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The Danish Art of Hygge (E26)

by

Happiness for Cynics Podcast

Denmark is the happiest country in the world, so this week we look at the Danish practice of Hygge (pronounced hoo-geh) to see what all the fuss is about.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.

P: And I’m Peter Furness, a lover, maker and happiness creator. Has a nice ring to it, Doesn’t it?

M: It does.

P: Each week we will bring to you the latest news and research in the world of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: So, if you’re feeling low.

P: Or if you’re only satisfied with life but not truly happy with it.

M: Or maybe you just want more.

P: [Whispers] Greedy.

Then this is the place to be.

M: And today’s episode is all about Hygge.

[Happy intro music]

M: So today we are talking about Hygge. And we have listened to [the pronunciation of] it on Google multiple times.

P: And it took multiple chances to get it right.

M: And we’ve probably still got it wrong. So I apologise if you are Danish.

P: [Laugh]

M: So Hygge. How’s that spelled, Pete?

P: H Y G G E.

M: Yes. I think that’s how they teach kids to spell now. Isn’t it?

P: Phonetically?

M: Yeah

P: Oh wow.

M: Maybe, maybe I read that, I read a lot of things. I make a lot of things up to I’m sure of it.

P: Like Moses and the 15 tablets. [Laugh]

M: That was you. All you! [Laugh]

M: So Hygge, what is it?

P: Interesting.

M: Do you want to get started?

P: Oh no, this is all you.

M: Okay, so I came across this, this week, and I’m so intrigued by this on and I’m going to start by quoting a guy called Meik Wiking, we would say, taking in English. But I’m sure it’s pronounced Viking because he is a Dane, right? So that’s where the Vikings came from. Up there, right? So he’s the author of ‘The Little Book of Hygge Danish Secrets to Happy Living.’

He’s also the CEO of the Happiness Research Institute in Copenhagen. And even more impressive from a background point of view is that Denmark is the world’s happiest country, according to – [the 2016 World Happiness Report]

P: – Followed very closely by Sweden and Norway, who sometimes tip them over the balance, I was reading.

M: These guys are all happy so we’re going to actually turn and listen, so this is about saying what’s going on in the happiest country in the world, right?

P: There’s a reason why they’re so happy.

M: So he says that Hygge has been called everything from the art of creating intimacy to cosiness of the soul and even cocoa by candlelight.

P: Awe

M: And in his book, he explains that you know Hygge when you feel it, but that some of the key ingredients are:

  • Togetherness;
  • Relaxation;
  • Indulgence;
  • Presence; and
  • Comfort.

P: It just sounds like a night in front of the Telly [Television].

M: It sounds like an indulgent in front of the Telly.

P: Ooh! Tim Tams, coffee and champagne.

M: Yes a deliberate night in front of the Telly not just a.. I’m exhausted from work, and I happen to be in front of the Telly, it’s like I’m choosing it.

P: Yeah.

M: Which makes it all the more better. You’re choosing laziness and getting happiness out of it.

P: Yeah very true.

M: And what I’m so excited about this is it gives you permission to cuddle in the blanket and sweatpants all day.

P: [Laugh]

M: Bliss.

P: And if our listeners could see, Marie is still in her sweat pants and her little slippers, and it’s four o’clock in the afternoon on a Friday.

M: It pretty much excuses my entire behaviour for Covid, three months of my life was just dedicated to Hygge, not just laziness.

P: It’s just giving yourself permission.

M: I mean they don’t talk about not shaving or showering but I think you could go there if you wanted to.

P: Haha sure, ok it’s indulgent.

M: So pretty much. What we’re talking about is that actually the Danes spend a lot more time indoors over winter than we do. We are very lucky with the weather and this is a way of coming together and creating a cosy environment and blissing out.

P: Well, it’s interesting. I was reading one of the articles in The New Yorker actually about Hygge.

M: In the New Yorker?

P: The New Yorker, yes. Just to throw that out there. And what I found interesting was that they talk about it in terms of you can’t necessarily transfer the Hygge concept to Americanism because of the culture differences between Denmark and America.

M: Mmm

P: It becomes a little bit more of a[n] egalitarian concept. When you transfer it straight into American [society], they talk about the fact that-

M: What?

P: Well, they’re talking about it in terms of their culture that if you just say to people, you know you want the Danish experience, you want to have antlers on your wall and cosy fur rugs and the Scandinavian wood and all this sort of stuff.

M: And a roaring fire.

P: [Laugh]

M: I’m there, I’m there. Keep going.

P: I’m probably not explaining it very well, but they say that if you transfer that across to an American experience, it becomes different, becomes it a social. How do they talk about it, it becomes.. I’m trying to be really polite. I’m just going to come out and say it, it becomes egotistic. ‘Oh, I’m celebrating my fabulousness because I have access to all these Scandinavian design and so forth and the evolution of a roaring fire in my house.’

M: The irony is that Scandinavian design is minimalist, they’re known for their minimalism and not for their comfort and cosiness.

[Laughter]

M: But, I love this concept, which maybe layers on top of the minimalist.

P: I’m going to quote the article here.

‘When transferred to the United States. The kind of understated luxury that Danes consider a shared national trait starts to seem like little more than a symbol of economic status, the very thing that Scandinavian countries have sought to jettison.’

M: [Laugh] This is so New Yorker.

[Laughter]

M: This is more a reflection on the New Yorker than on America.

P: [Laugh] Ok, we’re not going to go there. We might delete this.

M: No, no, not at all. I think it’s a really valid perspective.

P: Well, they go on to say that there are lessons from the Hygge that Americans might heed.

M: And I think is we’re going into winter now in Australia, and because this is a new thing, it is the new Marie Kondo, you know, sparking joy; Hygge is the latest thing that everyone’s talking about right now, and in particular because of this ‘Little Book of Hygge’ that’s come out. So go look it up if you’re looking for something to read over winter, and I think it’s perfect in its timing because of what’s happened with Covid, we’ve just been given permission to spend all this time at home. Winter is coming Pete, and we need Hygge.

P: Let’s make it relative though the Australian winter is coming, which, let’s face it in Sydney means that it’s going to be 14 degrees, which is not exactly the same as a Scandinavian winter.

M: We may have listeners in the high country.

P: Ok yeah.. I’m coming down, once the borders are open. It’s interesting you talk about winter because I’ve got a great quote here that ‘The hard learned lesson of frigid Scandinavian winters, is that there’s no such thing as bad weather, only unsuitable clothing.’

M: I love it.

P: [Laughter] That all you really need to get through difficult times is shelter and sustenance, kith and kin.

M: Kin, so again doesn’t have to be family. It can be a chosen family, and I think when the weather is crap, whether it’s raining here or it’s just cold and everything’s relative if you have you grown up in Sydney, then winters are cold. If you’ve been anywhere else in the world, you’ll know that Sydney winters are nothing to complain about. But it is all relative.

P: It is all relative. Yes [Laugh]

M: And then it’s about going ‘ooh it’s cold let’s get everyone together to have some port or sherry and –

P: And snuggle up together.

M: Yeah, snuggle.

P: That’s where I actually do love our volleyball friends we’re a very affectionate bunch.

M: [Laugh]

P: Maybe it’s because we sweat together, but get us together on the couch and we will literally fall all over each other, and it’s kind of like, you know, everybody’s body is our body in a way, it’s like yeah I’m just going to nuzzle in here.

M: There’s no boundaries. It’s true. [Laugh]

P: Well, pretty much.

[Laughter]

P: It’s lovely because there is an, I will talk about the importance of touch here, a subject upon which I am very passionate. It is important for hugs and touch and affection to be expressed.

M: It is particularly important for some people if that is their love language, as we’ve discussed we need to do an episode on love languages by the way.

P: Done

M: But yeah, but some people in particular, touch is such a vital part of how they feel connected and express love and care for other people.

P: But it does things to a scientifically it sets off chemical reactions. It sets off sensor in neurons that are beneficial to us. So we can’t live without touch.

M: Hhmm

P: If you challenge me on that one, I’m going to come back at you with science.

M: You can’t live well without touch. It’s not like air.

P: Alright, I’ll give you that.

M: Food, water.

P: We’ll come back to that one.

Hygge. Actually Hyggebukser.

M: So, Hyggebukser. And okay, what is Hyggebukser?

P: Hyggebukser: Otherwise known is that slubby pair of pants you would never wear in public, but secretly treasure. We all have one.

M: I’ve got multiple. Is that bad?

P: No. I’ve got t-shirts that this really should have gone in the bin three years ago. But they’re just so comfy.

M: Yep. I’ve Yep. Is particularly like if you bought them somewhere meaningful, Yep. And then the other Danish word that goes with this Hygge movement is Hyggelig, which is Hygge – like. So Pete, tell me about your last Hyggelig moment.

P: Hyggelig moment, hhmm. It didn’t happen in winter, but it was a moment of being, we’d had a debauched evening of wonderful celebration and so forth and I was in my underwear.

M: Ha ha. That is so not unusual for you. And I think somebody who we won’t name dared me to take off my pants at one point and then I just left him off for the evening because it was just convenient and lying on the couch and –

M: – Because it was just convenient [laugh].

P: Well, it is. I’m comfortable in my undies. But we were on the couch and it was the end of the evening and we’d all imbibed and taken part of something. And it was this really quiet Segway into the quiet, quiet sort of hours of the morning. And we’re all lying on the couch together. I think we were watching or listening to some music and everyone was just kind of, it was like a twister board if we just kind of wrapped up with each other.

M: Falling asleep. [Laugh]

P: Pretty much. At one point one of my friends lifted his head up and he looked around at the various people that were all inter linked by hands and legs and arms and so forth and went, yeah this is a pretty cool collection of people.

[Laughter]

P: But it was utter contentment. And I think the reason that we were all falling asleep is also because we felt very chill and it was it was encouraged. It was like I’m so comfortable and I am so comforted in this moment.

M: I think that’s what comes from having a really good close group of friends because I haven’t done that since university days. And we would have all been blind drunk and someone would mean throwing up in the corner. Had we been back in those days.

P: True.

M: Whereas I think I know the night that you’re referring to [Laugh].

P: You were there Marie. [Laugh]

M: And everyone going I’m just going to sleep right here.

P: And it worked. [Laugh]

M: Very weird, but anyway. That is a lovely, lovely moment. Thank you for sharing, Peter.

So Hygge? How do we practise Hygge?

P: I like it. I like that you’ve got this one in there, Marie. No money.

M: Yes!

P: Hygge is not about money. It’s not about spending money on indulgences, not about buying a car.

