talks about it in terms of the celebratory treats that will enhance us and not make us regret.

M: Mmm.

P: What Susan Biali talks about is that we need to choose our rewards carefully to make sure that they’re contributing and they’re not detracting. So, they’re not something that we’re going to regret later on and so that could be about having a reward that is proactive in terms of reinforcing what you’ve done.

M: So, there’s many models for happiness, but we’ve talked about relationships, purpose and meaning and healthy mind body. And I’ve been letting part of my healthy mind and body down recently, which is physical exercise.

P: Right.

M: I’ve been over indexing on a few other things, so now that we’re in lock down, I’ve got my treadmill and I’ve made myself a little deal.

P: Have you given your treadmill a name?

M & P: Laughter!

M: It does need a name, hey?

P: Laugh, Rupert?

M: I’m going to have to think about that, laugh. The way that I am motivating myself is that I can only watch Disney when I’m on the treadmill.

P: Laugh, [Clap].

M: So, I’m watching Raya the Dragon at the moment.

P: Oh! I really want to watch that too.

M: And if I want to get through it, I have to keep running, laugh.

P: Yep, like. There we go, that’s a great reward.

M & P: Laughter.

P: Oh, fantastic. Love it. The interesting thing about rewards as well is that, now Gretchen talks about this in her book as well, The Happiness Project, and she talks about the difficulties in setting rewards that may not be a good aspect, and one of the things she brings up is that the attainment of the goal and the reward marks a finishing line on the finishing line marks a stopping point.

So, you could have developed this wonderful habit of doing the treadmill. But then, if you reward yourself with something and you go, okay, well, that’s done never doing that again.

M: Then you break your own good habit. Oh, that’s a shame.

P: It’s a shame, but it’s something to keep in mind that you don’t want the reward to write you off because you want to keep that good habit going true?

M: Mostly depending on the habit. Yes, eventually, you’ll want to finish studying.

P: Yes, absolutely.

M: Laugh, for instance.

P: Yep, I agree.

M: I probably should not be aiming to finish running.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s a healthy habit I want to maintain.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Yep, so the other thing I’ve done for that. So, I take my lunch break and I make sure I take my lunch break and I’m not allowed to eat my lunch until I’ve done my run.

P: Oh, that’s good.

M: So, that’s the other reward.

P: Yeah.

M: And the great thing that many people before me have found, I’m not new to finding this is that the more I do it, the more I then choose healthy food options when I go to lunch, and you know –

P: Yeah, cause you’re reinforcing [healthy habits].

M: – it has flow on effect.

P: Yep definitely. There’s one other thing that Gretchen Rubin talks about in terms of rewards, and that’s the decision. So, reward requires a decision. I.e. Do I deserve this reward.

M: Mmm.

P: And every time we make that decision, there is the opportunity to make the wrong choice. There are too many loopholes to choose from. When you have that decision in place that we have an opt out if you like, it’s like, ‘well bugger it, I won’t go for a run, cause I don’t want to watch Disney anymore.’

M: Laugh.

P: You can fool yourself into making bad choices, even with a reward.

M: We are so good at fooling ourselves, aren’t we?

P: Yes, yes!

M: Damn human brains!

P: Laugh! So, when thinking about rewards and this comes back to the article by Brianna Wiest. What I like about it is, self-care is not just about giving yourself all the indulgences. There is a little bit of work in there, and there are sensible choices to make in terms of reward and pleasure and what to reinforce for good self-care.

M: Mmm.

P: And part of that as you were saying Marie, and I think we agree on this one is part of that self-care is looking after the body, looking after your relationships and having some purpose and that can be a little bit of hard work.

M: And if your day today is not balanced or you’re out of whack in some way, self-care is about understanding those things in your day to day enough.

P: Yes.

M: And listening to yourself enough to be able to identify when you need to change things. So, when you need to just go to bed earlier, that is self-care to me.

P: Yeah.

M: You know. For me it’s not the day to day, it is more the exceptions.

P: Mmm. There’s a quote here that I read from Brianna’s article,

“It is learning how to stop trying to “fix yourself” and start trying to take care of yourself.” – [Brianna Wiest]

M: Yes.

P: Now that’s diving a little bit deeper into addressing issues and so forth and trying to look at your lifestyle and go one of the bad influences. She also talks about the toxic nature – that may not be the best word to use – of this internal pressure of self-care. Like ‘Oh, I better be looking good, or I better do this, or I better do that.’

M: Everything is a to do list!

P: Yes!

M: We’ve talked about this before. All of this stuff that is meant to make us happier can just make people think, ‘holly molly how am I supposed to fit all this into my week.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: Ahh, it can add more stress.

P: Absolutely.

M: Yeah.

P: And that’s, maybe that’s what she’s talking about in terms of the ugly side of it. There’s a little bit of stuff about being dishevelled and doing your ironing so that you can go to work the next day and look decent and presentable for a professional interaction.

M: No way! That is not self-care!

P: No?

M: Nope, round two. Here we go.

P & M: Laugh!

P: Elaborate, Marie?

M: That’s living life, doing your ironing that is life. Doing your finances –

P: Ok.

M: – doing your personal hygiene.

P: Laugh!

M: Physical exercise, eating well, sleeping well, all of that is life, I think, and it is a juggle and It’s not easy. I don’t want it to be a seen as self-care anymore. I want it to be seen as skills that we teach kids. I want them to know how to be mindful and practise meditation and calm their minds and turn off the busy noise of the 21st century.

P: Yep.

M: I want them to understand how to control their emotions and when not to control their emotions as well. I want people to understand that life is not just about working.

P: Mmm.

M: What a sad, sad thing for your life just to be about –

P: Oh, absolutely.

M: – getting a house with a picket fence and two point whatever children –

P: Two point four.

M: – and a partner and entering the rat race and staying there till you retire. And then, I don’t know, maybe while you still can you might get on a cruise once a year, right?

P: Laugh.

M: Like that’s not life. That’s not living, that’s not life. And that’s not how to have a satisfying life.

P: It’s the checklist approach, isn’t it? It’s the tick, tick.

M: It’s the capitalist approach.

P: Ahh. Ohh.

M: It’s the consumer, you know, and you want bigger and better things along the way.

P: Mmm, mmm.

M: Pretty much.

P: Yeah, consumer self-care.

M: No, that’s the consumer approach that you and I went through school learning maths and English and all of that in order to get a good job so that we could be contributing members of society. And that meant following that script.

P: Yep.

M: I think that we haven’t to date done a good enough job of also telling kids, here’s how you also get satisfaction out of your job and here’s how you get happiness out of your life along the way and those things don’t need to stop or disappear.

P: No.

M: But there’s so much more in there and they’re not add-ons. They are not the icing on the cake.

P: Mmm.

M: They’re essential pieces for our existential health.

P: Wow, wow! Laugh!

M: They’re essential pieces of life. It’s how to live life, and that’s what we haven’t taught people to date very well.

P: So, they’re part of the recipe?

M: Absolutely. We need to add them in, and we need to stop apologising for it.

P: Oooh!

M: We need to stop as I said before, feeling bad for being 10 minutes late to work because we got caught up at the gym finishing a set. And, you know, we’ve just added all this stress and we’re 10 minutes late and no one notices. Just stay 10 minutes late at the end, who cares?

P: Laugh.

M: A lot of the time, obviously there are some places where it matters. If you’re 10 minutes late.

P: Yeah.

M: But we need to stop apologising for wanting to go see a kid’s theatre production or anything, going to get a massage and taking a long lunch.

P: Mmm.

M: If you’ve got the flexibility in your work to do that.

P: Mmm.

M: That is, that is living and it is a valuable and needed part of life and it’s not an add-on it’s not tack-on and I don’t think that it should be self-care. I think self-care is when all of that is just a bit out of whack or out of balance, and you need to take extra care.

P: Right. I like that, I definitely agree with that point.

M: Hold on, we’re not meant to be agreeing. Laugh.

P: I know, but damn it, we just, we always get to this point, Laugh!

M: This is the problem when you have two besties on a podcast.

P: Laugh!

So, I was meant to be having a relatively free week this week, and next week I was supposed to be going on a holiday, my one-week holiday for my 12 months of the year, I was going to go up to Byron and have a little week off.

M: [Singsong voice] Someone sounds a little bitter, laugh.

P: Oh, I’m not bitter… much. Laugh.

M: Right? Who wouldn’t be bitter? Let’s be really clear here, this sucks.

P: Laugh.

M: You’re in lock down.

P: Yes.

M: It’s not happening.

P: I was sort of looking at my diary going well, I’m not allowed to go to Byron, I’m not allowed to leave my house. I’m not allowed to even go to the gym. Which brings me a lot of pleasure and a lot of enjoyment.

M: Oh.

P: I’m not allowed to go for a drive in my car. It was so sunny the other day and I was in my car driving to work, which I was allowed to do because apparently, I’m essential services. And I just had the top down and I had music on, and it was sunny. And I just wanted to keep going. I just wanted to drive to the mountains like I had his utter urge. And I couldn’t do it.

M: And it’s winter, so you can’t even tend your rooftop garden, laugh.

P: Laugh, true. Well, I could have on that day because it was sunny. It was a momentary burst of sunshine.

M: It is Sydney.

P: Yeah.

M: Which isn’t really winter.

P: Yeah, we get like six weeks of winter. The point was that I looked at my diary for next week and, well, I can’t do any of the lovely things that I was going to do for myself. So, I may as well just open up my diary for work because I’m allowed to work. And I thought, oh my god this is horrible.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Like the one thing that I’m allowed to do is to actually work. So, Tuesday and Monday every week we’re really busy and I realised that I’d actually booked myself entirely out with work obligations because there was nothing left that I could do, and I thought ‘I don’t want this.’

M: You need to do nothing every now and then too.

P: Exactly, yeah. And it was a really realisation that me the free spirit is all I’m about, you know, all the buying into all this stuff on doing it naturally and I was really confronted with it with the lock down experience.

M: Lock down just makes us question everything, doesn’t it?

P: It does. It definitely does and that can be a helpful thing.

M: And healthy.

P: And questioning, re-questioning, re-prioritising, finding yourself.

M: “The unexamined life is not worth living.” – [Socrates]

P: Oh, who said that?

M: I have no idea, I can’t remember.

P: Laugh!

M: I’m so bad.

P: Laugh!

So, one thing before we wrap up here, I want to also address the idea that self-care means being the hero of your own life, not the victim.

M: Yes. No one likes a… Wait, I’m taking that back. That’s horrible.

P: Laugh! This is, again what Brianna was talking about was that it means rewiring what you have until your everyday life isn’t something you need therapy to recover from.

I think this is super important and this aligns exactly with what you’re saying Muz.

M: No.

P: Oh, oh. It doesn’t?

M: Because she’s still going with the idea that self-care is the add-on, still go on it’s a valid point.