M: Absolutely. And it’s, yeah, it’s not about buying happiness and back to your point with The New Yorker article it is not about spending money to make something happen, right?

P: No.

M: It is about putting on your daggiest sweat pants and your ugg boots that you love but don’t tell anyone your own and that favourite T-shirt of yours that is so soft you feel like it’s going to fall apart soon because you washed it that many times. So it’s not expensive or fancy, and it’s about getting together people that matter to you or, or not. You don’t actually need the people. You could just get a good book and sit outside in the sun, right? It could be the exact opposite of the, the image that we’re painting with the room with the fire and the cold outside. It is finding a cosy space.

P: Does it have to be shared?

M: No.

P: Hygge doesn’t need to [have] another person.

M: No.

P: I’m gonna challenge you on that one, Muz.

M: I don’t think it does.

P: I thought it’s sort of, it’s about connecting with your intimate crew. And the thing that I was reading was that it’s about not connecting with a large group of people, but a close knit group of one or two people. And this is something that the Danes do. They don’t necessarily have large gatherings. They have cosy gatherings of one or two, which goes towards them almost seeming … standoffish because you can’t break into their little cliques and so forth. Now it’s something that could be a cultural perspective, but it isn’t about big groups of people, but it is about people and being connected with one or two others.

M: I think you’ve gotta have those moments of one or two in order to have these deeper connection moments, because when you’re at a big table of people having dinner, or a big party, you don’t get as intimate with people just by the nature experience.

P: Yeah, no. And you’ve got background noise and so forth.

M: As far as Hygge and whether or not it requires people, my understanding is that it doesn’t that you can jump under a blanket and watch a romcom with a steaming mug of..

P: Jarrah?

M: Cider or whatever, whatever floats your boat. It’s about the comfort as well.

So, firstly, it shouldn’t cost you much or anything. Secondly, it’s all about the simple pleasures in life and stopping and being mindful of those things.

So we are in our busy, hectic, crazy lives often sit down in front of TV and chill.

This is about choosing to do it on a Friday night with a movie that you’ve been wanting to watch and your tub of Ben and Jerry’s and ordering pizza and choosing that as a way to spoil yourself and indulging yourself, but with the simple pleasures in life or having a board game night with two friends and your partner, preferably non digital options, I would say. And it can be about spending time with people you love, or it could be about reading a book.

P: OK. I’ll give you that, the concept of indulgence and so forth does come from reading a book. Yes.

M: Hhmm. It’s taking the time to.. Yeah, and this is why again, I gave three different examples of what Hygge has been called up the beginning of the episode here. There’s no riel, solid definition of it. It is a thing that the Danes all get and know. And the rest of the world is now trying to cotton on.

[Laughter]

M: So excuse us listeners, while we kind of..

P: Catch-up?

M: muddle through it and work it out, yeah.

P: It’s not only a Danish thing, though. There’s a Swedish concept as well, which is very similar. It’s called Lagom. Now literally, apparently, that refers to a kind of moderation.

M: [Derisive noise] Moderation.

[Laughter]

M: It’s not part of my language.

P: [Laugh]

M: My vocabulary.

P: It comes back to a Viking phrase, so it’s still, it’s still part of the culture reference on Lagom. I’m probably saying that very badly, interprets as around the team, meaning it’s about sharing with people and it also refers to taking mead, so it means that you should take only a sip of the mead that’s being passed around so that no one is left without and Lagom interprets also as being adequate or just right or in balance.

M: I found this really fascinating that is so part of the Scandinavian mindset. They have very community –

P: Very socialist.

M: – focus, not even socialist. Not socialist in the way that Americans bandied the term around. They see it as, when Americans say socialist they think communist very often.

P: Yep, which are two very different words.

M: Very different things. So, yes, socialist its community and family first rather than self-first, and you look at who the happiest populations are and it’s the Swedish.

P: It’s the Scandinavians.

M: And yeah, it does come at a cost. I mean, they have a higher tax bracket. They have a much more community driven expense module. It’s about investing in the town and the nation. It’s not just about investing in self.

M: But it all comes back to them, it makes them happy.

P: It does come back and they value that and it’s I think that’s a cultural influence. It’s bandied about with them when they’re children. They’re taught to understand that this is how it works.

M: And here’s the irony of that. Even though you’re paying more in taxes, they’re getting more back so they’re happier and their wage gap, the wealth gap is actually smaller. So unlike in countries like America, where they say it’s all about the dream –

P: Hhmm..

M: and right? And they’re very much based in the self and capitalism and the promise off being able to work hard and do well in life, which means succeed and money, right? For that for many, many Americans, they’re living below the poverty line, many, many more than in Scandinavian countries. So the irony is that this system that was set up to enable people to prosper is not actually enabling most, the majority to prosper, nor is it making them happy. Sorry, I’ve gotten on my soapbox here.

P: [Laugh] I’m letting you go.

M: This has gotten very political. Anyway, so.

P: We’ve gone away from the mead and the cider and the fire. [Laugh]

M: And we’re about to head over time. So let’s get back to Hygge, how do you practise it?

P: How do you practise it?

M: So,

1. One it shouldn’t be expensive or fancy. We covered that off.

2. Two it’s about the simple pleasures in life.

3. Three, you’ve got to set the scene, get your warm blankets out, light your roaring fire, get your cup of tea and get your comfy clothes on with your elastic waistband.

P: [Laugh] So this is appropriate that, you know, I could take my clothes off at this moment.

M: And Leah if you’re listening, absolutely take off your bra.

P: [Laugh] First thing that happens when she walks in the room.

M: [Laugh]

P: I just shared that with the world! She’s gonna love me for that.

M: And then lastly;

4. You’ve got to add this on. And this is where I was like, it’s not about moderation. It’s about a little bit of indulgence, but within reason, get some comfort foods in there.

P: Tim Tams, lamington’s.

M: Ben and Jerry’s ice cream, cheese. I can’t eat cheese anymore cause I’m allergic but yeah…

P: I’m loving this topic more. It kind of links back into one of our other episodes about Ikigai, the Japanese art of fruitful living.

M: Meaning, finding meaning. So Ikigai I think, is how Japanese find meaning and purpose in life. This is how the Scandinavian or Danish in particular do self-care.

P: Yeah, right.

M: I think that’s the difference between the two.

P: Yeah, very true.

M: And I think you can do both.

P: Oh yeah, definitely. Yeah, but I like this, I like this example.

M: Absolutely.

P: We could all be a little bit more like the Danes.

M: Cheers to that. So we are sitting on my bed under blankets.

P: Doing Hygge with Martinis.

M: We thought we could not talk about this without doing it for you.

[Drinks click]

P: Well, that was very nice. [Laugh]

M: On that note.

P: [Sings a note] Aaaahhhh… what was that a D?

M: [Laugh] so, thank you for joining us today if you want hear more please remember to subscribe and like this podcast. And remember, you can find us at www.marieskelton.com. A site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life, including some really practical tips and resources is to get you started on your happiness journey. Please do check out the site and right to ask to let us know if you would like us to cover any specific topics or if you’d like to give us feedback, would love to hear from you.

P: Definitely.

M: Until next time.

P: Choose happiness.

[Happy exit music]

Related content: Podcast: Finding Purpose with the Japanese Secret of Ikigai (E18), Podcast: Designing Happy Cities (E19)

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When it’s OK to not be OK (E25)

by

Happiness for Cynics

In this week’s episode, Marie and Pete talk about when it’s OK to not be OK, and the importance of taking the time to process negative emotions. They discuss the Kubler-Ross grief curve and how people move through the stages of grief and change.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.

P: And I’m Peter Furness a purveyor of fun sizes, a posh motor head and budgie smuggler. Each week we will bring to you the latest news and research in the world of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: So if you’re feeling low.

P: Or if you’re only satisfied with life but not truly happy with it.

M: Or maybe you just want more.

P: Then this is the place to be.

M: Have you been through the corona virus emotional rollercoaster? Or maybe you’re worried about finances or feeling lonely, or you’ve recently lost someone who’s dear to you.

P: If so, you’re in the right place because today’s episode is all about when it’s OK to not be okay.

[Happy Intro Music]

M: So, Pete, today we’re talking about when it’s OK to not be okay, and I love that you sent me a message saying, we need to do something that’s not all about happiness and talk about this topic because it is so important.

P: Really important. It’s interesting when I sent the message was like ‘Happiness isn’t everything!’

[Laughter]

M: Were you not ok when you sent it?

P: No, I was fine. It’s funny because this came about through doing one of our very first episodes when we were looking into what happiness actually was and I came across these quotes, which I seem to have mislaid now so I can’t quote the source.

M: I’ve got a quote, you keep going with this one in the meantime.

P: [Laugh] It’s in a book hanging on the rack in my..

M: We’ll do another episode.

[Laughter]

P: This whole concept that sometimes happiness doesn’t serve you. It’s not great to be happy 100% of the time. And there are certain situations in life where you don’t need to tap into your happy self because it doesn’t serve you well.

M: Absolutely, I could not agree more.

P: Well you’re the natural cynic. So you know, you spent how many years of your life..

M: Sometimes you just want to shit on other people.

P: [Laugh!] I know let’s, of course we’re going to throw poo at him.

M: Look I’m 100% with you here, we’re all human as well, and sometimes you don’t want to be happy. You want to sit and wallow in your pain or your trauma or your sadness or anger or whatever it is. And as long as there’s an end to it and as long as you’re not pulling everyone around with you down you into that spiral, I think go for it. Go punch a punching bag or watch rom coms [romantic comedies] or cry all Sunday.

P: I got told to kick a dog.

M: Oh! No!

P: I was having a bad and a friend came over and goes, ‘go and kick a dog you’ll feel so much better’

M: No!

P: I would never do that.

M: We are 100% against that on this podcast. Just remember listeners that if we have opinions that vary from yours that’s a moment for learning and growth. You don’t have to hate us.

P: [Laugh] Believe me, we have a lot of learning to do right here.

M: [Laugh] We’re learning too. So I have a great quote from the probably most famous cynicist? Pessimist of all time Friedrich Nietzsche which is “That which does not kill us, makes us stronger.” So what I do want to say is that I agree with you. It’s okay to not be okay. I do also want to say that there’s a whole lot of research out there about the positive benefits off going through tough times.

P: Oh completely, you learn lessons that garner you and take you into your next issue 10 years down the track and you can go ‘I’ve have been here before and know what this is’ And you recognise stuff as it comes up and you go ‘Right, I know where this is heading let’s go’ and you’re ready for it.

M: So it’s not about minimising or eliminating bad or sad moments in our lives. It’s about acknowledging them, experiencing the pain, but knowing that you’re not alone and that it won’t last. And eventually when the time is right starting to move forward.

P: Definitely.

M: And if you’ve had a very significant trauma or moment in your life, when you do move forward, often times that could be a truly transformative moment.

P: You can talk about that, can’t you Marie?

M: I think so.

[Laughter]

P: Just a little.

M: Just a little, yeah and look that’s always the whole premise for this podcast and my blog and a lot of the work and research that I’ve done. The book that I’m writing right now, and I’m researching and interviewing people from all over the world to hear their trauma stories, sometimes their stories of grief and the commonality across most of these stories. A huge percentage is that once you get through it, they would mostly not ever take it back. And they feel like it shaped who they are.

P: It does yeah, it gives you tools. It gives you tools to cope because life isn’t always handed to you in the best packaging.

M: Yeah, it makes you grateful for the life you have.

P: Exactly.

M: And there’s a whole body of research on this as well. But for me personally, nearly dying in my thirties has really made me question what’s important in life. And I had been raised in a school of thought, which kind of goes like this. Here’s the script:

Do well in school, go to university do well there. Get a good job with a good company. Reputable job. Get a partner, have some kid’s. Have a house.

P: White picket fence?

M: All of that, yep.

P: Dog?

M: Move up in your career and eventually retire with enough money saved in the bank that you can fund a decent level of living.

P: Right.

M: Now that was success to a lot of our parents, a lot of our parent’s generation, right?

P: Yep

M: And that’s what they taught us and nowhere in there do they talk about happiness.

P: Yeah

M: For me having, again, nearly died and nearly losing my leg and spending a lot of time in a lot of pain, like months, months of surgeries and years of rehab. I’m questioning that model, I really am. As are a lot of other people who came to it on their own, I feel like it was the biggest secret no one ever told me that. And that’s why I have invited you to be here because you cottoned on pretty early in your life.

P: God knows why.

M: [Laugh]

P: [Laugh] I don’t know why. I just decided to go the non-logical route, I think, and I went into the alternative spaces very early. So maybe that was why. And I think that’s the thing I got exposed to alternative ideals, alternative lines of thought. My mother thought I was an absolute lunatic. [Laugh]

M: Yeah, definitely, definitely.

There is a lot of research and there’s nothing special about my story. In that sense, I had a major trauma and I’ve come out happier and more grateful for what I have than I went in.

P: But it’s going through that process of trauma, and I think that’s the space that we’re talking about today is that it’s okay to be in trauma and to be experiencing a really crap time as long as you can keep perspective on that. And I think the big key is not dwelling in that trauma and letting it re-inform you and re-inform you and staying stuck in that empty part of the cycle, there’s got to be an upswing.

M: I think that you can be in a really bad place as long as there is always some momentum to move you through the fazes. So we’ve spoken about the Kubler Ross Grief cycle –

P: Have we? I don’t think we’ve spoken about that yet? [Laugh]

M: Anyway, It is now a widely used resource for grief counsellors, but it’s also been repurposed by the change community and change management community and corporate to go through the emotions that people feel when they experience major change.

P: Yes.

M: So you going through denial, anger, depression, bargaining and acceptance.

P: I like the bargaining faze.

M: It doesn’t get you anywhere generally but the point is that grief isn’t linear so you can go through it and come back at any one point. But also as long as you’re moving through it, then it is really beneficial to process your emotions. That’s the time you need to grieve and to be sad and to be angry and to feel hard done by.

P: I’m going to pull you up there just a second Marie. Let’s talk about the non-linear aspect of grief.

M: Sure, so if you look at the grief cycle, denial, anger and depression are the first three. So if you were experiencing grief, your first and most immediate gut reaction might be, ‘I don’t believe you.’

P: Yep

M: If you heard horrible news about a loved one. You might move pretty quickly into

Anger, ‘This isn’t fair. Why, them? Why me? Life sucks. And then you might slide into depression quite easily, which is just a feeling of grief and sadness.

P: Desperation?

M: Absolutely any of those normal and to be expected when you’re dealing with these horrible life events –

P: And do those three aspects.. sorry.

M: – But you might then go back to anger.

P: I was just about to ask, you keep circling around.

M: But now the point is, though, to keep moving not to get stuck and of the 50 or so people I’ve interviewed. One is stuck, still stuck, and is still in that. Why me? And these are people that you would never wish this stuff on your enemy.

P: Of course.

M: The person I’m referring to had a stroke. He was healthy, non-smoker, didn’t really drink, a whole life ahead of him. [Had a] stroke that impacted his ability to perform his job and really it’s been 10 years with a lot of rehab. His loved ones left him. All of the things that could go wrong, have gone wrong. And you can’t pursue the job of his dreams that he was actually pursuing. And has really had to reset his life, and you can understand, with all of these people how it could be so easy to get stuck in that anger or that sadness or bargaining or any of these, denial, could get stuck in that wanting for something that never will be moment. And that’s where unfortunately, time keeps moving on, and you’re doing yourself a disservice if you can’t find a way to move forward.

P: Is that where we come to the point of acceptance? Is that where acceptance comes in?

M: That’s what we want to get to.

P: So acceptance is the first stage that we want to get to.

M: It’s the last stage before you move on.

P: Right, so we’ve gone through the grief cycle after we’ve done the bargaining. Let’s talk a bit more about the bargaining. I’m interested in this.

M: This is if you were religious, where you might bargain with God, ‘bring them back and I will be a better Christian or why couldn’t you take me rather than my child or like this is really difficult again we’re not counsellors.

P: No.

M: So this is potentially triggering content that we’re talking about here. Or if you were made redundant, you might go to your boss and say ‘I really need this. I don’t want have any savings, what can I do?’

P: ‘Take me back.’

M: Yeah, ‘what can I do to make you keep me? So it’s the begging part off this process that generally doesn’t get you anywhere.

P: No.

M: Many people don’t get the benefit they want out of the bargaining.

P: Definitely. And on that, does that naturally lead into acceptance because that gets to… is that the lowest of the low points? When you start bargaining?

M: Depression is.

P: Depression is the lowest.

M: And the good thing about bargaining is that you try and solve [things].

P: That shift, you’re coming on the upswing.

M: Exactly.

P: So if you’re bargaining, you’re doing well.

M: You’re taking action.

P: Ah yes.

M: It’s a bit misguided often.

P: But you’re looking for solutions and I think I’m gonna jump in here. That’s a really important perspective to jump into because we’re going to talk more about tips later but it’s about finding another way and it’s not about focusing on the end goal. It’s about focusing on where I’m at now, and how can I make that one step on improvement?

M: Yep and as you mentioned we’re going to talk about tips in a little bit, but it’s really important to note that you need to sit in anger, sadness or depression and all of these fazes for long as you need to sit there.

P: And that’s acknowledgment?

M: Yep, absolutely.

P: It’s interesting. I went through that with my father when he died. It was very quick, thankfully and then all of a sudden I was in charge of the funeral and I was like ‘Oh okay, I’ve got to do this you know, choosing the coffin, choosing what he would wear in the coffin’ and things like that. It was amazingly freeing because I didn’t have to focus on my grief and my anger and all that different stuff and that came later.

M: Did you just defer it?

P: Yes, definitely. I chose the time when I was going to do that and I ran into the mountains and spent some time on my own and went through those little stages. But there was definitely sadness and so forth. It was very interesting, that came after everything was done.

M: I’ve seen a good friend of mine do that as well when her Dad passed she went to organizing mode and it wasn’t till after the funeral that she actually had time to grieve, fully grieve and let herself go.

P: Exactly, but it is those, those moments of going, ‘I’m going to feel the grief and I’m going to feel the anger and I’m going to feel the depression and do that.’ I chose to do that in a very private space. And then it’s being okay in those moments going, this is, this is, excuse my language, this is shit.

M: Yep

P: And I’m going to sit here. I’m going to cry, and I’m gonna let it out.

M: And it’s okay.

P: Because you need-

M: It’s ok to not be ok.

P: – to experience those emotions because that’s I think that’s part of the acknowledgement curve is if you haven’t been there and felt it, then you haven’t acknowledged that ‘Yes, I’ve done grief and anger, and I’ve done the depression. Now I’m going to choose to start moving forward. Let’s, let’s do some bargaining.’

M: It is so important to process.

P: Yes.

M: And this model shows the healthy way that most people process and everyone processes differently as we said you might skip a phase. You might never go through anger. But these are the general –

P: indicators.

M: Yep. So you’ve got to do the grieving, you’ve got to do the hard yards to get through it otherwise you hold it.

P: I think also, if you know the stages that are coming and if someone has said to you you’re going to feel angry, you’re going to feel anxious. So when it happens, you like. OK, I’m in the anger phase. I’m here. I’m ready.

M: Or you might, you might feel these.

P: Oh yeah, true. But I think when those when those emotions come up, then you say to yourself, ‘Oh I’m here now. Okay, I’ve got this, all right, this is going to happen. I’m going, I’m going to enjoy it.

M: [Laughter]

P: It’s kind of like you invest in it.

M: Alright. We are starting to run out of time. Let’s move to hints and tips for our listeners.

P: Ah, yes. Okay, done.

M: So the Lighthouse Treatment Centre in California has a list of eight things for dealing with grief and loss in recovery, and a lot of this applies. We’re not just talking about grief and loss, necessarily. But we are talking about any reason that you could say, I’m not ok. One and two are about:

1. Acknowledging your emotions; and

2. Talking about your pain.

P: Very, very important. Acknowledging that you’re having negative thoughts is one of the most important first steps in any process. If you’re going to have that cup of tea and go, I’m not sad. Then you’re never going to get past that first hurdle. You’ve got to acknowledge that. Yes, I’m feeling really low, and I feel like I could cry at the drop of a hat.

M: And that’s ok.

P: It’s important. It’s so important.

M: Ok, so moving on number three;

3. If needed, talk about your cravings.

P: Hhmm Interesting.

M: So what do you go to when you’re in a bad place?

P: What’s your reach?

M: Is it alcohol, is it sex, drugs?

P: Yep. And we’ve seen a lot of that with the Corona virus issues, so many people have turned to their cravings to try to satiate their needs.

M: Chocolate.

P: Yeah, all that stuff. But knowing why you do it is important.

M: Martinis.

P: Yeah, Martinis are in a class of their own.

M: Acknowledge them and give them a name and again it’s just about self-awareness.