P: Oh, no. I don’t know. I don’t think she is, because I think she’s talking about building a life, building the recipe that has parts of the self-care paradigm in its such as doing your exercises, eating well all that sort of stuff, indulging in a small reward at the end of a project. Treating yourself to a theatre experience, for example, when you’ve had six weeks of really tough work obligations.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: But it’s also about taking care of things so that you don’t need therapy from your own lifestyle. If you’re pushing hard and going for those tick list items, and it’s creating drama and creating stress, that is just so all-encompassing that you need to take a week off of the end of it because you enforced this on yourself. That’s not helpful.

M: I think it’s reality though.

P: To a certain degree.

M: To a certain degree, yes. There is a line, absolutely. If you’re a serial over-committer then assess your life and take something out.

P: Yep.

M: Look at what you can find or change or whatever. Find?

P: She actually mentioned that as well.

M: 21st century living is not smooth, it’s not linear are and it’s not predictable. And there will always be times where a well-oiled machine will break down.

P: True.

M: Just like your story for next week, right?

P: Mmm.

M: You could not have predicted a lock down.

P: Yeah, yeah absolutely.

M: You had planned for a healthy mental break from your studies. And it’s not happening. And you know, you’ve had to go through a little bit of self-exploration to work out what to do instead that is going to set you up for success next semester. Again you still need that break.

P: Yeah. So, to wrap it up, sometimes we need to be a bit more mindful of the things that were involving in our day to day life. We need to build that recipe that includes those elements of the self-care, whatever they want to be, and that in finding our ways of rewarding ourselves, we need to be mindful of the types of rewards. Make sure your rewards will invigorate rather than burn you out or be detrimental to your life.

M: Oh, I like that. We’re going to end there.

P: I got an agreement! Yes! I scored! One for Petey! Laugh!

M: On that note I’m going to wish you a happy week ahead and we’ll see you then.

P: Laugh, bye.

M: Bye.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Why Hobbies can Improve your Mental Health (E67)

17/05/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about why hobbies can not only improve your mental health but they can also boost social skills and wellbeing.

Show notes

During the podcast Pete refers to Charlotte Hespe as being a chairwoman of the Royal Australian College of General Practitioners when in fact she is the Director. We apologise for this error.

We also apologise for the incorrect use of feminine pronouns when referring to Professor Alex Haslam in this podcast.

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: And we’re back again.

P: Hello 😊

M: Hello 😊

P: How are we? How’s your work going, Muz?

M: Yeah, not too bad. How’s yours?

P: It’s, it’s bang in there, it’s back on the treadmill, you know, going hard going home. Actually I’m not going home.

M: Laugh! Just going hard?

P: Yeah, just going hard, two assignments due this week. So, bring on human anatomy and physiology, I’m already, laugh!

M: I’m kind of in a different head space where I’m trying to look after myself and have some downtime. I’ve just been running too fast for too long and I just need to add a bit of self-care into my week this week.

P: Oooh, lovely. Well, we’re very good at that.

M: Yes.

P: We’re good at prescribing that on here. I hope that we’re good at applying it?

M: Every now and then, sometimes I’m just too busy to do it.

P & M: Laughter.

M: This week, I’m feeling my resilience slipping.

P: Oh, what’s your self-care go to?

M: … Netflix.

P & M: Laugh.

P: So, you’re a Hygge person?

M: Yes, yes, yes.

P: It’s good weather for that at the moment.

M: Yes, it’s been raining and miserable hasn’t it?

P: Yeah, it’s been a good day to get out your… I was going to say galoshes.

M: My Uggs! Yes.

P: Get your tracky pants and watch cartoons.

M: Yeah, definitely.

P: But that’s not going to talk about today. We won’t talk about Hygge, we’ve done that one.

M: What are we talking about today?

P: Oooh, today we’re talking about… what are we talking about?

M: Hobbies 😊

P: Laugh, hobbies, yes.

M: And we’re talking about hobbies and the importance of hobbies on our mental health.

P: Oh, how many people forget their hobbies when they get out of school? Most people forget, they go to university [and] they drop all their hobbies.

M: I think, because when we get busy, we forget that we need those other things to create balance in our life and to keep our resilience.

P: Mmm, absolutely.

M: And one of the best things that you can do when things get tough is double down on your hobbies and sports and those other things, self-care activities.

P: Yep.

M: To help create that balance and to help you through busy times. Unfortunately, though, when we get to university and it becomes exam time or you get to work and you’re in your twenties and you’re trying to –

P: Yeah, trying to cranked it up.

M: – make a career for yourself. We drop those things.

P: We, so shouldn’t.

M: And it actually hurts your mental health –

P: It does.

M: – rather than help you achieve those career goals or study goals.

P: It does, very much. So, take that afternoon off. Go and play that tennis game or play some basketball, and I don’t feel bad about it.

M: Mmm hmm, absolutely. And it’s even more important, you know, we talked about it, university and exam pressure and then work pressure, but we’re in the of a global pandemic.

P: Yep.

M: I don’t think anyone’s forgotten that. Laugh.

P: No, not recently.

M: But it has severely impacted many people’s mental health. And a lot of the reasons why we’re not coping is that we haven’t been able to participate in our traditional hobbies.

P: Activities.

M: But there are so many other hobbies that you could replace it with. That may not be a first choice.

P: True.

M: But it’s still just as interesting and just as beneficial to our mental health.

P: Absolutely. It was very funny when my father died and we were concerned about our mother and my sister actually stepped up and said, Mom, you’ve got to find a hobby. And mum wasn’t a hobby person like she did things because she had to or she was expected to.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: She was very, very good at them and she found orchids. She became the orchid whisperer. She invested [in it]. She joined the local orchid society. My mother doesn’t like people.

M: Laugh!

P: And yet, she went over the orchids society. Admittedly, there are a couple of people that she goes ‘oh I don’t like that person.’

M & P: Laugh.

P: But you know, she took on this role of orchids and she got right into it. Now she knows people all over the country with orchids.

M: Ohhh.

P: It’s a big thing, who would have thought.

M: And you know what? She’s probably getting so much joy out of that, and such good benefits from a mental health perspective.

P: She talks to them. She does, she talks them. So, I think it’s actually really good from a mental health perspective. People probably think she’s batty, but she’s actually having a good old conversation. Laugh!

M: Gardeners do talk to their plants, don’t they?

P: It works because apparently oxygen is really good for plants, you’re supposed to talk to your plants.

M: Laugh! That would be carbon dioxide if you’re talking to your plants.

P: Oh, I don’t know, I’m not a science person! …much.

M: Laugh, then go ahead and talk to your plants.

P & M: Laughter!

P: I’ll just keep that in mind for my anatomy exam, laugh.

M: So obviously, let’s not forget that in times of stress and pressure, it is really also really important to keep regular patterns of eating, sleeping, hygiene and exercise.

P: Oh, very much, yes.

M: The four.

So eat well,
Get your eight hours of sleep –

P: Seven.

M: – or seven or nine, whatever it is that you need, I need nine.

P: Oh wow.

M: Or I don’t function. So yeah, I need sleep, yep. Anyway,

Exercise, and
hygiene.

P: Mmm.

M: Keep, keep yourself in check. Laugh.

P: Pluck and wax, laugh.

M: Not necessarily. But there’s something to be said –

P: Brush your teeth and all that sort of stuff.

M: I’ve had so many conversations with people who have been going back into the office about how it’s actually nice to put a bit of lippy on.

P: Oh, ok.

M: And to do your hair and actually feel presentable and nice about yourself. Put on a pair of earrings or something.

P: There was that wonderful movement in the middle of the pandemic when they hit last year, people mowing their lawns in ball gowns.

M: Laugh! I missed that!

P: Did you! It was every Friday, it was where your ballgown day!

M: Oh!

P: And people were mowing lawns and doing the dishes in these full-on like debutante dresses. It was hilarious.

M: I have to go google that.

P: There are images of it, very funny, yeah. People posting on social media it was great. Laugh.

M: So, if you are having a difficult time and you’ve dropped your hobbies, the research is showing that having a hobby is linked to lower levels of depression, and it may even prevent depression for some, and one of the things that people who become depressed often do is they withdraw.

P: Yep.

M: So, they stop doing things that they love. So, it makes sense to me, I guess, that what the research is showing is a way of preventing depression is to add these things into your life.

P: Get active, mmm. Definitely. There is a whole movement about this in the health circles as well. About a social prescription.

M: Yes.

P: And they talk about being the third tier of health. And it’s actually UK invention that’s been around in the UK for a while, and we’re kind of picking the ball up here in Australia. We’re starting to do it. GP’s are starting to push for it a lot more, and it has come out of a Brigham Young University report, which is about Loneliness and Social Isolation and the Risk Factors for Mortality. And this was done in 2015 and it quotes figures ranging from 30% in the UK to 50% in the U.S. of people who lack social contact, having higher rates of mortality than those who have good social interaction.

M: Oh.

P: Now the part of social prescription is getting people in touch with local community groups; that can be debate teams, orchid society’s, –

M: Laugh.

P: the local dance classes and getting people, [actually] prescribing them memberships to these organisations so they go and join, its like ‘you will go and you will be social!’

M: Laugh.

P: Can you imagine your GP saying that to you in the middle of the medical university. But the research shows that it’s actually really beneficial. It creates positive interactions. It’s a co design for non-clinical medical prescription. Black Dog Institute in Australia is very much for it.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: They’re very much about promoting it. It came about in the NHS [National Health Service] in the UK around the 1990’s in the Bromley by Bow Centre was one of the first ones in East London. And it was a non-medical referral system, the idea being that social connectedness became a community-based operation in an effort to prevent issues being a strain on the public health system. So the NHS in England, was saying, ‘We can’t deal with the influx, let’s bring in the community organisations.’

M: And this is so aligned to the positive psychology movement which says it is cheaper to have people proactively take care of their happiness and well-being rather than to fix it once it’s broken.

P: Exactly, it saves so much money in the health system going into mental health disease prevention, definitely.

M: And all that we’ve learned in the last 30 to 40 years with the positive psychology movement shows that you can take control of your happiness and your well-being, and you can influence it. So, having a hobby is such an easy way to safeguard against all of the crap that’s going on in the world today.

P: Laugh! Absolutely, yeah.

M: And whether it was to combat loneliness, like the studies that you’re showing or to keep your mind active and engaged in to help find purpose –

P: Yes.

M: – like we discussed last week, and meaning in your life; Or to help keep your mind active as you age and find a hobby that can, you know, make you grow and learn and continue –

P: Gives you tasks and new skills.

M: Yep, goal and achievement.

P: That that’s a really big way of offsetting… ageing diseases?

M: Dementia and Alzheimer’s.

P: Yes, neurological diseases.

M: Yep.

P: Sorry, I got my terminology mixed up.

M & P: Laugh.

M: Absolutely. So, having a hobby or being social, or if you can combine the two, we always talk about how they nearly always intersect. All of these activities it can be a real tangible way to avoid, they call it anhedonia, which is when people get depressed and they stop finding joy in things that they like. So, it’s a symptom of poor mental health. So, it’s about turning that around.

P: That’s a really easy measurement to check in with yourself, isn’t it?

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Am I still finding joy in decorating cakes or cooking the evening meal? Like if you did find joy in that, that’s a bit of a that’s a bit of a warning signal, isn’t it? It’s a bit of red flag.

M: Absolutely, and we all get bored.

P: Yeah.

M: Novelty is such a powerful thing. But if you do something day in, day out for years on end, of course you’re going to get bored if it eventually, unless you’re still growing in that activity and mastering a skill.

P: Yeah.

M: You know, cake decorating might be great for five years, but you might want to move on to playing tennis after that.

P: True, it’s a different skill base, maybe.

M: Or if you’re like me, just trying to keep a plant alive for more than a month.

P: Laugh!

M: So what hobbies do you have Pete?

P: What hobbies do I have?

M: Mmm.

P: Well, interestingly enough my blog, it turned into a hobby, so the blog was started as a business venture. It was started as a business development tool and for client engagement and all that sort of stuff. it turned into a hobby, I actually started enjoying reading about science and articles and then researching things in my basic understanding or way. And really, it kind of led me to going back to Uni.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Because I decided, Hey, I’m actually learning this stuff, maybe I should take it a step further and do the next formal bit, which is going into formal training again.

M: Getting a degree, getting that piece of paper.

P: Yeah.

M: It’s funny how you spend so much time trying to get that piece of paper.

P: Laugh.

M: And then you never look at it again.

P: True.

M & P: Laughter!

P: The achievement is always there, you can look at it and go ‘ahhh’ [positive sigh]

M: It’s about the journey as we know.

P: Yes.

M: About the journey of learning.

P: Yes.

M: Absolutely.

P: My other hobby is cooking. I love cooking, like I love making a meal for myself, a 10:30 at night, if that’s the time that I’ve gotten home.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Known to do a roast at that hour.

M: Yes, you have. I like them.

P: Laugh!

M: For me its writing and teaching.

P: Teachings a great one.

M: Yep.

P: Teaching brings so much joy and so much goodness because it ticks so many of the happiness boxes.

M: Mmm hmm. Yeah, absolutely. And so, the reason that hobbies are so good for our brain is that it effects the reward system in the brain.

P: Ooh yes.

M: Yes.

P: The limbic system.

M: So when we take part in a hobby that we enjoy, all the chemical messengers in the brain are released. So, dopamine, which helps us feel pleasure; All the feel good chemicals that make us want to do the hobby again and feel motivated to do so.

P: Mmm.

M: So this is why and I think we’ve spoken about the book Atomic Habits by James Clear.

P: Yep.

M: He talks about if you want to get more fit, find activities that you actually enjoy –

P: Oh, gosh yes.

M: Where maybe going to the gym isn’t your thing. But you really love having a chat with the neighbour. Have your chat with the neighbour as you walk around the block three times.

P: Yep.

M: And that’s going to actually make you want to do it. So, finding that thing, that hobby or that activity that you actually enjoy, don’t force it because you just won’t do it.

P: Exactly.

P: I’ve seen that firsthand with clients. When you give them exercises and they’re like ‘I’m not going to do that.’

M: Mmm hmm.

P: So, you’ve got to be creative. It’s like, Ok you got a baby, I want you to roll around on the floor with Bubs for 10 minutes a day.

M: Yep.

P: Get down and up off the floor. It’s being creative with that and I think that’s really important is finding that blend.

M: The other thing to remember is that getting started can be one of the hardest things when it comes to a hobby taking that first step and if you can just make yourself get there, then those chemicals will kick in that keep you going. But it’s getting yourself there in the first place. That can be really hard sometimes.

P: It’s hard to get going when you haven’t for so long.

M: Yep, absolutely. Or just, you know, to get up the motivation to just go to the gym or something. Again, going back to the more you can do to make it an activity that you enjoy, the more likely it is you’ll actually do it in the first place.

P: Laugh.

M: And then, of course, physical hobbies. If you have a hobby that can improve your fitness, there are so many benefits there, so many another thing, especially as you get older. We talked about cognitive functions, so playing a musical instrument can improve your memory and also artistic hobbies and board games and reading things that engage your brain in a certain way. They, again, can prevent dementia later in life.

P: There’s some interesting research supporting that dance is actually one of the best ways to assist with reducing the onset of dementia because you are using your brain in a way that actually includes movement. But you’re also interpreting music now that’s accessing the hind brain have got non-dominant side and that coordination of processing movement with the body. Plus, applying it to musical interpretation triggers more synapses. It triggers more involvement of the brain. And so that’s why dancing is so good because you’re using two different motor unit systems.

M: So, I guess that would be dancing in a structured way where you’re learning patterns and learning new ways of dancing.

P: Yes, yes. It is the learning of the patterns, unfortunately. Improving and going off on the dance floor. Still good, maybe not as good as learning some salsa or some waltzing or some contemporary dancing.

M: I learned the Pride of Erin, laugh.

P: Oh, yeah. You can turn the Pride of Erin into a 100 metre sprint. My sister did it at her deb[utante] ball, it was hilarious.

M: Laugh. I did mine at the deb ball as well. Does anyone ever learn the Pride of Erin any other time in their life?

P: I can still remember 1 2 3 kick, back 2 3 kick, 1 2 3 turn around, back 2 3.

M: Yes!

P: There we go! Laugh. My education wasn’t wasted, laugh.

So, just for all those cynics out there, this is an opinion and a way forward that is being supported by the medical practitioners. We’ve got Charlotte Hespe, chairwoman of the Royal Australian College of General Practitioners. She’s out there calling for the conversation to go forward with social prescribing and getting people being more social, to prevent mental health and physical health from becoming an issue and a strain on the public health system.

M: Mmm.

P: This is also supported by Professor Alex Haslam, who is leading Australia’s investigation into the social indicators in relation to health. She thinks, I can quote her saying that all the research shows that “a lack of social integration and support are the most important determinants of mortality, we found that people tend to see them as among the least important.”

So, if you’re cynical about this line of reasoning, don’t be because the science says it’s not right.

M: And otherwise, you’ll die!

P: You will die! Laugh.

M: Which is what we always circle back to.

P: You, shall not pass!

M: So really, again it comes back to, you know, the three foundations that we keep talking about:

Strong social connections;
Finding purpose and meaning; and
Healthy mind and body.

And really, a hobby can satisfy all three of those and bring all of the science together.

P: Really and it’s fun. Hobbies are meant to be fun. I challenge people to go back to a hobby they haven’t done for 20 years, if they can. If your hobby was rock climbing, maybe you can’t do that. If you’re a 75 year old person.

M: I challenge that!

P: Ok.

M: Do it safely.

P: Laugh. But how many of us have gone back to a hobby? I went back to volleyball after 17 years of not playing, maybe there’s something that we could challenge our listeners to do. Try and find a hobby that you did as a kid. It could be, choose your own adventure. Remember those? They were fun, laugh.

M: You know what I found the other day? You know those murder mysteries where you host a dinner party and you’ve got to work out who done it?

P: Laugh, yes.

M: I actually bought one at the hobby shop the other day.

P: Oh, they’re fun. I think I did one recently to be honest and it was, it was really fun. Yeah, it’s good.

M: Absolutely.

P: It’s play acting and that’s social. But you could, you could even do that in covid time.

M: Absolutely. And I think that that is the point to come full circle back to the fact that we’re in a global pandemic. And it’s time to re-engage with hobbies that you might have enjoyed in the past, or try new ones as a way to balance out the negative mental health impacts of the pandemic.

P: Yeah, I couldn’t agree more.

M: Definitely.

P: Get out there and find, find those old things that you used to enjoy, do it!

M: Or new things.

P: Yes. Say yes, you know the whole concept about saying yes?

M: Maybe we need to just have a week of saying yes?

P: Yeah, that could be a way of doing it. You never know what you’re going to get yourself into.

M: Absolutely. Or just go to Google and Google hobbies, there’s so many interesting things out there and find the weirdest and wackiest one.

P: Laugh!

M: And give it a go.

P: That could be dangerous, laugh.

M: Or find a buddy and go through a list together of 10 new hobbies that you’re going to try this year.

P: 10! Oh my lord, laugh.

M: You don’t have to commit to a whole year of doing it. You just have to try.

P: Okay, alright. Ten new hobbies for a year, let’s start them now.

M: All right. Deal.

P: On that note, we’ll see you next year.

M & P: Laugh!

M: And… That’s the end of our podcasting.

P: Laugh!

M: All right, Have a happy week everybody, we’ll see you next time 😊

P: Bye 😊

M: Thanks for joining us today if you want to hear more please remember to subscribe and like this podcast and remember you can find us at www.marieskelton.com, where you can also send in questions or propose a topic.

P: And if you like our little show we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Emotional First Aid (E65)

03/05/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about recognising emotional trauma and how to apply emotional first aid to your psychological cuts and bruises.

Show notes

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

[Intro music fadeout]

M: And we’re back!

P: Hi, hi, hi!

M: Hey.

P: Muz, how ya doing?

M: I am a bit frantic and frazzled this week.

P: Oh.

M: So I have, in response, upped up my physical exercise, I’ve been on the treadmill and just making sure I’m getting enough sleep. It’s just a busy time at work and with everything else. I’ve kind of got two jobs that I’m juggling.

P: Mmm, yes.

M: So, I wouldn’t trade it for anything in the world.

P: Laugh.

M: I’m just so grateful to have such a full and satisfying life. But it’s just a bit busy at the moment. How about you?

P: I’m good, I’m good. I’m pumped and ready to go. I excited about this week’s episode because –

M: Because this one’s all you, isn’t it Pete?

P: It is.

M: What are we talking about?

P: Well, I led with that question. I was hoping you were going to say something else along the lines of, you know, my body’s a bit sore and I could go, ‘Oh, that’s great, I can fix that!’

M: Laugh.

P: Because I’m a sports therapist and I know what to do with broken bodies, But you brought up a really interesting point because you sAid frantic and frazzled and we’re talking about emotional First Aid this week. And when someone comes to you and says ‘I’m frantic, I’m frazzled’, it’s like …crickets.

M: Laugh, mmm hmm.

P: That not good, what are we doing for Sunday dinner?

M & P: Laughter.

P: Let’s move on, laugh.

M: Yep.

P: And the reason that we do this is because not many of us know how to deal with emotions or apply the First Aid for emotional First Aid.

M: And this is such an important topic. I Don’t know why it’s taken us a whole year to get to this. But we are encouraging people to do self-analysis and to understand their emotions and their triggers and emotional baggage and to work through it, whether by journaling or by talking to other people. Yet as a society, there are so many people out there who just freak out. They don’t know what to when someone says, ‘you know, I’m not doing so well.’

P: The change is in the winds though Marie, it is changing. We’re moving away for a biological biomedical health model. We’re now looking at the socio ecological model of health and that means we now GP’s pharmacists, all these health professionals are now taking into account social issues, people’s emotions. It has become a change and a shift and 100 years ago, this change and shift happened around physical health. All of a sudden we became aware that we have to take care of ourselves.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: We have to eat well. We have to, not imbibe in too much rich food otherwise we get gout and that brought about a 50% increase in life expectancy. This is 100 years ago and the person that will be referencing today, who is Dr Guy Winch, he talks about that at the moment we’re on a different bent in that were becoming aware of our emotional health.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And people are now becoming more okay with the terminology around psychological health, mental well-being, understanding social equity and all these sorts of terms that 20 years ago, 40 years ago maybe we didn’t even know about. But now it’s so much more in our faces that’s being promoted so much more because this stuff has an impact on our mortality. If we don’t address this stuff, we die! Laugh!