P: It is.

M: Number four;

4. Use your time creatively.

So part of healing and moving forward is about starting to try.

P: Hhmm. That’s that upswing on the bell curve isn’t it? You’re starting to take control again.

M: Yeah and something that really can help with moving forward is using your time creatively in things like dance or painting or sculpting anything that gets, writing, that gets your creative juices flowing, that you can get lost in an activity is shown to be a little bit helpful in moving forward.

P: Again, it’s an externalisation as well, if you’re doing sculpture or painting that wonderful idea of being Jackson Pollock and just throwing a shitload of paint at the canvas and getting it all out, its externalising, your emotions, it’s putting them out rather than having them in.

M: All right next one, number five;

5. Do something for your loved one.

Now this is more specifically for people who are going through grief. And this involves things like helping to plan for the funeral or writing a poem or putting flowers on a grave, helping the family, clearing out wardrobes can be really tough.

P: Which can be amazingly cathartic at the same time.

M: Yeah.

Okay, so number six;

6. Understand that grief is not linear.

And we’ve spoken about this before. Number seven;

7. Take care of your physical health.

It is so important and we’ve said this a million times on this podcast. That you have a habit of physical activity, and so when things go wrong, you keep that habit going.

P: You cling to it.

M: You can’t actually, when things go wrong, decide to institute that new habit of exercising. That’s just not the time to get the benefits from it.

P: Hhmm, no.

M: So taking care of your physical health and last one, number eight;

8. Taking care of your mental health.

P: That involves doing some of the hard work that we’ve talked about on the podcast. Those exercises and crazy things that the cynic just goes ‘why am I writing about my feelings?!’

[Laughter]

P: It’s so important.

M: But also just a little bit of self-love and forgiveness and care-

P: And reflection

M: – can go a long way. Forgive yourself for not making it to the gym, five times this week or three. Forgive yourself not eating healthy all the time. But look for opportunities to maybe pamper or spoil yourself as well if you’re not in a great emotional state.

P: And it’s also about acknowledging what you have done. The woman that I was reading about Melody Wilding, who is a professor off psychotherapy in Michigan. She talks about focusing on the progress, not on the perfection, so focusing on how much you’ve done to contribute to your own progress and what you’re actually getting to. It’s not about getting to the end point. It’s not like I’m not at having one thousand dollars in my bank account, but I’m making good decisions about my money this week, and I’m not choosing not to go and spend two thousand dollars on something else, which is going to impede my progress to that thousand dollars of savings. It’s a different perspective, and she also talks about recognising that you’re on the path.

So giving yourself a little pat on the back because you’ve taken that first positive step back towards whatever this point is that you need to find and I think that’s a really important aspect when you’re at the bottom of the bell curve is when you take that first step, give yourself a pat, give yourself a high five and go ‘I’m looking after myself.’

M: Absolutely, and taking that step is so important. This is about getting yourself out.

P: You can talk about that one Marie.

M: Yep, and thanks to you.

P: No, no, no, no, it was you all you.

M: Sometimes it takes someone else to give you a bit of a push.

P: [Laugh] Thrust!

M: Alright, well I think that’s all we have time for today.

P: Thanks for joining us today. If you want to hear more, please remember to subscribe and like the podcast. And remember, you can find us at www.marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life, including some really practical tips and resources to get you started on your happiness journey, until next time.

P: Stay happy. Bye.

M: Bye.

[Happy Exit Music]

Why You Need to Stop Skipping Your Lunch Break (E24)

by

Happiness for Cynics Podcast

Many studies have shown that prolonged sitting is the new smoking. Yet despite it being really bad for our health, so many of us don’t take lunch breaks! Join us as we discuss the importance of taking a lunch break, and how to give your brain a rest, get some sun and exercise and eat more mindfully.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.

P: And I’m Peter Furness, a poster hanger, towel folder and furniture re-arranger each week will bring to you the latest news and research in the field of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: You can find us at marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life. We talk about a lot of same research we cover here on the podcast, including some really practical tips for bringing joy and happiness into your life.

P: So on today’s episode, which is all about:

M: Taking a lunch break.

[Happy Intro Music]

M: So Pete. We need to take a lunch break.

P: Oh, I’m bad at this.

M: I’m really bad at it too. Well, no, I swing, I swing. I have no what’s the word I’m looking for? Discipline.

P: I don’t believe that for a second. [Laugh]

M: No, I really have no discipline. I could be really good at this I’m a lunch break taker.

P: Hi, my name’s Marie Skelton lunch break taker.

M: I haven’t had a lunch break for seven years.

P: [Laugh] Yay Marie! Can I get a t-shirt?

M: [Laugh]

So, according to NPR [National Public Radio], the majority of Americans don’t take their lunch breaks.

And you’ve got an Australian stat too, don’t you?

P: Yes, I do.

A lot of Australians don’t take them, either.

Almost one in three [Australians], 28% of people habitually eating at their desk and 33% of people are skipping lunch entirely more than once a week.

M: I’ve definitely been there and actually since I’ve started working from home. So since Covid and self-isolation, I’ve become really bad, really, really bad at it.

P: See, I find that interesting because at home I naturally want to hang out in the kitchen. It’s my happy place, so I I’m very good at getting my..

M: I’m the exact opposite, I’m like I have to go to the kitchen, if I don’t cook my husband’s going to divorce me. It’s been too long.

[Laughter]

P: I’m strange, I use cooking to relax me. So the kitchen’s a happy place for me. But yeah, I often will if I am staying home, I’ll often get up go for a cup of tea, get up have lunch, make some lunch or microwave something.

M: Yeah so I’ll look at the clock and it’ll be two o’clock and I’ll be like crap and I’ll go grab something. I’ve been a lot better, actually diet wise lately, so I’m having salads and doing a good job eating well, but I will bring it back to my desk and eat it while I juggle phone calls and everything.

P: I’m guilty of that as well, being a small business owner and working on a client based schedule, so I’m terrible at keeping my clients to a count and I always go overtime with them. I found that I actually for many years didn’t have a lunch break at all. Then I started allocating a lunch break that was 15 minutes.

M: [Laugh]

P: Woah, go Petie! [Laugh]

I’ve recently increased that to 45[minutes], which is much better because there’s 10 minutes at the beginning of that and there’s five minutes at the end where you’re kind of preparing for the next client or the next client turns up early. So you know, you do get chipped away a little bit, so it probably ends up being about 20/25 minutes. But it is really, really important to schedule it in and what we’re probably going to come to in terms of diet and so forth is making sure that you’re prepared so that you can make maximize that time. So I always bring my lunch in from home, that I’ve cooked and it’s in the microwave on the way before I’ve even said goodbye to the last client.

M: Yeah, I found that I ate a lot more healthily when I brought my own food in definitely, but it encouraged me in the office to then eat it at my desk. Yeah, so going out for lunch made me have to leave the office, and while I was out, I might pop past a shop and have a look or pick something up or just go sit in the park to eat it. And I have to say the times where I have felt the happiest and the most satisfied with life are the times where I’ve had a really good balance at work between motivating, challenging work but enough time to take a lunch break.

P: And it’s really important for your work productivity as well.

M: Yep, absolutely. So there’s three things that not taking a lunch break impacts on:

  • Firstly, your physical health. For a number of years now, people have been saying prolonged sitting is the new smoking.

P: I’m doing this every day.

M: It’s really bad for your physical health.

  • Secondly, your brain needs rest.

P: Absolutely.

M: Particularly for white collar type work. If you’re writing and thinking for a lot of what you do, 9 to 5, you need to give it a little bit of time to rest.

  • And then the third thing is you’ll eat more mindfully if you get away from that activity that you’re doing and sit and enjoy your lunch.

P: Yes.

M: And so if you’re struggling with weight or weight loss. Eating mindfully is one of the biggest new trends in weight loss. It’s not about what you eat. It’s about more mindful about how you eat is the latest thing there. So definitely taking a lunch break can have a huge impact on your weight loss journey.

P: I want to pick you up on that second point as well Marie, in terms of the productivity and having the break. There is a lot of science that supports the fact that we need to stimulate our brains in different ways to allow different pathways to be accessed and allow different synapses to open up. So frontal lobe, parietal lobe, accessing the different lobes makes for a healthy brain. And if you are obsessed over a problem or an issue and you’re focused and you’re inside that issue for over an hour, I can’t quote the study because I didn’t have time to look this up. I know this is true, so you’ve just got to blind faith here.

[Laughing]

P: Walking away from the problem and then coming back, allows you to reset.

M: Yep.

P: It allows new ideas to drop in and allows you to come back and perhaps look at the issue in a different way, which results in a better, it brings about a better result.

M: Also what we were all told, when we’re studying for exams at school, come back to it. Yes, because the more you focus on something the less likely you are to solve it. But the other thing is, we have natural body rhythms and –

P: – Circadian rhythms.

M: Yes, that’s day and night time sleep. We’ve also got a 90 minute blocks of time that your body goes through during the day. Right? So again, there’s so many different studies and different research about whether your body clock or your brain in their own different times at times can function. Some people say, for only as much as 20 minutes at a time. If you’re fully focused. So again it depends who you look at, whose study.

P: Yep

M: And again the other side is, they say take a break. Now what does that mean? So some studies have definitely shown that just a few minutes is enough to help you reset and go again. But taking as little as 20 minutes in one study has been shown to increase your productivity for the entire day. So if you can’t do anything else, take a 20 minute lunch break.

P: Yep. And the idea of having 20 minutes is, it’s long enough to actually allow yourself to be distracted and to re-energise and to be distracted by something else. And getting up and physically getting away from the desk is really important there, because walking around is going to stimulate a whole heap of body things that go on that create chemical reactions and allow your brain to focus. But it’s allowing your physicality to override what’s going on in the brain. And it wakes everything up gets things stimulated and moving.

M: I think it also resets you. So as someone who’s been through burnout at work through a particularly busy period in Corporate Australia. So I was working for a large corporate we we’re going through a royal commission I was working in public affairs.

P: He he.. [Laugh]

M: Things were shit.

[Laughter]

M: Right? And I just felt like I didn’t want to go take lunch because I didn’t want to be there for another 30 minutes at the end of the day. It just meant, I wouldn’t get through everything, and I’d be there until eight o’clock, not seven thirty or whatever it was. So the logic made sense and I was still just slugging through stuff that I needed to get through. But what that lunch break does is it stops that day to day build of stress, the cortisol levels that build over time. It’s a circuit breaker, and it takes you back to zero again. So the irony of that burnout period is that I knew I needed to exercise, but I stopped exercising. I knew I needed to eat well because it was going to be a very stressful year… or three.