M: We were saying that around here, don’t we?

P: We do! Laugh. We say it a lot.

M: It’s actually really topical because this month, May, is Mental Health Awareness Month in Australia, and I’m talking on a panel at my corporate gig in a week’s time. So I think I agree with you 100%. We are having these discussions in the corporate setting, as well, which is where a huge portion of our population work, not all of them by any means, but a large portion.

P: Yeah.

M: And corporate are also changing their language and driving change around this. They’re talking to older generations and men, people who traditionally have shunned a lot of this talk because they were tougher.

P: Yeah, it wasn’t accepted. It wasn’t encouraged in our society, for men, particularly to be in touch with their emotions. That’s out the window, now. That’s gone. The tough male model is gone, thank goodness.

M: Well… a lot of it.

P: Yeah.

M: We’re opening up the conversation. I think there’s still a long way to go, yeah.

P: The expectation, though there is now that boys are allowed to cry.

M: Yeah.

P: And that, that’s a good thing because, yes, it’s good to express our emotions. I’m referencing a very interesting psychologist this week from America, Guy Winch. Who some of you may know from his very famous Ted talk on emotional First Aid. He was interviewed as one of one of the First speakers for Being a Better Human, which is a new Ted talk series which is coming out. And his talk on emotional First Aid that he also go to Google was voted as one of the most popular Ted talks ever.

M: Hmm.

P: So reasonably well known. He’s published two books, one that we’re looking at today is his book on emotional thirst Aid, which is entitled The Practical Strategies for Treating Failure, Rejection, Guilt and other everyday Psychological Injuries.

M: So is that –

P: Do you have any psychological injuries?

M: Oh my gosh yes! Who doesn’t?

P: Laugh.

M: My psychological damage is giving me a crick my neck. Seriously.

P: [Silly voice] Ay, I got such a crick in my neck, it is such a sunder!

M & P: Laughter!

M: I’ve even got a bag, thank you from Life School, which says emotional baggage.

P & M: Laughter!

P: But it’s true we all have emotional baggage.

M: And you’ve got to open it up and dig around in there sometimes –

P: Absolutely.

M: – because otherwise it drives you and drives your behaviours and reactions without you even realising it.

P: Exactly and when you listen to this guy’s talk, it’s amazing how much it drives. So we could take a few examples today. So let’s work through the main –

M: Well, before you get started. What do you mean by emotional First Aid?

P: Emotional First Aid is knowing how to apply a Band Aid to a psychological trauma. So if you’ve had a bad day at work and your boss has pulled you into a meeting and sAid that presentation that you gave last week was substandard, you didn’t address this, you didn’t address that, I’m really disappointed in your performance. I think you need to go away and actually have a think about this again before you present it again to the national forum on next week and for God’s sake, do a better job this time. How would that make you feel?

M: Didn’t even get a shit sandwich.

P: Laugh!

M: Just went straight for the kill. I’d be looking for a new boss of that’s how they do feedback.

P: Laugh!

M: But I’d also be feeling pretty crappy.

P & M: Laugh!

M: Now in the real world, corporate leaders are taught to compliment, deliver the hard stuff and then finish it with a compliment.

P: Yeah, I missed that one. I come from the art’s, it’s just cutthroat, Laugh. ‘That plier was shit, do it again!’

M & P: Laughter!

P: So, with those sorts of traumas, that’s as bad as a wound, that’s an emotional wound. So, your ego’s taken a hit, your self-esteem has taken a hit and you’re feeling pretty low. How do you address that?

M: How do you personally address it for you? Or how do you help friends and family and colleagues?

P: Let’s take the, let’s take the personal straight away because it is up to us to look after our own health.

M: Yep.

P: And, if I cut my finger when I was cooking, I’d know to wash it, put some Dettol on it and put a Band Aid on it because I don’t want it to get to get infected. We should have that same understanding when we have an emotional wound. So, if someone tells us we’re crap, we should have immediate steps in place that we know that was a hit to my ego. So now I need to go and do some self-esteem work, however minor or free it is, or do something that’s good for myself. Rather than going and finding a bowl of ice cream and eating it all in one go, opening up the wine bottle –

M: [Longing Sigh] Oh…

P: – or going and doing some retail therapy.

M: Can we do both?

P: Laugh. That’s the point. These things are not emotional Band Aids. They don’t help the injury, they waylay it.

M: No, but if you feel good in the moment, laugh!

P: They smother it. They push it down and Guy Winch –

M: Are they part of a holistic strategy, you know, multi-pronged attack, laugh!

P: No, no. I’m going to say no.

M: Darn it, alright.

P & M: Laughter!

P: Because they just suppress the issue. So high carb – sugar rush. So it releases endorphins in your system and you don’t think about the injury. Alcohol suppresses all the all the emotions. The problem with alcohol and Doctor Winch uses this example is it’s going to come back up.

M: Laugh.

P: They’re going to vomit that alcohol back up. So, it’s really important that we have more fundamentally beneficial First Aid approaches when we have a psychological trauma.

Let’s take something like failure.

So failure is a psychological wound.

M: Yes.

P: When you fail at something, you’re not feeling good.

M: I never fail.

P: Oohhh…?

M & P: Laughter!

M: I just don’t do things that I’m going to fail at.

P & M: Laugh!

M: That’s why. No, I lie, I lie. I’ve had some shocking failures in my life.

P: Yeah, and you’ve gotta bounce back from those. So what we’re talking about here is the way that failure registers with us the mind tricks us into not being able to function and do the simplest tasks. Things like going and doing the washing, going to the fridge and getting the milk out of the fridge and you drop it and it falls on the floor and you end up in a puddle of a mess because you’ve had a hard day.

M: Laugh.

P: Those sort of simple tasks we can’t do when we have failure because our cognition and our ability to just coordinate is impacted by our emotion. The mind is a hard thing to change once it’s been convinced that it’s a failure. So, if someone says your shit, then it’s really hard to actually bring yourself up going ‘No, I’m not’; unless you’ve got really good self-esteem in the first place, it’s really hard to go ‘No, I’m not shit, I have these qualities, and I can do this, and this, and this, and this, and that’s going to make you feel better and that is an emotional Band Aid.

M: I’ve actually seen people with failure, baggage and the huge impact can have on their happiness levels.

P: Definitely.

M: They’re going to operate in society and at the smallest challenges they run away rather than step up and learn or grow or fight.

P: Mmm, yep.

M: And it’s such a limiting thing to carry around in your emotional baggage.

P: Absolutely, definitely and it doesn’t have to be a big failure. It can be a small failure if can happened when you were a teenager.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: That informs so much of your developmental understanding. And this in a psychological wound, so we have to know how to take that up and take care of it and let it heal. So there are different things that we can do.

M: Also, failure is part of life, right?

P: It is.

M: Let’s be really honest. So when kids experience failure, it’s about helping them to develop the tools to pick themselves up and try again, rather than trying to stop them from experiencing that failure because experiencing it is still so important.

P: Yes, so much.

M: And we found with the latest generation of parents who stereotypically have over parented and tried to protect their kids. And they’ve gone in and fought with the teacher who gave them the B, so they could get an A.

P: Mmm, yeah.

M: And all of those things, have had arguments with the coach who benched them, and these kids have never learned to fail.

P: Exactly.

M: And they hit the real world.

P: And they can’t cope.

M: Parents can’t go in to bat for them to get the promotion, laugh.

P: Absolutely, definitely.

M: And they buckle at the first sign of any pressure because they’re not used to stepping up in the face of that.

P: Yeah, I’ve got a great example from when I was doing my study when I was a massage therapist and I knew my nutrition lecturer really well. We were friends. We were colleagues. And we went out for dinner one night and she said,

‘Oh, so we have the test on Monday, are you ready?

And I’m like ‘No! I haven’t been able to study!’

And she goes ‘That’s ok. I’ll just throw you a question. Why don’t we eat meat when we’re unwell?’

And I just sat there going ‘I don’t know!

M: Laugh!’

P: And Kirsty looked at me and said ‘It’s okay Pete, it’s alright.’ She said it’s because we don’t want iron in our system because that’s what the bacteria feeds off when we’re ill. We don’t want iron in our system.

M: I just learned something?

P: Exactly. And do you know what? I have never forgotten that conversation since 15 years ago. So now whenever it comes up I’m like ‘ah, we don’t eat meat when we’re sick!’

M & P: Laugh!

P: It’s stuck in my brain.

M: I’m betting the science has changed since then, now we have to eat meat, laugh.

P: Oh, I’m sticking with it because I had an emotional response.

M: Yep.

P: And It triggered a memory in me, and it happened a couple weeks ago in uni. I’ve got the same thing, I got something wrong. I will now always know that DALY always stands for disability-adjusted life years.

M: Laugh.

P: So it’s there, you had those emotional responses, they are a step to learning. Let’s take one more example.

Let’s look at something which is really fun, ruminating.

The brooder, we all know a brooder, don’t we?

M: We need to redefine your definition of fun.

P: Laugh! A person who sits there and creates and thinks some things through endlessly. This is a real risk of psychological trauma because it puts you in that cycle again, and it doesn’t let you come up with any solutions again that’s not exercising the right kind of brain waves that allows you to achieve tasks that affects your work ethic and affects your achievement scales, it affects your self-worth. Because you’re not seeing any positivity coming out of a situation, you start fantasising. You start creating situations that are never going to happen. You know ‘the FBI are going to come from a chimney at night and gag me and take me away because I didn’t put the toilet seat down.

M: Are you fantasising? Or ruminating? Laugh!

P: Well, that’s the thing. One thing leads to another. That’s a serious example, though.

M: I think in a way we’ve covered this in the past with conversations about gratitude and how we’re actually wired to see the negative. The person who noticed the tiger that was stalking them was more likely to live than the guy who was skipping through the daisy field oblivious to the, you know, the threat, right? So, we’re wired, biologically wired to look for the negative, and that can really lead down a really bad path if you don’t stop it.

P: Yeah.

M: And so a really great way again to counter act that, is to bring a gratitude practise into your daily life.

P: Definitely.

M: It is so simple and easy. And it helps you to scan your environment for positives.

P: Mmm.

M: And balance that out, and might even to a certain degree, depending on what your brooding or ruminating on might even short circuit a lot of that behaviour and retrain your brain to not ruminate.

P: Science says you are right, Marie.

M & P: Laugh!

M: How about that, laugh.

P: Dr Winch talks about it in terms of adaptive versus maladaptive, so self-reflection can be maladaptive. When you become a ruminator and your self-reflecting and you go down that negative cycle and you keep looking for the negatives that’s maladaptive reasoning and that has powerful affect because it leads to alcoholism, eating disorders, increased cortisol and cardiovascular disease, so the science says, I’m not going to quote any studies because we’re running out of time. He calls it picking at emotional scabs.

You’re not letting something heal because you keep driving a knife into the wounds going ‘Yeah, let’s put this knife in deeper and see how deep it can go.’ Whereas adaptive reasoning is exactly what you’re talking about, Marie. It’s taking some time to be positive and do some real work around, trying to bring yourself up and bring yourself out of that brooding, only seeing the negative cycle.

M: There’s a great course that life line used to run called Accidental Counsellor, which I took last year, actually, and it teaches people who may be caught off guard who are not mental health professionals how to have conversations and support friends, colleagues, people at work, customers even who’ve come out with, you know, some really tough, tough disclosures at times.

P: Yeah

M: And if you’re not prepared for it or equipped, what do you say? How do you support that person and give them what they need? But then, also on the flip side, how do you not give them too much advice or coaching because you’re not the professional, right?

P: Exactly.

M: And one of the great things that we learned in that session was that you can be there for someone too much.

P: Hmm.

M: If you’re letting them talk too much, and they’re in that ruminating space, and all they’re doing is just reinforcing the negative. There comes a time where, you know, as the friend who’s supporting you need to say, ‘enough’s enough, this isn’t working. This is ruminating.’

P: This is brooding and it’s not beneficial.

M: I’m supporting you.

P: Yeah, and I’m enabling you to do more of it. Someone has to come in at some point and cut that that process off. Otherwise, we get so many health risks coming forward.

M: Yeah, so it’s not just with yourself, but with friends who may be going through a tough time. You can listen and listen and listen. And that is the number one recommendation out of this course for how to help people who are going through tough times. Listen.

P: Yeah.

M: Sit and listen and validate what they’re feeling, but there comes a point where you need to stop listening and move them to a professional or even extricate yourself out in the right way.

P: And you can do that on yourself as well, you can, listen, listen and listen to yourself talk, but there comes a point where you going ‘Right, enough’s enough. Let’s take, take some action. And if that action is going getting some professional help then that’s great, because getting that is a positive step we’re taking action.

M: Yep.

P: I know we’re pushed for time,

but I do want to mention one more, rejection.

This is a psychological trauma, which a lot of people go through, it can be rejection from a job. It can rejection from a lover. It could be rejection from a date. I mean, who hasn’t gone on a date and have someone get up in the first ten minutes and say ‘Sorry, I’m out.’ It’s like, Oh my God, I feel terrible. [Sad laugh]

M: Is that common?

P: Not if you’re married. Laugh.

M: Well, I’ve been married for 15 years. [actually, 9 years this December]

P & M: Laughter!

P: Online dating. We have so much interaction on an online sphere, and then you go and meet the person and you realise, oh my God, they’re completely not who I thought they were and I actually have nothing in common with this person.

M: Mmm.

P: So people will back out in five minutes flat.

M: Which I think is fine, but you can deliver that message in a more sensitive way, laugh.

P: Absolutely. So, let’s look at that feeling of rejection.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Now, it’s interesting. The science behind this was done using a ball game. So, I’m number one, Marie you’re number two, let’s make Francis number three. I throw the ball to you, you throw the ball to Francis, and Francis throws the ball to me.

Then halfway through this, we keep doing it, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la; And then all of a sudden, Francis throws the ball back to you, and then you throw to Francis and Francis throws it back to you. Then all of a sudden, I’m standing there going ‘no one’s throwing me the ball’. That’s going to make me feel rejected. It’s going to make me feel ostracised.

M: Piggy in the middle!

P: Laugh! As a piggy though, I’m active cause I’m trying to catch the ball. This, I’m not even involved in the ball game anymore because you guys have decided to keep it between the two of you.

M: Yep.

P: So what they did was they took some MRI scans of the person who was feeling these feelings of rejection. What they found was the pathways, the neural pathways that activated during the feelings of rejected mimic the pain pathways that we experience when we are in physical pain.

The reason behind this, when we were running around in tribes, as nomads we needed to make sure that we were part of the clan. Otherwise, we died. Literally, we could not survive as a solo human being in the wild because something would eat us or we wouldn’t be able to get enough food.

So the body developed this in our evolutionary history. This process to let us know something is wrong. We’re going to make you feel pain because you need to get involved with the group again.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And that’s a lever, that’s creating something that makes us go back to the group. And it’s really important because it can be as simple as a ball game and it can leave someone feeling out. And if we don’t act on that, if we don’t know to recognise that as ‘I’m being excluded, somehow I have to find a way to connect back in with the group’, then we are left feeling ostracised and it results in trauma such as cardiovascular disease, increased cortisol levels, all those things that we’ve talked about in terms of chronic illness and inflammatory responses which have a physical impact on our body.

M: There’s a great book called The 10 Types of Human by Dexter Dias, and he talks about this study [similar to above], and it was actually done on the beach with people playing Frisbee.

P: Laugh.

M: They talk about how this relates to other animals that are social and pack animals as well, there’s some great stories in there. But it is a biological and physiological response about rejection.

P: Yep, definitely. We don’t like it, it’s not just humans, it’s other animals as well.

M: Yep.

P: But we don’t like it, and it’s not good for us. So, learning to identify that and applying the processes of being able to go, that’s an emotional wound, let’s address it, helps to keep us healthy and better and living longer.

M: So you’ve got a few others here, loneliness and guilt, and we’re out of time. But to wrap up the conversation, I guess, on emotional First Aid, what we’ve done is talked about some of the things that can really lead us down a path of lifelong injuries, mental injuries that we carry with us and into our relationships and everything we do and really what you’re saying here Pete, if I can maybe parrot it back, is that we need to be better at identifying that and short circuiting that.

P: Absolutely.

M: Exploring it, picking at it, but not too much.

P: Yep, laugh. Don’t pick the scab.

M: Yep, laugh.

P: This goes into something that we can talk about later, which is this whole idea we came up with of emotional literacy like we have health literacy, there’s happiness, literacy, there’s emotional literacy. We need to know it and it’s identifying those markers and going ‘ah, this is loneliness, this is what we do for loneliness.’ We need to be better at that. And maybe we can talk about this in another episode about the tips behind how we can address that.

M: Yep.

P: Maybe that’s a different episode that we can do.

M: Sounds good, all right. On that note, we’ll definitely put Guy Winches Ted talk in our show notes for everyone.

P: Yeah.

M: And I’m going to go have a read of that because I haven’t yet, laugh.

P: Yeah, it’s really interesting, he presents it in a really interesting way with some great anecdotes and stories.

M: Love it. All right, well, that’s all we have time for this week. We’ll see you next week.

P: Till next time.

M: Bye.

P: Bye.

[Happy exit music – background]

P: And if you like our little show we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

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Laughter is the Best Medicine (E64)

26/04/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about why laughter is the best medicine and try out a laughter yoga exercise you can do at home.

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P & M: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha…. (10 sec)

M: All right Pete, welcome back.

P: Hi!

M: Hi, so today we are talking about laughter!

P: Mmm, the joys of laughter, it’s fun! Laugh!

M: Just waiting for you to laugh, I’m like ‘he’ll laugh!’

P: There’s nothing better than a good belly laugh I say.

M: So true, where your cheeks hurt.

P: Yep.

M: Your belly hurts but you keep laughing.

P: Yep.

M: I’m just massaging my cheeks at the moment while talking to you, laugh!

P: Your zygomatic bones, laugh.

M: [Sigh] We’re going to hear a lot more about this as you continue your degree aren’t we?

P: Laugh! I’m going to get very specific and very technical about my anatomy.

M: And I’m gonna pay you out for it.

P: Yes, you will and you’re allowed to.

M: Alright. So, last week I did some education as well, and I intended a lunchtime webinar by the Centre for Optimism, they’re based out of the Melbourne.

P: Oh.

M: Victor Perton, who is ‘that Optimism Man’ runs the centre down there and they’re doing some fabulous stuff. So if you are an optimist already, and want to find your tribe.

P: Laugh.

M: Or maybe you want to be more optimistic, I highly recommend signing up and getting access to all of their resources, but also their lunchtime webinars and morning panel discussions and night-time workshops and all the other fab stuff that they run. So, I went to a talk with a panel of experts and it was about laughter, optimism, resilience and well-being. A real focus on laughter though.

P: OK.

M: And I am still buzzing!

P: Laughter!

M: Loved it, loved it and really, for me, it kind of reminded me that laughter is just so powerful.

P: It so is, yeah.

M: And I’ve even run a laughter workshops at Commonwealth Bank ages ago. So I’ve done laughter yoga workshops but I’d just for gotten.

P: Laugh. Well you can, I mean, the thing is that if you… Like anything, if you’re not flexing a muscle, it’s not, it’s not staying awake.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Things atrophy if we don’t use them, and I really think that this comes down to a lot of the happiness work that we do. If you fall off the happiness bandwagon and those regular things that you’re involved in, you’ve got to get the momentum rolling again and often that’s the point where people choose that it’s all too hard.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: It’s too hard to be positive, it’s too hard to be optimistic. It is [hard], but once you get it going, it’s really easy to ride that curve. I had a similar situation a couple of weeks ago [with] my new position in my new job; where I, I had a huge day planned, I walked in it’s 7:30 in the morning and I’m not a morning person, everybody knows that.

M: Mmm hmm, laugh.

P: People having 8am massages! Really people, come on, get with! Laugh.

M & P: Laughter!

P: This is an evening activity! Laugh.

So, I sort of walked into work well, straight out the back, and then my boss came up to me about halfway through the day and went ‘hello, are you ok?’ and I went ‘yeah, I’m fine why? I’ve got things to do and places to be.’ And I’d forgotten that in the moment, it’s important to recognise people, be friendly, wake yourself up and use those tools of being positive and kind and all those lovely things that come with momentum. And once you start doing it; It’s like if you start the day that way, it carries throughout the day.

M: Absolutely.

P: I’m a big believer in that and that’s why the first things that you do when you get up out of bed should be something that’s actually really enjoyable or that makes you have a giggle. Put on an episode of Disney it first thing in the morning and see what it does to your mood swings for the day, laugh.

M: Well, I have something if you can’t watch a feature film before you leave the house –

P: Laugh!

M: – that might be a little bit more practical for people who are struggling to get more optimism, laugh.

P: [Singing] The hills are alive…

M & P: Laughter.

M: Or I’ve actually got quite a few friends who Monday morning, listen to our podcast and that’s their weekly reminder to prioritise happiness, which is lovely. Thank you guys.

P: Scares me a little bit when they say to me ‘keep going’ and I’m like ‘why!?’ Laugh.

M: The question is, are they laughing with us or at us?

P: Hopefully with us.

M & P: Laughter!

P: Right, so back to the point.

M: So, I’ve known for a while about the power of laughter to moost… moost your bood?

P: Moost your bood, I like that. Moost your Bood!

M: Boost your mood.

P: Laughter.

M: And it’s a no brainer, it is such a no brainer. You laugh, you feel good.

P: Yeah.

M: I don’t have to be a scientist to know that. But there is a science behind it, and it’s pretty definitive science.