[Laughter]

M: And I started taking getting take out. I didn’t have time to prep my meals. I knew I needed to just get out and get some sun even.

P: Yes.

M: Get outside and to take that mental break. And I just felt that I couldn’t and lo and behold, burnout.

P: Funny that.

[Laughter]

M: We know it and I think that’s the trick, really is actually finding a way to dig yourself out of that hole when you know you’re in it.

P: And that’s where the physical thing can come out, getting yourself…

M: But even 20 minutes, and you can combine them all. Get outside, eat a salad or some protein and vegetables. Eat something healthy-ish.

P: Eat something you’ve cooked yourself. It’s as simple as that.

M: If you’ve got time or find time. Or buy it, I mean there’s plenty of options in most big cities or food courts. You can find healthy food and then walk for the rest of the lunchtime. Get out in the sun or through the mall if it’s raining and walk.

P: I’ve actually found that I do that myself. If now that I have my prolonged lunch break [laugh], I actually go. Oh, I’ve had my lunch, I’ve not done anything, I’ll go around the block and it is just a simple walk around the block, and it’s just to get out, get a different stimulus, get outside even though it’s in CBD and it might be a bit smoggy and so forth. It’s still, it’s still better than staying in those four walls because you feel like you’ve had a change and then you can come back for the afternoon session and go hard again.

M: And just getting your muscles moving.

P: Mmm really important.

M: Absolutely so they say sitting is the new smoking. So it is definitely proven to not be as bad a smoking. But just like everyone jumped on the idea that smoking was bad and we saw all those horrible ads come out. Australia’s really bad for shock ads. I’m surprised we haven’t seen sitting shock ads. What do you make of that?

P: I don’t know. It’s probably not dramatic enough.

M: [Laugh] A whole bunch of people just sitting around, “oh the horror!”

P: “Oh the humanity!”

M: The diseases and illnesses that are tied to long term sitting include cancer, heart disease and type two diabetes. And the research shows that the effects of long term sitting are not reversible through exercise or other good habits.

P: That’s a very interesting one.

M: Can’t take these [away].

P: You can’t get it back.

M: And It’s also going to take time off the end of your life. So morbidity rates with not being able to move, comes back to that lovely little test you can do about getting sitting cross legged on the floor.

M: Yes, this is a good one.

P: And getting up without using your hands.

M: Yes, so if anyone hasn’t seen this, they give this test to people in their sixties, seventies, eighties and nineties, and they ask you to sit down on the floor with your legs crossed. And then if you can kind of rock forward onto your feet and get your body up into a standing position without putting your hands down, then you’ve got the core strength and flexibility that you should be able to live far longer into the future.

P: And have a better quality of life in your senior years and because it’s the ability to be able to get yourself up that has complete links with morbidity, with heart disease with diabetes and it also [is good] in terms of range of motion and being able to look after yourself in case you fall.

M: Well it actually shows that you are less likely to fall because you’ve got the body strength.

P: Exactly.

M: And once someone who’s elderly falls and starts losing their balance, then it’s a very quick decline from that point forward. Generally.

P: Yes

M: The other thing that adds onto that is the injuries that come with the fall. The broken hips or legs etc. Also not good.

P: Yeah

M: Anyway this is a complete sidebar.

So taking lunch breaks.

P: [Laugh]

M: Maybe we can all sit down and practise standing up…

[Laughter]

P: with your lunch!

[Laughter]

M: So what are some good things to do, even if you only have 20 minutes, we’ve talked about a few of them already. So if you’re going to take a lunch break, you’re busy, you’re stressed. How do you maximise that 20 minutes that you make time for, if you can only make time for 10 minutes. What do you do?

P: Prepare. You’ve got to be prepared.

M: That takes more time Pete.

P: No, what I’m saying is that if you know you’ve got 20 minutes for a lunch break. Then you need to pre-prepare your meals. You need to have that installed so that you don’t waste 15 minutes wandering around the food court going, ‘Oh do I have curry? Or do I have sushi? Do I have curry? Do I have sushi?

M: Well, see my mind would say prepare before I leave the office to go get sushi.

P: Well that works. That’s still preparing.

M: Straight downstairs, get something that’s not deep fried.

P: You know what you’re going to have. You know what you’re going to have and you’re setting up and you have a goal in place. So you’re not going to be distracted by the deep fried southern chicken burger which may have come to $10.50 from Betty’s burgers today.

[Laughter]

M: Oh I love Betty’s Burgers.

Which is still okay, in moderation.

P: Absolutely.

M: Alright. So you’re saying prepare. I’m saying get outside and mindfulness. So once you’re outside, if you are struggling to find 20 minutes a day to go and have a lunch break and you need to maximize the time that you spend then:

  1. Make sure that you refuel, obviously, and the healthier the better, as we all know. But refueling is refueling.
  2. Secondly, get some sun if you can.
  3. Thirdly, while you’re out, take a moment to look at nature. So wherever you are it’s about stopping and smelling the roses or at least noticing them.

P: Yes

M: And that is a really good reset for your brain. So this is that mental reset. If you go out and you rush from shop to shop and you have to pick up milk for breakfast tomorrow and you get your food and you make it back. And oof, you’re out of breath and it’s been 20 minutes. There’s some definite positive benefits from a physical and recharge perspective, but not necessarily from a mental health perspective.

P: Okay.

M: So if you’ve just rushed through your lunch break and it’s just another tick box activity for you that you had to get done and that you had to make sure happened in your day. You’re not resting your brain. If it’s a stress to get it done. So just taking those moments to enjoy the sun on your face or to stop and smell or notice the roses or even the grass.

P: It’s funny when I’m like working in the CBD. I often find myself searching for green space because there’s, where I am, which is down towards King Street Warf, it’s actually a bit of a walk to get to Hyde Park and that’s really the only green space in that corner of the CBD. There’s blue space, which is down by Cockle bay, which is fine, but to be actually able to sit and have your lunch in a green area. It’s actually not that easy in the CBD of Sydney.

M: And to get sun at the same time, you’re in shade most of the time.

P: Yeah.

M: Absolutely, if you’re in the middle, it’s a decent hike.

P: It’s where roof gardens would be really advantageous.

M: Yeah, we don’t do roof gardens in Australia.

P: We don’t make enough. I don’t think we do to take enough advantage of our rooves in Sydney. I think that we’re falling short on that one a little bit. Maybe another episode, [Laugh].

But I do want to clock one thing about exercising in your lunch break.

M: Yes

P: Now I was shocked by this one. According to my stats, only 7% of us use the lunch break to exercise, which I really didn’t think I thought would be a lot higher in Australia.

M: Hold on look, it takes women, and men, but mainly women 30 minutes to get ready in the morning, at least often an hour, depending on what your hair rituals are. If you’ve showered and washed your hair, which you have to do after you sweat. Okay before you go, especially corporate. Before you go back into an office, it’s let me just say it’s rude if you don’t. Let me just put that out there. If you do now shower after you exercise and you come back in the office. Don’t come near me. It is not something that everyone wants to smell in their two o’clock meeting.

P: [Laugh], no definitely not.

M: So I fully understand why people wouldn’t exercise at lunch because you just don’t have time to turn it around. You’ve got to get there and back. You’ve got to do the exercise, whatever it is and you’ve got, if you’re doing something that makes you sweaty; if you’re going to go do a nice stretching class.

P: You can still sweat.

M: A nice, light stretching class. Then maybe you could make that work without the shower and all the prep to get back into your corporate attire that goes afterwards.

P: I still, I was a lunchtime exerciser. I would duck down in between 11 and 12:30-

M: -That’s an hour and a half.

P: So 90 minutes and it didn’t always happen, but yeah again it was about planning that in. So that was a Tuesday and Thursday thing, and I knew that Tuesdays and Thursdays I took 90 minutes, again scheduling and preparing and that was my days exercise. Where I did go down and do some exercise in that time and then come back so that I was ready and prepped to go again in the afternoon.

M: I think that’s lunch break Nirvana to be able to do that.

P: [Laugh]

M: But then you’ve also got to find time to eat as well, and that’s the potential downside to putting exercise in.

P: And that’s what I wasn’t doing as well. In that I was grabbing food on the fly and shoving it in and half eating lunch and then waiting for the next client and half eating it after that. Yeah, maybe I wasn’t quite clocking that in the right way, but it felt like I was.

M: Well look I think it never hurts to get some exercise in at lunchtime. To get some exercise in, in general.

P: Well, again, it helps your mental energy as well.

M: Yes. Oh, so good for your happiness levels in general. All right, well, I think that’s about it for today.

P: Done.

M: Thank you for joining us. If you do want to hear more, please remember to subscribe and like this podcast.

P: Stay happy, people.

Related content: Listen to our Podcast: Wellbeing and Your Environment (E21)

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The Importance of Authenticity (E23)

by

Happiness for Cynics Podcast

Authenticity is about being able to stand loud and proud and say “this is who I am” and not conform to the majority’s ideals. But authenticity has tended to be a struggle for marginalized peoples throughout history.

Today’s topic is timely and topical in light of next week’s World Pride celebrations because around the world so many LGBTIQ+ people still do not feel that they can be their authentic self. Listen to this week’s episode to find out why it’s important to be your authentic self and the steps you can take to be more authentic in your life.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast Happiness for Cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.

P: And I’m Peter Furness, a man doing what I can, shaking my shablam, …

Okay, that should be on Sesame Street.

M: I don’t know what you said in that bit there.

P: OH! Rude. Each week we will bring to you the latest science and research in the field of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: Yes, you can find us at marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life.

P: I think you should introduce today’s episode. I’ve always done it.

M: Today’s episode is about authenticity.

[Happy Intro Music]

M: We’re unofficially brought to you by Hendrix today.

P: Cheers, [laugh]. I feel like Jane Fonda.

M: Sweet Martinis.

Okay, so Pete, next week is Global Pride.

P: Yay!

M: Woohoo! So, for those of you may that not be familiar with global pride. It provides an opportunity for the LGBTQI++ community around the world, come together on June 27th and celebrate diversity and equality. If you hear clinks through the episode, we maybe should not have poured Martinis before we started.

[Laughter]

P: It’s World Pride who cares? [Laugh] Everything is fabulous.