Firstly, it can increase your wellbeing.
It helps to reduce stress.

One of the big ones for all you corporate people or you people starting your massage day at eight in the morning.

P: Laugh.

M: And going is stressed, one of the greatest ways to break that stress cycle is to have a good laugh.

P: Yep, I agree.

M: And the Mayo Clinic in the U. S. Has a huge range of research and riding on the positive effects of laughter and stress reduction.

It decreases your heart rate and your blood pressure; and
it can also relieve muscle tension.

P: Absolutely shaking, vibration.

M: Mmm hmm, and on that note, for those of you who know they should do more movement and exercise in their day. Did you know that a very big belly laugh is actually exercise?

P: Laugh! Ok, yeah alright I’ll give you that one.

M & P: Laugh.

M: Now, it might not be as good as a million other different exercises.

P: Laugh.

M: But it’s still exercise! Laugh. You could count that in your week.

P: Alright, Alright, like that could be 10 steps, laugh.

M: So [laughing] also has a range of other physical benefits, like:

Helping to improve your immune system, which helps you to fight illness.

One of the people on the panel is Roz Ben-Moshe, who is a lecturer and researcher at La Trobe University in Melbourne. She actually wrote a book called ‘Laughing at Cancer, How to Heal with Love, Laughter and Mindfulness’.

P: Oh, I like that.

M: She discovered laughter when she was going through cancer treatment, and I’m not saying that you would replace modern science and medicine with laughter.

P: Mmm.

M: I’m saying, in addition to that.

P: It’s not about replacing; it’s about using with that.

M: Yep, it’s a complimentary technique that can help you get through not only the physical, but the mental part of dealing with cancer.

P: Sure, absolutely.

M: There’s real scientific study that shows that laughter can be so beneficial.

P: Fundamentally, laughter releases dopamine. It’s one of our happy drugs.

M: Mmm.

P: And that’s a big one for keeping the other neurotransmitters going as well. Dopamine, it’s a big precursor to so much other stuff. So fundamentally, at that neuro transmitter-chemical level laughter has a benefit.

M: So, [laughter] is:

Releasing endorphins.

P: Mmm.

M: So that again, as we said, we know you’re happier when you’re laughing.

P: Mmm.

M: But you might not realise it also has long term impacts on your happiness. So not just the short term, in the moment, I’m laughing right now and therefor I’m happier.

P: Yep.

M: There’s also longer-term impacts to your happiness. The other piece here is if you laugh with people, then it strengthens bonds. It makes you closer and trust other people. So, in a corporate environment or a work environment, particularly for new teams that are just forming, introducing ways to laugh together as a team will bond your team a lot faster and create more trust between your team members.

P: Mmm, interesting.

M: And the teams that laugh together, trust more.

P: I like that idea.

M: Not just for crazy yogi’s, because we’re gonna talk about laughter yoga in a second.

P: Laugh.

M: So, going back to that idea, though of long term happiness. We’ve spoken before Pete about you’re happiness set point, it’s that point where you tend to come back to after good events and bad events. You just come back to this base level of happiness.

P: Mmm.

M: And some people are born a little bit happier and with higher set points. Some people are grumpier.

P: Laugh.

M: And they were born that way and they have a lower set point.

P: Laugh.

M: But laughter and deliberate, habitual laughter exercises has been shown to increase your set point. So, you’re not stuck with where you are right now.

P: Mmm, we can always contribute to our base level of happiness that’s for sure.

M: Yeah.

P: That’s what it comes down to a lot of interpretation and doing some of the mindfulness work that we’ve talked about out. Definitely, it’s a plus you know, you want your base point to be higher because we don’t want to negate the ebbs and flows as we talked about before, emotions and meant to take us down they’re meant to take us up, but we want that curve to be to be there and riding that wave. But we do want to come back to that point where there were slightly more than being just bland.

M: Yep.

P: Yep.

M: We’re only here for a short time. I want it to be a good time too.

P: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

M: Yeah. All right, are you up for it, Pete?

P: I’m always up for yoga. I’m rather impressed that you’re about to teach me yoga. I’m really intrigued by how this is gonna go.

M: So, I’m going to start by saying that laughter yoga is the new craze that has really gained steam over the past couple of decades. It’s not that new, actually.

P: Laugh.

M: And all it means is people meet and they come together to laugh together often in a park or an open space.

P: Ok.

M: That’s it. Simple.

P: Alright.

M: Doesn’t necessarily involve folding yourself into a variety of pretzel like poses.

P: But I can do that.

M & P: Laughter.

M: So, for all of you like my husband, who can barely tie his shoes.

P: Laugh!

M: You don’t need to worry about your flexibility in order to do laughter yoga. The yoga part here is more of a nod to the breathing side –

P: Oh ok.

M: – than the movement side. Having said that, you can take it in that direction and combine the two.

P: I’ve done a lot of that too, with movement therapy with happiness.

M: Yes.

P: That’s yes, incredibly powerful, actually and that can really shift emotions and psyches and in a really amazingly positive way.

M: Yes, so I would love to walk you through three exercises that I think people can take to their office, to their workplace.

P: Ok.

M: Remember, when you’re doing this, it’s worth reminding people about the actual benefits and the scientific benefits if you’re trying to get them to opt in.

P: Yep.

M: And secondly, if you are taking it to your work, it’s really important not to pressure anyone or force them to participate and make it an opt in because –

P: Laugh! I force people to exercise every day! I’m putting them on yoga mats and saying ‘do this!’ And then they forget them.

M: Laugh. They’re paying you to do that. They’re not necessarily paying you tell them to do laughter yoga in the office.

P: Laugh, true.

M: But it is, [laughter] is uncomfortable for some people to share with others, and they do feel self-conscious about their laughs and about letting go.

P: Mmm.

M: So, some people may be uncomfortable and would prefer not to participate. It’s just worth remembering that so you should do it within close proximity of them so that they see how much fun you’re having and want to opt in next time.

P & M: Laughter.

P: There we go, lead by example.

M: Now it’s also worth remembering in these exercises that often you need to start with fake laughter at the beginning –

P: This is where a lot of people find it difficult.

M: – and after a while, it becomes authentic.

P: It’s the fake laugh. It’s putting the laugh on, and I was going to come to that afterwards. It’s the fake it ‘til you make it concept, and it’s a hard space to do when you’re feeling crap.

M: Mmm.

P: And when people say, you know, you’ve got to laugh it off. It does actually work because you’ll start doing the fake laugh. Then all of a sudden a giggle will come.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And that’s an amazingly empowering way of changing your situation.

M: Okay, So the first exercise we’re going to do is about starting your day right.

So, maybe could have used this on Wednesday.

P: Laugh.

So this is a quick 60 second exercise that you can add to your morning routine to start your day in a happy mood and set the tone for the rest of the day.

P: All right.

M: So, it’s a great starting place, this one for people who are a bit reluctant to be vulnerable in front of other people. You can do this by yourself in the shower or… I was going to say while brushing your teeth or eating breakfast but…

P: That might be a bit messy, laugh.

P & M: Laughter!

P: Avocado on toast spewed in front of the entire bus stop.

M: Laugh. No.

All right, so I’m just going to grab the clock on my phone and go to the stopwatch. And what we’re going to do is you grab your phone, we start the timer, and for the first 10 seconds, you laugh out loud. You don’t have to feel it, you just have to vocalise ‘Ha, ha, ha.’

P: Ok.

M: And then you do that a few times, it’ll roll from there.

P: Ok.

M: Think of a like an acting class with really bad acting.

P & M: Laughter!

M: So, it doesn’t have to be authentic.

P: Ok.

M: So once we’ve done 10 seconds of ha, ha, ha’s, we’re going to breathe deeply for the next 10 seconds, so that’s probably two deep breaths over 10 seconds. And then we’re going to do those two steps two more times, and that will be 60 seconds.

P: Ok.

M: So that’s it. That’s it. It’s that simple. All right, so we’re going to do it now, we’re going to start timing.

P: Audience participation, I love it!

M: Can you see my phone, Pete.

P: Yes, I can.

M: Okay. All right. Ready?

P: Yeah.

P & M: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha…. (10 sec)

M: Take a big deep breath. (10 sec) And I do hope that everyone at home is following along. I really encourage you to.

P: Laugh.

M: Look at that smile on your face, Pete. All right, we’re up again.

M: Deep breaths. (10 sec) Last one.

P & M: Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha…. (10 sec)

M: Alright and deep breaths. (10 sec)

That was a bit quick those breaths and I probably wouldn’t do that normally, I don’t want you to hyperventilate.

P: Laugh.

M: But that is it. That is it. That is all the we’re talking about. And if you’re not laughing at us right now on this podcast, I don’t know what else I can do for you, I’m sorry.

P: Laughter! This’s part of the attraction of morning radio. I think a lot of people use morning talk show radio to try and have a bit of a giggle in their commute to work or first thing in the morning. It’s really important that people try and access their happiness in those first hours when you’re up, because it does set the tone for the day.

M: Mmm.

P: And who doesn’t love driving along and you hear someone say something really stupid and it makes you giggle in the car on your own and then you have that you have a better morning.

M: You do and honestly, my cheeks a kind of sore because I can’t get this silly grin on my face right now.

P & M: Laugh!

M: But that’s it. And if you do that every morning for, I think, what did we say recently? 21 days to make a habit.

P: Yep.

M: 60 seconds is all that takes, and it can really change your mindset and just put you in a great mood for the day.

P: Yeah, it is a bit of a trial, and you’ve got to get, you’ve got to be consistent with it. Like anything, it’s like exercise. You’ve got to be consistent to get the benefits. So if you feel stupid and ridiculous or feel like throwing a small, fluffy animal out the window because you’re feeling so stupid and that’s fine, keep going, keep trying because it will kick in.

M: Yes, absolutely. And again, it doesn’t have to be authentic to start with. Neither of us were laughing authentically to start with.

P: Nah.

M: There were giggles in there, definitely from both of us. And then we went a bit silly. And then we came back, and then we had a real laugh, and then we didn’t. But your body doesn’t know the difference and that’s –

P: Exactly! Yes, you’re tricking your body into the reaction.

M: Yes! All right. So, I’ll quickly go through the last two exercises that I want to leave you with.

So the second one is about bonding with friends and family.

So, as I mentioned before, one of the great things about laughter is sharing it with others. Episode eight we talked about how laughter is contagious.

P: Yes, we did.

M: So, laughing with other people makes it more intense and helps bring people closer together. So, it’s a great team building exercise. So, if you want to grab some colleagues or friends or your partner or the whole family and convince them to join in this short exercise, you will be creating stronger bonds with the people around you.

P: Mmm.

M: To start with you get everyone into a circle and you take a deep breath in and out. Repeat that a few times just to get everyone in a different mood and mind set and then moving around the circle, you’re going to join up with a person and then there’s three simple steps.

You will either hold their hands or, if you’re in a more formal environment, shake their hand, so handshake
and you’re going to keep doing that while looking them in the eye
and laugh for 10 seconds.

P: Laugh!

M: That’s it. So once everyone has had 10 seconds of laughter with their partner, you find another partner and you repeat steps 1 to 3. You keep doing it until everyone has shared a laugh with everyone else in the group. The eye contact is a bit confronting for some people –

P: Yeah, very.

M: – but it’s really important for that bond.

P: Breaking through that uncomfortable silence and that sort of space of going ‘well, I need to be vulnerable here.’

M: Yes.

P: It’s an important part of it, because then you can let go, you can let go of it all.

M: Absolutely, so you’ll need someone to be the timekeeper, and you’ll need to keep everyone on track with instructions on when to move on. But once everyone’s done one round, you can get playful with it. So this is where it gets a bit more fun and exciting. So once it runs on a roll and they know what they’re doing, you can throw in a Santa round.

P: Laugh!

M: Everyone has to laugh like Santa. Or you could throw in a feeling or an emotion, so maybe cheeky laughing.

P: Okay, yep. Righto.

M: Or you could do an around the world round. German laughing, French laughing, Russian laughing.

P: Laugh!

M: Or simply throw in a good snort.

P: Yep, that always works.

M: Yes, so you can have a bit of a play with it and see where people go. And again, it’s kind of like an acting class. Some people really get into it, and that will carry the mood for a lot of people.

P: Laugh.

M: Others will be a bit more reluctant, but if they’re participating, they’re going to get the benefits anyway.

P: Yep.

M: And so the last one and I know we’re really short on time. So, I’ll fly through this last one.

This is about really letting go.

P: Ok.

M: There’s a little bit more movement in this one, so it’s a good exercise, either groups or individuals, so you could do this at work with your family or by yourself.

So you start by smiling and slowly move into a giggle then a chuckle and then finish with a really big belly laugh.
Even hold your belly and really get into that belly laugh so you’re slowly increasing the intensity and volume as you go.
And once you’ve had a really loud big belly laugh for good 10 seconds or so, bring it back down, stage by stage to a smile, and to get a good benefit from that one.
You should repeat it a few times, but you can also add movement.

So if you start crouched or small or seated, depending on your mobility as you get louder and get more volume and intensity to your laugh, you come up until your arms are up in the air.

P: Laugh.

M: Your head is tilted back, and you’re standing like a star fish.

P: Laugh.

M: You’re really opening up your body and being big in presence as well as laughter.

P: There’s also a thing about letting the vibration go into certain cavities of your body. So, if you can actually feel the laugh and this is where the visualisation comes into this. I’ve felt this before in classes where you feel visualisation, so you laugh from your toes and you let the laugh reflect your toes so little tiny laugh and you wiggle your toes and then you move it up into your calves and into your knees, and by the time you get to your chest or your belly, it’s big, it’s boisterous, it’s loud. It’s got some volume.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: It’s an acting thing that you do, a warm-up actually, but it is very [beneficial] that visualisation of small spaces and echoing and filling the space with the vibration of the sound is a really good way of doing that same exercise as well.

M: Well, absolutely. And you can take these really simple exercises and create a million different permutations.

P: Mmm.

M: And if these aren’t talking to you, then just Google it.

P: Yeah.

M: Love Google. There’s so much out there that you can learn. Now there is definitely the whole physical side with laughter yoga that this can go to, but it’s like yoga, there are so many different variations of it –

P: Yep, sure.

M: – that it can go in any type of direction. The point is to have a good laugh.

P: Nice. What a nice idea, who doesn’t want that?

M: Absolutely. And now that we’ve had a bit of a laugh, as well, hopefully everyone listening at home had a laugh with us.

P: Laugh.

M: Or at us, either way, laugh.

P: Doesn’t matter.

M: Either way, hopefully you are listening to this in the morning, and it’s going to make your day a little bit brighter.

P: Laugh. On that note, enjoy your day folks and have a good laugh.

M: Bye.

P: Chow.

P: And if you like our little show we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Why we Need to Bring Back Touch (E53)

08/02/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

Are you lonely, sad, or anxious? If so, you might need more touch in your life. This week, Marie and Pete talk about why we need to bring back touch.

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes we’re kind of funny.

P: Touch. It’s my episode. It’s all about what I do. Also it’s my love language, apparently. I didn’t know that until we started doing the podcast.

M: Yes.

P: You knew, apparently.

M: I picked you, I called it.

P: Certainly.

M: Either that or we have to talk about your sexuality.

P: Laughter!

M: Okay, we’re going with touch is your love language, got it.

P: Touch is important people, very important.

M: It’s so important for your happiness and so many other things. It’s just so interconnected, everything we talk about.

P: Yes, and apparently, we’re touching less. This surprises me.

M: Covid!

P: Not only Covid.

M: Well…

P: Yeah, there’s other eelements [elements] in there as well, eelements? That sounded l New Zealand, Laugh.

M: Eelements?

P: Eelements, laugh. Apparently we have been touching less for sometime, since before covered for various reasons.

M: Well, for centuries, actually. So religion-

P: Mmm.

M: – is the first thing that we always love to blame.

P & M: Laugh!

M: But along with religion, came a shame in extra-marital touching.

P: Yes.

M: Whether it was platonic or not.

P: It became the taboo.

M: Absolutely. So it was seen as cheap, dirty, tarty.

P: Yes. Leading one on –

M: All the things that were called [inappropriate].

P: – How dare you?

M: Absolutely. So it started way back then.

P: It did.

M: And then there’s also a whole lot of different cultural differences around the world in terms of what’s acceptable.

P: Yes, and where you can touch in terms of culture.

M: Yes, absolutely.

P: Also weather. Climate apparently makes a big difference. So people who live in warmer climates are more inclined to be physically affectionate than people who live in colder climates.

M: I would have thought that would be the other way around.

P: No.

M: Cause if you’re warm and hot, you’re like sticky and gross.

P: No, well apparently not, it invites touching because of loose clothing and skin being shown and that sort of stuff. So culturally I think they’re talking.

M: Aaahh.

P: I thought that was an interesting one.

M: I like it. So there are definitely differences culturally and also just we are touching less and a lot of it more recently, back to your original point is due to technology.

P: Mmm yep.

M: We are spending less time with people we care about in face to face situations and more time with people we don’t care as much about online.

P & M: Laughter!

P: There’s a classic example of everyone sitting around on the couch with their phones on and not engaging.

M: Mmm hmm, yep. And then now we’ve had Covid in the last year.

P: Yes, we have. Yes, there’s also been some social issues as well that have actually created the fear of touch, one of them being the decades of sexual misconduct, which is starting to come to light in more recent times. So all those misconduct cases of people who were in trusted positions and that’s all coming to the floor now, with various movements and people being more comfortable coming out about it, this has created a fear of, of touch on that has become a non-desirable factor of life.

M: I think also what would have contributed to that, not only with things coming out coming to light more recently, the training that’s been happening since eighty’s and ninety’s, I’d say teachers, coaches, I know that when I’ve done all my coaching courses, they’re very clear on what is appropriate touch what’s not appropriate.

P: Yeah, I fell into that because I never did those courses and I was teaching community dance classes. And then they told me I couldn’t touch people. How am I supposed to teach them how to move without not touching them? That was very strange.

M: Mmm hmm. You are actually allowed to touch them, that’s probably bit over the top. But there’s very clear rules about how you can touch people.

P: Definitely.

M: Yes, so there’s a lot of really good touch that was happening that no longer happens. You know, and it’s caring touch.

P: Well, what do we lose if we don’t touch Marie?

M: Well, how we talk about we talk about the benefits?

P: Well, that was a direct question way.

M: What do we lose?

P: Laugh!

M: What do we gain?! Glass half full.

P: I’m usually the half full guy, I don’t know why…

M: Not a problem. Well, firstly, have you ever noticed the first thing that a kid does when they fall and scrape their knee?

P: Mum!

M: They go running to mum for a hug and mum always, sorry dad’s out there, mum’s always give the best hugs.

P: Miranda did that one when I let her off the swing.

M: Snort, Chloe?

P: Chloe, I don’t know a child dropped off the swing and I was in trouble, laugh.

M: A child let go of the swing, put her arms out for you to catch.

P: At the back end of the swing! It wasn’t my fault, I was waiting at the other end!

M & P: Laughter!

P: This way Chloe, this way!

M: So anyway, when Chloe fell off the swing, she went running to mum for cuddle for a hug.

P: She did, yeah.

M: And that is because from an early age, there is definitely a mother child bond don’t get me wrong, but touch alleviates pain. It also relaxes us and calms us. So I know there’s a lot of support dogs out there who are trained to put their bodies on people who are about to seize or about to fit.

P: Yes.

M: And that touch is calming.

P: Soothing.

M: Yes, it also is really good for the immune system. So accelerates your body’s self-healing and helps kids with healthy development as well.

P: That’s a big one, yeah. Societal development and our behavioural development is so –

M: Cognitive [development].

P: – is so dependent on touch. Yeah, cognitive as well.

M: We’ll come back to that one.

P: That’s a big one, yeah.

M: And the big thing for the last year, if we’re talking about psychological health, is that touch helps to alleviate anxiety, depression and many psychological issues, including things like eating disorders.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: So you wouldn’t necessarily make that connection. But touch is so beneficial from a physical, psychological, emotional, spiritual, you know, every perspective; There are studies, and there is research on the benefits of touch.

P: Yep, definitely.

M: Oh, and there’s one more, touch makes your sex life better.

P: Ooh, well I can’t imagine not touching in that instance.

M: Well, I think the problem is we don’t touch for long enough in the right ways.

P: Aahh.

M: So we’ll get to some studies in a second. I know we’re both itching to get to the research!

P & M: Laugh.

P: Now I’m getting images of the wedding sheet with embroidery around a little hole.

M & P: Laughter!

P: You can have sex but not allowed to touch.

M & P: Laugh.

M: I think more to the point, we, we’re a society now where everything’s hard and fast and sex has become that as well, for a lot of people in a lot of situations.

P: Mmm. Hug your lover people! Hold them.

M: Before and after.

P: After is really important.

M: Yeah, absolutely.

P: I could have offered a personal anecdote there, but I will refrain.

M & P: Laughter!

P: Moving right along. Let’s look at the research. So the first research that came about in the 1960’s was by a doctor called Harry Harlow, and he did a lot of research on monkeys and primates with touch.

M: So, this is a horrible study before we put a lot of ethics and morals into how we organise our studies. But essentially, monkeys were separated from their mothers early on after they were born and then tracked over time, and those monkeys compared to the control group that had the touch of their mother’s fared poorly in nearly every possible measure, so they often were found you know, like you see with animals that are stuck in zoos. They were found curled up in corners, rocking back and forth.

P: Yep.

M: Their physical development was stifled and also their cognitive development, so they were just not developing in all of the measures that you want a baby [to develop].

P: What I found interesting about this research was that the monkeys that weren’t in the controlled [i.e., Touch deprived] group were more adventurous. So my readings said that the monkeys that were given the touch were more willing to go out and explore and then would run back to the maternal figure. They were more adventurous because there are more adventurous, they did develop physically. There was even talk that the brain development was different in the control group. That the size of the brain was larger in the group that were actually exposed to touch.