M: It is, it is Fabulous. So the tagline this year is Exist, Persist, Resist. And I think today’s topic is really timely and topical in light of Pride next week. So we’re talking about authenticity and authenticity has tended to be a struggle for a lot of marginalised societies and the LGBTQI++ group as a whole. Is still going through many rights fights and even though we’ve had some great wins, we last year got marriage equality in Australia.

P: Yes, Australia.

M: Finally

P: Yes, well done. It seems like such a long time ago now doesn’t it.

M: Yep, definitely.

P: Such a celebrated day.

M: So much has happened. They promptly got the right to marry and then were told they couldn’t marry because of COVID.

[Laughter]

P: You can get married; you just can’t have a ceremony.

M: [Laugh] So authenticity has been a struggle for a lot of marginalised peoples throughout history. And it’s about being able to stand loud and proud and say ‘this is who I am’ and not conform to the majority’s ideals. And I guess the way that that has translated throughout history is for aboriginal peoples in our country we’d ask them to be more white; And for women we’ve asked them to be more like men, particularly in the workplace.

P: I like this take on it Marie. That idea.

M: And being in a corporate, very male dominated industry for a lot of my career. I’ve definitely heard things not necessarily targeted at me, but towards women such as “you’re too emotional or your waffle.” Who would say that to a man, right?

P: Oh, I get that all the time.

[Laughter]

M: And the LGBTQI++ community, you would get a lot of the people in that same corporate environment being told to tone down behaviour and how they dress what they wear. Different cultures also get told the same thing. So being authentic is about bucking the trend in a way. But you’ve got to feel safe to do that as well.

P: You do, yeah. Being authentic requires a lot of work. I’m actually going to go back to our first episode where we said that happiness is not a destination. It’s a result of doing the things that we do. I feel that authenticity is the same. Authenticity is not a destination. You’ve still got to do the constant work. It’s not that you go “Oh I’m authentic now, yay happy me.” It’s actually something you have to revisit and realign because it comes down to values and beliefs.

M: And it comes into understanding your values and beliefs. It’s so easy to get caught up in what the majority thinks is right and just go along with it. And then there is a disconnect that happens at a subconscious level that can leave you feeling depressed, sad, not connected with those around you and not really understanding why.

P: Exactly, it’s making those conscious decisions as opposed to going along with the trend as you say.

M: The other group, I think, right now that is struggling with authenticity are millennials and the reason, the reason is that there’s so much more pressure on our younger generations now because they’re living every second of their lives on social media for everyone to see and what they’re, they’re being watched by others and they’re watching others and comparing themselves to others. And the images that we present on our social media profiles are just representations of who we think we should be.

P: Or the representations of our best parts. We’re putting out in the public sphere the best bits, only the best bits.

M: But again, the best bits because of who we think we should be.

P: Yep, OK.

M: Who we think others –

P: – want us to be.

M: Yes, yes. So there’s this whole new aspect that we’re still grappling with, how to manage and millennials have grown up in that. So the pressure to conform is even bigger, I think for these newer generations and for I’d say gen x and y as well, although they haven’t grown up with this to fit in. And I guess the question is; How do we take off the mask that we’re wearing and learn to live a life of authenticity?

P: Yes. I want to throw something at you there Marie, because there is a certain aspect of the millennial existence where some people might say “no, no they’ve got so much more freedom. They’ve got so much more capability to actually buck the trend and be who they are.” And we’re seeing that with a lot of the fluidity between identities and things like that.

M: I guess where I’m maybe not agreeing with you is that I still think the pressure to conform during your teen years is a far more powerful motivator for the majority than the ability to be an individual.

P: That comes down to approval, doesn’t it?

M: I definitely think so. And I think that comes all the way back to our evolution and genes, which is that those who are ostracised from the group generally don’t live very long, and there is a biological need to be part of the group and be accepted, and we’ve looked at making friends and being social in the past, and there’s so much research that shows that so while we may have an ability to, be different and to express that and our limits for what difference will accept today are a lot broader than they used to be 30 years ago.

P: Yes, Definitely. That’s my point.

M: We can be a lot more fringe than we ever used to be able to be, but it still takes a very strong person in their teens to stand up on those edges and proudly say, “this is who I am” and it’s not the norm.

P: Yep, yep. I agree.

M: So for those people, give me a call I want to know what your secret is?

P: [Laughter]

M: All right, so what are we talking about when it comes to authenticity?

P: What does it mean to be authentic?

M: All right, well I have an answer to that. Do you have an answer?

P: You go. You go girl.

M: All right. It’s a concept in psychology. So this is a social sciences discussion that we’re having at the moment, and it’s also a philosophical discussion. So authenticity is discussed quite a bit in existentialist philosophy. So in existentialism, authenticity is the degree to which an individual’s actions are congruent with their beliefs and desires despite external pressures.

P: Yes.

M: So that’s the ‘what is normal?’ What is the majority doing piece. And it’s how much do your actions match –

P: – your beliefs and desires? They are the really important words there; beliefs and desires, values and beliefs. This is the crux of being authentic.

M: Absolutely. So an individual who is considered authentic is someone who’s striving to always act in the way that they believe. And I do want to say that just because we fail that that doesn’t mean you’re inauthentic.

P: No, no.

M: So it is the word strive implies that you’ve always got to be trying as I mentioned before.

P: Doing the work.

M: And this is something that has become really popular lately, being authentic, thanks to Brené Brown and we talk about Authentic Leadership. And really, what we’re saying in big corporations when we’re looking for authentic leadership is a bit of vulnerability is what people are looking for. So having a view into your beliefs, values, your imperfections and you as a person could help me bond with you a little bit more as well. So not just always having that perfect facade up that we see in social media.

P: And there’s a lot of points to come on that later on.

M: But it also means that the people who are not part of the majority can perhaps see some of themselves in you.

P: Definitely, which leads to bonding and community.

M: Diversity and inclusion. You said there were a range of things you wanted to jump on there.

P: [Laugh]

M: Give it to me!

P: We all have a bullshit detector. And this is authentic behaviour. If your bullshit detector is going off it means that you’re seeing someone being not authentic. So I just, I didn’t slap my thigh.

M: After slapping the table. I’m going to seriously put you in a straightjacket when we have these conversations and bring a straw for your Martini.

P: [Laughter] so being authentic, what do you have to do to be authentic?

M: I don’t think it’s about sharing all of yourself.

P: Definitely not, no.

M: But it’s about sharing enough of yourself that people feel that they can get to know you.

P: Yes. So getting to know you, you have to be clear within yourself. What you’re presenting, I guess, to the world; and that’s where the beliefs and values comes into it being able to do the work that involves you going down and clarifying what you believe in, clarifying what your values are. That’s the work side of it.

If you haven’t done that amount of self-reflection and done the delving into your deepest, darkest centre, which is tough work, it’s hard to sit there and go through exercises from psycho analysis and these self-help ideas. It’s not easy. It doesn’t just happen. You have to actually do the work. Then the next step is making decisions and changing your behaviours to reflect those values.

M: Hold on. I’d say there’s a step between that.  

P: Go for it.

M: Acceptance.

P: Yes

M: There is self-acceptance and self-love, and particularly if I can speak on behalf of the LGBTQI++ community. There is a lot of hateful rhetoric out there. That means that a lot of people, once they come to the realisation and they’ve done their self-awareness work, that they are who they are –

P: – in the face of public pressure.

M: Despite what their parents might think, what the church might think, … why the society might think they are who they are. Then there is definitely a piece of self-acceptance and love that needs to heal.

P: Yeah.

M: A little bit there as well. And then it’s about aligning your behaviour’s.

P: Yep, very much agree. I’ll hook in here with a quote. “It’s about unhooking from the past, doing the work to silence the self-talk or the voices of others. What is your truth?”

M: The voices of others? That’s that piece. These are steps that are tightly interlinked. Definitely, it’s really hard to do that though if you feel alone.

P: Completely, yeah. It’s difficult.

M: Yeah, and I think in particular there’s a lot of people in the LGTBQI++ community who struggle with depression. So coming back to Pride next week and being authentic. There are much higher numbers for a lot of marginalised groups. Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander groups have higher levels of depression as well. And there’s a range of groups throughout society who have dealt with the mental health implications of not feeling part of society.

P: And that comes back to what we were talking about in earlier podcasts about that willingness to bond, that sense of community and –

M: – belonging

P: Yep, finding your tribe.

M: Find your tribe, definitely. Now I do just want to be really careful here and say that this podcast is global because we’re on the World Wide Web and in some communities it may not be safe to be who you are.

P: Mmn, yeah. That’s an interesting one.

M: I’m just going to park that there and say we’re not advocating for you to be authentic and come out and be who you are if it may endanger your life for your safety.

P: Very True.

M: So we’re in a pretty lucky society here, but we still do see a lot of homophobia and hatred in general.

P: And there are repercussions for that if you choose to be that self, that authentic person you’re putting yourself very much in harm’s way.

M: Yeah, definitely, and that is a horrible and heartbreaking reality that a lot of people are living with.

P: And it’s the reminder. I think a lot of people say, “You know we’ve had this argument for so many years. Isn’t it done yet?” No, it’s not done yet. You know, we’ll never be done. And that comes down to a lot of the other genres that you’ve mentioned the race genre, the female genre.

M: We’re seeing that play out in the States right now. And being Australian, we’ve definitely got the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander element, and we are still grappling with how we’ve treated that population in the past, but it is 3% of our population and it is widely unreported and under reported in general. And when I lived in America, I got over there and I remember saying to a friend, I just don’t understand why this is still an issue. It was so long ago. Why are we still talking about race and why isn’t everyone –

P: – on board?

M: Yeah, I don’t, I don’t get it and she said. My grandma was stoned in the streets. Sorry, her Mum, her Mum in the seventies. That’s 10 years before I was born, not even [that] depending on when in the seventies. So it was fresh for her and her mother had raised her never to walk the streets alone. I’ve never had to deal with that, right. So it is very fresh in American society. And I think we’re seeing that play out right now. Yeah, unfortunately.

Alright, so, I guess. Let’s finish with how to be authentic.

P: Ooh, the skills of authenticity. There’s so many.

M: So if it is safe to be authentic in your community and you feel that there is a disconnect and it is impacting your mental health. You’re not living out and proud or being your true self. What are the next steps Pete?

P: There’s many actually did a list and it went 20 long, so it’s really difficult. I had to go back and go ‘ok what are the important ones’, the important ones are the values and beliefs.