M: Absolutely, and I think they found something very similar with the children in Romania.

P: This is a huge one. This is something that we both came across independently during the communist regime in the 19… I’m going a seventies and eighties in Romania a lot of horrible things happened and there was a real increase in children in orphanages. And in the overthrow of the communist regime in 1989 researchers, went back into Romania and met with these victims of the orphanages who suffered unbelievable hardship and rejection and really sort of being like being in a cell, basically.

M: Well, kind of. A lot of them were left in cribs, but so let’s paint the picture. They were given all their basic needs, they had air, water, food, friendship, others around them, they were just too numerous. So there were 150,000 of these kids across the country whose parents had passed for horrible unspeakable reasons.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: And these kids just didn’t get enough hugs and cuddles from their carers because there were too many of them. So I think it’s really interesting, when you look at these poor kids, that they had all their basic needs met and you don’t see on any pyramid; You know, Maslow’s pyramid wasn’t talking about touch as a basic need, but this really shows that if you want to be a functioning adult and grow into a functioning person who can look after themselves and contribute in society. Touch should be on that list.

P: Absolutely, yeah.

M: Because that was really the only thing they were missing in their basic needs.

P: I might have come across some different interpretations of that. I think I maybe come across more of the institutionalised information that came out through that. So from my perspective.

P: The reading that I did, Mary Carlson and Felton Earls were two people that I referenced that went over and spoke to these Children and these sufferers and at the ripe old age of thirty, these people were socially withdrawn, they were mute, inept, and the biggest thing was displaying bizarre, atypical movement patterns and violent behaviour.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: You were talking before about the movement patterns of the monkeys and so forth, and this was a shocking wake up as to the what happens when we don’t touch that people develop physical characteristics –

M: Yep.

P: – Such as ticks and shaking and all those restrictive movements that can render someone incapacitated just from not being touched.

M: Yep and again I think we’re saying the same thing.

P: Oh, yeah, yeah.

M: It’s touch right, and they were shown to develop autistic characteristics.

P: Mmm, very much so.

M: And again, a lot of people with autism can have those ticks.

P: Yep.

M: Anyway, trying to make sure that I’m not being offensive in any way.

P & M: Laughter.

M: And using the right language here.

Other studies that I find justice fascinating. So the one that really kicked off a lot of this and that I love is this story about a NICU, so the Neonatal Intensive Care Unit, at a hospital. There were two different NICU’s in this hospital and they found that in one of them the premature babies were putting on more weight and growing faster. And for a premature baby, that’s a difference between life and death, right? And so one doctor decided to go spy on the NICU that was doing well.

P: This is hilarious.

M: Laugh.

P: So does the Doctor go ‘Something’s up there, I’m going to sit in here and wait.

M & P: Laughter.

P: What did he except to see? Alien beings coming in? Laugh!

M: Well, that was the problem. They couldn’t work it out. So these babies were being fed the same formula.

P: So, everything was the same between the two of them.

M: They were being cared for the same, exactly the same and they couldn’t work out why there was such a big difference. And it wasn’t a small insignificant difference, it was It was notable.

P: So what did he find?

M: Anyway, so he was there one night. You know, I picture him sort of squatting in the corner.

P: Laugh!

M: I’ve got this mental image.

P: [Whispers] Shh. You can’t see me, I’m not here.

M: Exactly, laugh. And a nurse came in and kind of had a look around and saw the coast was clear and picked up one of the babies and started just gently stroking the baby and kind of cuddling with the baby. And then she put that one down. She went to the next one.

P: I love it.

M: And so this was a nurse that I was allowed to be there, right?

P: Mmm hmm.

M: But the thinking before that period was that you had to keep them in sterile environments in order for them to survive. Right? And what they found was that the babies who were held and stroked gently were found to put on about 47% more weight than those who weren’t.

P: Wow, that’s amazing.

M: And more than that, months later they were found to be significantly more cognitively progressed.

P: Yeah. Yeah. This is the thing that keeps coming back with a lot of studies. Is our brains develop and our curiousness and our intellect develops because of the stimulation of touch.

M: Yes, Absolutely. And coming back to why we do this study, this podcast.

P: Mmm.

M: It makes you happier.

P: Yep.

M: Touch, regular touch throughout your day makes you happier. So there’s a psychologist, Jane Clipman, who asked her students to hug five times a day.

P: Ha! This is really confronting. People don’t like hugging, laugh.

M: A lot of people don’t, even pre Covid.

P: Yeah.

M: Some people, I know a person who says to me, I’m just not a hugger.

P: Mmm.

M: They cringe at being hugged by people.

P: Mmm, very much.

M: So, the hug had to be non-sexual,

P: Yep.

M: frontal,

P: Yep.

M: all face to face and with two hands. So you couldn’t do like the bro…

P: The pat on the back, the chest bump, laugh.

M: And so, she had one group of students go hug five times a day and another control group, and they found that the huggers were significantly happier a month later.

P: It works. Hugs are memorable.

M: Definitely.

P: Tammy Hunyadi, if you’re listening, I still remember that.

M & P: Laughter.

P: Well, it was our first lesson we learnt in massage class. Our very first lesson. We all stood up in a circle and we had to hug the person who was in front of us and behind us and apparently Tammy was standing behind me, and she said ‘all I saw was this bald head.’ And then this man turned around and all of a sudden I was enveloped by these arms and my face was against his chest. I didn’t even see his face.

M: Laugh.

P: And that was me apparently. She always tells that story and she says it was one of the fondest memories of our friendship.

M: Awwweee.

P: It was just this massive, enveloping of care.

M: Lovely, love it. Actually, there’s a thing that I read about a few weeks ago. I really in preparing for this episode should look this up, a few weeks ago? I mean, a few years ago. There’s places that you can go to hug.

P: Hug therapy, yes.

M: Yeah, you go hug complete strangers.

P: Yep, yep. It’s a thing and I think it’s in the Nordic countries. Dare I say it again? Good old Norwegians.

M: Yeah, Okay.

P: There’s a very famous book that was brought out it was called the Midas Touch in 1984 and that goes on touching a more basic level. It says that diners who were patted on the arm by their server were more inclined to tip more generously and that people in care homes will eat more after physical contact.

M: Mmm.

P: So that’s on a lesser level of what touch can do. But it doesn’t have to be an all-enveloping hug. It could be a slight interaction. Students who were given a friendly pat by their teachers, with three times more likely to speak up in class.

M: I think there’s a safety to a pat.

P: Mmm. There’s a reassurance, I think.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: But it does stimulate neurochemicals and get things going in the brain. And so that comes back to that behavioural development that is so important. And this all comes back from that work that Harry Harlow did in the 1960’s. It’s still informing us today.

M: Yep.

P: So how do we touch in Covid?

M: Well…

P: This is a hard one. How do you, how do you engage with touch in a Covid world.

M: I think for anyone who’s within a household, it’s a no brainer.

P: Hmm.

M: What we’re really talking about is people who have roommates that aren’t in the habit of touching.

P: Mmm.

M: Not immediate family that they live with or people who live by themselves. And before Covid even, there was the World Health Organisation was talking about loneliness as the new epidemic, right?

P: Mmm.

M: And a lot more people now can afford to live by themselves. Before, it was really cost prohibitive.

P: Yep.

M: Which is a lot of the time where people married, laugh.

P: Ha, interesting.

M: We’re going to unpack that [later].

P: Laugh.

M: But for the first time in human society. We expect to be able to buy a house and not necessarily as part of a couple. A lot of people are buying houses and living in them by themselves.

P: Yep.

M: And also on the flip side, older ages, they’re living by themselves a lot longer, and as a result, a lot of people, particularly in Covid, It’s now even worse. A lot of people are lonely.

P: Yeah, they’re not getting any touch.

M: And a big part of that, is there not hugging, touching anyone. Because if you are lonely you might see your postman and your garbageman from your window. You might wave, maybe.

P: Hmm.

M: You’re not going to hug the person behind the counter at Coles.

P: Nope.

M: Laugh.

P: Not through that Perspex glass.

M & P: Laughter!”

M: Not anymore!

P: You can’t get near ‘em Damnit! Laugh, ‘I love you, you just gave me 30% off!’

M & P: Laughter!”

P: [Funny voice] ‘I know that guy, he sold us our furniture.’ That’s a musical quote.

M: Laugh, yep. So hugging may not be the right answer, especially during Covid.

P: But it doesn’t have to be a hug this is the thing. It needs to be some sort of physical interaction.

M: So my recommendation is massage.

P: Oh, Glad you said that, not me.

M & P: Laughter!”

P: It is interesting, though, that I’ve found this generally, not only during Covid, during times of crisis; So during the GFC that happened a few years back and in times of things like the bushfires and stuff like that, people seek out comfort and they seek out health. So, I would get people turning up to my clinic going ‘I don’t know why I’m here, I just want a treatment, I just want to feel nice for an hour.’ I’m like [internal monologue] ‘why are you seeing me, you shouldn’t be seeing me?’

M: Laugh. You fix people!

P: Laugh. They want that interaction, they want that touch. It’s very important for people because of all the sensory information that comes through. It does make you feel, for want of a better word, more loved, more secure. And that comes back to our maternal connections.

M: Uh huh.

P: When we first start out, we need to be touched by our parents. When we first come out of the out of the channels and screaming and yelling, there needs to be a nurturing there otherwise we don’t develop as well, and we don’t have all those physical attributes that we should.

M: Yep, so to be really clear, any consensual touch can make a difference.

P: Very much.

M: Consensual is important, and Covid safe touch is what we’re advocating for. If you can if you’ve got people in your household that you can try the five hugs a day exercise with.

P: I like that idea.

M: I really recommend.

P: People will struggle with that, yeah.

P: Five hugs with the person you love. It’s not that hard to do, but you’ve got to put some time and effort into it. And if you are living by yourself and can get out to someone who can… even get your nails done, or someone who, you know that’s holding hands for an hour while they do your nails a lot of the time; There’s that, there’s massage.

P: Yep.

M: Find ways to get some more touch into your day. It might help to alleviate a lot of the stress and anxiety that’s going on.

P: It will help, it will help.

M: And with the loneliness due to Covid. Hmm. All right, well, and also it is really important to ask for consent before you go do that.

P: Laugh! Don’t ask! Just launch in there!

M: Laugh.

P: I just go for it and people go ‘oh, ok we’re doing that.’ Laugh

M: Because I do want to say that some cultures and religions or just people might need more gentle touch.

P: Yes.

M: Or are afraid of touch, possibly due to trauma.

P: Very wise words. Ooh Yes. Big one.

M: Yes.

P: Yeah.

M: So consent is good.

P: I know, I just keep forgetting.

M: Laugh. Well, it’s okay with people you already know.

P: Yeah… I still want… I’m just bad like that. I’m sorry to all the people that I’ve hugged without permission, laugh.

M: I just don’t want our listeners going out and hugging people randomly.

P: Laugh!

M: Then get slapped down, laugh!

P: Please don’t slap anyone.

M: Laugh.

P: All right, on that note, we’ll finish up.