1. Identify your values, identify your beliefs and act on them.

So when you’re faced with a decision, don’t go for the shiny. It’s like buying a car. Don’t get for the shiny new one that’s got the pretty seats. It’s like; let’s go back to the question. What are my values and beliefs? What’s going to be best for me in this decision? Make those decisions according to what is true for you. So identifying your values and beliefs [is] really, really important. A good phrase for that is [your] contentment over [others] approval. As we’re talking about, don’t do what society expects of you, do what is right for you and your inner contentment and inner peace.

2. Sincerity.

Being sincere. This is another quality that can come into decisions. If you’re being sincere with yourself and with others, that’s bringing your values to light. And it’s not giving false compliments “Oh Marie, you look fabulous in that dress.” … I’m sorry Green is not your colour. I do it with my sister all the time. She’s like “should I take this photo shoot for my new book?” I’m like no you look middle aged and frumpy.

M: Oh! Pete.

P: Lift your chin in a photo girl,

M: Pete!

P: because I love her. It’s my sincerity. It’s my thing. It’s like “no you can take a better photo.” Let’s be sincere about that. You asked for my opinion.

M: And I’m going to tie that into vulnerability. Sincere and vulnerable are really interlinked. And for anyone who is new to all of this and wants a really quick short sharp education in this area, go look up Brené Brown’s Ted talks, really good intro to all of this and go buy her book. She is just fabulous.

P: So there are other quick, quick ones. I’ll run through and these are more skills for looking at what you can do in the moment.

3. Accepting your reality

Don’t wish that it wasn’t what it is. It is what it is, and you’ve got to accept some of that. So come back to your values and beliefs and go what can I do to change this?

4. Owning your side of the street

I like this one. You feel the way you do because of your reactions, not because of someone else’s actions. So if I’m feeling hurt by something that you’ve done, there’s a bit of responsibility in there for me. It’s not just about the actions that someone else has done to me. It’s like, how have I contributed to that emotion?

M: Or what is my world view that’s making me react with anger or pain or jump down someone’s throat?

P: Definitely.

M: When they may not have even meant it that way.

P: Exactly.

5. Respect your body

Making sure that you respect who you are and what you have. Clink for that?

[Glasses clink, laughter]

M: Respect your body. Alcohol’s a poison, did you know that?

P: But it’s so fabulous. It makes me chirpy.

M: It does and that’s respecting my mind. There is mind and body.

P: And it’s respecting your happiness. I’m a happy drinker so, as long as it doesn’t take me to the other side. Oh, I’ll start with this last one. Last one,

6. Emotions are temporary

M: Oh! That’s so hard in the moment though.

P: It’s so hard. But if you can.. these are little skills, these are little phrases that you can use if you’re feeling vulnerable, upset, angry, even know that emotions a temporary and that they will pass on that you should never take decisions when you’re in heightened states of emotion, try and let the emotions drop down a little bit before you respond before you take action.

M: Particularly if that anger or emotion might lead to violence.

P: Definitely. Yeah, it’s always best to sit on it, sleep on it, think about it the next day.

M: And if you’re in the workplace, go find a trusted person, particularly if they’re outside of the workplace, drink, have a vent, whatever works for you and then with a fresh head the next day.

D: And venting is good, someone apologised to me this morning because they had to vent. Dude, no vent away, a problem shared is a problem halved. I’m so wise when I have a Martini. Look at me go!

[Laughter]

M: On that note we’re going to finish up today.

P: Just let me give one more piece of wisdom?

M: I am definitely a proud LGBTQI++ ally.

P: You so are.

M: And I want to wish everyone happy Pride this month. There’s a lot of pride activities happening virtually, and I hope that things continue to move in the positive direction that they have been.

P: Definitely, yeah.

M: I think the gay rights movement has definitely taken leaps and bounds.

P: And everyone can benefit from that. Be your own fabulous self.

M: Be fabulous!

P: Yes, be fabulous! You are fabulous, all of you!

M: Until next time.

P: Stay happy people.

[Exit Happy Music]

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The Benefits of Volunteering (E22)

by

Happiness for Cynics Podcast

This week’s episode is all about the benefits of volunteering. From living a longer and healthier life to having deeper friendships, there really is nothing volunteering can’t do to make your life better and happier!

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.

P: And I am Peter Furness, a recycler, a composter and a reactionary environmentalist. Each week we will bring to you the latest news and research in the world of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: Thanks, Pete. You can find us at marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life. We talk about a lot of the same research recover here on the podcast, including some really practical tips for bringing joy and happiness into your life.

P: So on to today’s episode, which is all about volunteering.

Happy intro Music] 

M: Okay, so we’re talking about volunteering today. A big one, a really good one. Why should we volunteer Pete? 

P: So much good things come from volunteering, things that you might not think about it initially. But essentially, we know that volunteering works well for bringing about meaningful, purposeful lives and also for bringing out feel good things like oxytocin and progesterone.  

M: Isn’t progesterone one of the female chemicals?  

P: No that’s Oestrogen.  

M: Ok, alright… 

P: It’s in there though, I’m not exactly sure of the ratio but hey we could all do with some female stuff. 

M: Volunteering doesn’t make you more feminine? 

P: [Laugh] It makes you wussy. 

[Laughter] 

M: We take that back. [More laughter] 

P: No, no, no. The good benefits of volunteering are numerous and magnanimous.  

M: Sure and it’s also, so we are definitely going to focus in on volunteering today, but it does cross over into so many of the other areas, like so many things we talk about that we’ve discussed in the past. So it helps you to find purpose in your life. It often can help you be more social, depending on the activity you pick. It also helps you to be more generous and practise kindness and all of those things in their own right without the volunteering component are proven to have positive benefits for your life.  

P: I think that volunteering as well deserves its own episode because it’s a practical thing that we can do. It’s one of the techniques that we can actually do that leads to happiness. So whilst you’re not consciously going ‘I’m going to have a meaningful purpose in my life.’ You are just going down and helping out at the cake store, so it’s something that we could just do again. Like the self-care is church from non-believers episode. That was a great example of something really practical that we can do that gives us the benefits and leads to happiness without us really even trying. 

M: For me I think the real benefit out of this one is in helping to combat the loneliness epidemic.  

P: Yes. Very good. 

M: This is a topic that’s been around the last couple of years, and there’s been a lot of discussion over many years about the loneliness levels of our elderly populations. But more recently, we’ve been discussing how lonely our millennials are. 

P: Yes, we have talked about that. 

M: Yeah, yeah, and I think that this gives you something to do, especially if you’re an introvert and not so comfortable with rocking up to networking events to meet people, it gives you something to do, and you meet people secondarily and conform really close bonds. While the focus isn’t in that awkward trying to meet someone. 

P: It’s not speed dating people, that’s not volunteering.  

[Laughter] 

M: No [laugh]. So you can go in and volunteer, and that’s why you’re there, and it gives you a reason for being and in the meantime, you forge strong relationships depending on the activity, and I think that’s another benefit that we don’t necessarily need to deep dive into, but another reason why you might choose volunteering over some other self-care or positive psychology activities.  

P: It’s funny because I think when you approach people for that; I’ve been on that side of the equation where I’m trying to get people to volunteer and often the responses that come back are ‘oh no, I haven’t got time. I’ve got such a hectic lifestyle. I couldn’t possibly commit to that sort of stuff.’ 

M: Mm-hmm 

P: This is going to be the episode for you because it’s going to show you exactly the huge amounts of benefits that will come out of this that might surprise you and actually have some selfish, selfish additions in there as well. You can be selfish and volunteer. Sure, so I was having a look and on Psychology Today, which is a really accessible site, and I encourage you to have a look at some of their articles as well. It’s not psych babble. It is, as I said, really accessible. So Dr. Dawn Carr published an article on ‘Five Reasons Why You Should Volunteer’.  

1. Volunteers live longer and healthier.

2. They establish strong relationships, as we said before

3. It’s good for your career.

P: Ah, there’s that selfish reason.

[Laughter]

M: Well so far, they’re all pretty selfish. He’s the nice one, the warm and fuzzy one.

4. It’s good for society.

P: It benefits everyone.

M: Yeah, and then the last one, number 5 is:

5. It gives you a sense of purpose.

And again, we’ve shown how that can also directly lead to increased happiness levels.

P: Yeah, definitely. 

M: So there are studies, so many studies that show all of all of this stuff and you’ve been looking at a few studies as well haven’t you Pete?  

P: I have yeah. A couple, Professor Stijn Baert, I think I pronounced that correctly, talks a lot about how research shows that volunteering can increase employment. It can increase your employment opportunities and increase your skill base, which is one of those lovely selfish reasons. The idea of paying it forward, which has actually come about in the Random Acts of Kindness Foundation in 1995.  

M: And they’ve got a website. Just look up Random Acts of Kindness, they’ve got so many great tools there but we’re going to cover that another time actually.  

P: Definitely. There was also a study in 2018 on a Spanish company where they had a control group that was a generosity group. They were giving out acts of kindness within the workplace, and what they found was that people were even happier and more content than those who actually received the acts of kindness. So by people giving out those acts of kindness by being generous and volunteering their time and so forth they get, they got more benefits than just receiving it.  

M: I wonder if that also translates to giving gifts. Because I know at times I look really closely at the person’s face when I give a gift.  

P: [Laugh]  

M: Because I’m a horrible gift giver and I can’t help it. I’m so bad.  

P: [Laugh] Do you really like it? Do you really like it? Do you really? 

M: Oh, and I’ve just got this complex now, I can’t get over it. 

P: Do you keep every receipt and like hold onto it for a year?   

M: Yeah and I shove receipts in people’s hands and go, please, please exchange if you don’t like it? Please don’t, don’t feel bad. I want you to. Go exchange it, I know you hate it.  

P: [Laugh] 

M: You know, I’ll talk myself into a frenzy. But I wonder. Gift giving comes with so much anxiety for me.  

P: There’s your introverted nature.  

M: I just want them to like it.  

P: Yeah, I know. But the benefit does come about and even if it doesn’t work for them, they can always pass it on to somebody else. 

M: All right. And then there’s a few other studies that I was looking at as well that are quite interesting I thought. There’s one in the Journal of Happiness Studies that says that acts of charity or volunteer work can make you feel better and happier, which we just have mentioned. But this study goes even further, and it shows that even simply wishing someone well can have a positive effect on your mood. And in fact, even witnessing someone else performing an act of kindness produces oxytocin so it aids in lowering your blood pressure, improves self-esteem, optimism and overall heart health. So even if you just surround yourself with people who are doing good.  

P: You don’t even have to do it yourself. You can just be a quiet observer. ‘I’m just here for the tea and bickies.’ 

[Laughter] 

M: I love it. So there’s another one that I really love. There are two more and I’m going to share them because these are just great little studies. So there’s one from Harvard. I know the one that you’re wanting to talk about Pete. We’ll get to that one in a second. There’s one from Harvard that says that volunteering at least once a week yields improvements to wellbeing equivalent to doubling your annual salary.  

P: And who doesn’t want a double salary? 

M: I think I’ll take the money thanks.  

P: [Laugh] Pay off that mortgage.  

M: Yep, they say money can’t buy happiness, but I’m sure I’d make a go of it.  

P: [Laugh] It’s a good relative indicator, isn’t it? Would you like to go and volunteer? Or would you like double your salary?  

M: Yep, no one’s giving you double your salary, so you may as well go volunteer. 

P: There you go.  

[Laughter] 

M: And then the last study that, Pete is jumping at the bit – 

P: volunteering gives you more sex!  

[Laughter] 

M: I think you’re leaping. 

P: Yes, is this where we share our personal stories? 

M: Yeah, um I edit the podcast Pete so… 

P: Damnit.  

M: It is a very big leap to say that volunteering makes you get more sex – 

P: But come on the science says so. 

M: Well, kind of, kind of. For those who are the cynics and you actually care about the detail of the studies. So being altruistic makes you sexier to the opposite sex.  

P: [sexy cat purr] 

M: And in a study that was published by the British Journal of Psychology, they gave people $100 in cash and asked them what they would do with the money and those who are willing to donate the money. So those who would naturally or genuinely more altruistic also reported having more lifetime and or casual sex partners over the previous years. 

P: Bada bing bada boom! 

[Laughter]  

M: So, I am going to say that it doesn’t talk about cause and effect here, but 

P: we’re running with it [laugh]. 

M: What they’re saying here is altruists get more sex.  

P: There we go, I can see why it’s an attractive quality it makes, it makes someone be attracted to you because they can see a noble quality that makes you go ‘oh they’re going to be generous. They’re gonna be generous in the relationship, they’re going to be generous in their life.’ 

M: Well, particularly from a female point of view, it is something that you would want your husband particularly if you have very limited choice about who you’re marrying. It’s a trait you would be looking for, depending on the country you’re from or the century you’re in. I would imagine that altruism and generosity would be positive traits that you’d be very grateful for having and then, secondly, it also would reflect well on the type of person you want to raise your Children.  

P: This is an interesting point because this is one of the points that I came up with is that volunteering as a family is a thing.  

M: Yes  

P: It sets good examples. It shows Children, you involved in acts of generosity, which they then emulate, especially if they’re involved in volunteering at a young age. So if you’re going along to the weekly cake store, take your three year old with you because they’ll go along. They’ll see you having a fun time. And I’ll make that Connection without even really thinking about it in their conscious thought of ‘Oh yeah if I give this then that’s going to create a good connection with these other people.’  

M: Yep, I think one of the easy ones to do is soup kitchens with kids. 

P: Hhmm well you told, there’s a point that you talked about in terms of one of the greatest acts of volunteering is food. 

M: Aarghh, That’s my quick fact.  

P: Oh sorry, I – 

M: – jumped ahead. So just a quick fact for all of you out there who didn’t hear what Pete just said. Most volunteer activity involves the collection and distribution of food. 

P: I like it. I mean, I give cakes to my personal trainer.  

M: My, what’s the word I’m looking for? a person who helps with my rehab at the hospital.  

P: Physio. 

M: Physio [Laugh]. They’ve got the physio that’s attached to the hospital, so there’s a bunch of them that all work in the same clinic, and unfortunately they get a lot of people out of the Osteo[porosis] ward. So, Grandmas and grandpas who have torn ligaments in their shoulders or you know as you get older things wear and tear a bit more, and they’re always being given cakes and baked goods. Always the poor things.  

[Laughter] 

M: They’re like ‘We are going to be so fat by the time we’ve finished this career.’  

P: [Laugh] that’s the whole point making my PT just a little bit chubbier, you know so I can feel good about myself. [Laughter] If you’re watching [listening] that’s not really the reason.  

M: It’s selfish that one.  

P: I like this. I like the idea of being volunteering as selfish. I mean, I’m going to throw some more at you.  It lessens the symptoms of chronic pain.  

M: Yes, so much of this stuff does it’s the oxytocin. 

P: It’s the neurotransmitters. It’s all those happy drugs that go into, you flood your body with when you’re involved in acts of kindness and volunteering. So that’s another good one. The Increase in your job skills, which leads to a higher income. Now, I really liked this one. This again comes back to the study that was done by a number of American psychologists in the American Psychological Association Journal, and they said that having volunteering on your CV is attractive to people who might employ you.

And also it is associated with being in a position to be able to be a volunteer because you are on a higher income. But they actually did a study that negated those influences and found that people who do volunteer end up being offered higher incomes within their organisation.  

M: Maybe I should, um, mention ‘Hey, boss if you’re listening?’  

P: [Laugh] well I think that’s essentially, it is attractive to people and they will see that sense of altruism is being a characteristic they want to promote within their business.  

M: You can also get such different and varied experience. So I was on the board of New South Wales volleyball, and that was a very different level of conversation. Well I was in my early thirties then. I worked for a really large corporate, so it wasn’t in that same board level type of discussion at the corporate. But it has definitely rounded out my experience and understanding and helped me in my career.  

P: Hugely, I had the same reference of volunteering on a sports committee and learning skills of how to do Excel spreadsheets. Now, you don’t think that that’s going to be something you pick up but I became a spreadsheet demon!  

M: Yep, I have too. 

P: And that’s all through volunteering and learning how to run a meeting, learning how to show leadership when it’s necessary, all those sorts of interactions and also learning how to interact with people. We had a very interesting ethnic mix and it took me a while to be able to deal with each individual ethnicity and approach it in a certain way that was beneficial for everybody. So it does, it really does give you tangible skills that you can use and that was my big platform when I was trying to get people to volunteer for that board, I was like guys you have no idea, this is going to be good for your job. 

M: Even just running an event, having ownership of running an event. 

P: Event management. It is not easy people. [Laugh] 

M: No. A place in heaven for people who run events and call centres, I have to say those poor, poor people. All right, so let’s maybe move on to some ideas or things that we can do to bring volunteering into our lives. Do you have any Pete?  

P: …  

M: Alright I’ll go. So the easiest one is that there are always organisations, mostly charities who are looking for volunteers.  

With the organisations that look for soft skills that can complement your career, you do generally need to be willing to invest a bit more time. It’s really a huge tax on a lot of these small, low funded organisations to constantly be training new people who only want to pop in three hours. So they are looking for a longer term commitment a lot of the time. But if you’re not willing to put a time in every week or every month, you can do things like donating blood.  

P: I like that one. 

M: Which is something could only do every few months. It’s a really easy thing to do, if you can, and mentoring someone so you don’t necessarily have to meet with your mentee more than once every three months. And there’s so many great benefits that come back to you. And it goes both ways, really, the mentor mentee relationship. As we’ve established.  

P: Yeah  

M: Yep and then the last one is just get involved in a Charity Day at your work. If you’ve got an organisation or a big enough workplace, there’s things like Australia’s Biggest Morning Tea, which we did yesterday in my office and that was for Cancer raising money for Cancer research, and then you could join in a fundraising walk or cycle or grow a mo for Movember. 

P: He he 

M: So there’s lots of these days, and particularly in larger corporations there’s a way to just jump in and join one of these things. But the benefits are not only to these charities or organisations that you’re supporting. They come back to you. 

P: Yeah, hugely. On a more individual level to look at what you’re doing. Look at the activities that you’re involved with and look at if those organisations need a hand. So for both of us, volleyball was a big one. I jumped into the volleyball committee with eyes completely shut and not knowing what I was getting into and 10 years later they had to force me out because I had been there for too long.   

M: You were ready to go. 

P: That was, when I first did it, I was like ‘Oh I should give something back to the club that has given me so much’ and that was the initial idea behind it. It was so beneficial in so many different ways. And I, it really did open up so much opportunity for me and it became a 10 year commitment. So it turned into something that was quite a lot.  

M: So you hated it the whole time, didn’t you? 

P: Well yeah, I got a nickname out of it, so that was good.  

M: What was the nickname? 

P: Madam President.  

M: Ah. 

P: [Laugh], there has only ever been one. Now it’s Mr President.  

M: Yeah OK, fair enough.  

[Laughter] 

M: All right, well, I think we’re done talking about volunteering for this week.  

P: We are. Get out there, people. It’s so much better for you, and it really does come back to you tenfold. They do say that volunteers look five years younger.  

M: I like that. The other thing to mention, to circle all the way back to the beginning is you mentioned that a lot of people say ‘I just don’t have time to volunteer’.

Now I would really be challenging that and asking, what do you prioritise over your own life and health and bonds with your family potentially or friends?  

P: It can be such a social thing.  

M: That means you don’t have time for those things that I just mentioned, because that’s ultimately what we’re talking about here.  

P: True, we’re preaching to the converted on each other here so. 

M: Yep 

P: Find something people, get out there and have a look and connect with something that connects with you, no matter how small you’ll get the benefits.  

M: All right, see you next week.  

P: Stay happy. 

[Happy Exit Music] 

Related content: read Moving On article What You Didn’t Know About Practicing Kindness

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Wellbeing and Your Environment with Lee Chambers (E21)

by

Happiness for Cynics Podcast

This week, we interview Environmental Psychologist and Wellbeing Consultant, Lee Chambers. He helps companies increase productivity, motivation and innovation by applying the latest research from psychology, neuroscience and physiology to the workplace. His philosophy comes from his own challenges and business journey, having had mental health struggles, being made redundant, losing the ability to walk, and yet despite all the challenges he has gained more clarity and managed to harness elements of the resilience bounce. 

About Lee Chambers

Lee Chambers – Environmental Psychologist, Wellbeing Consultant and Founder of Essentialise Workplace Wellbeing

Lee Chambers is a Wellbeing Consultant, Workshop Facilitator and Sleep Specialist. Having spent the last 10 years focusing on wellbeing and performance in the local government, corporate organisations, and in elite sports, he has now brought his experience and qualifications with the aim to impact the wellbeing of thousands of individuals and businesses.

Lee has qualifications in Performance Nutrition, Strength and Conditioning Coaching, and Advanced Sleep Consultancy, and he delivers multi-discplinary workshops focused on improving performance and productivity through increasing employee wellbeing. This is an issue very close to his heart, as after losing the ability to walk in 2014 due to autoimmune arthritis, he has battled back to achieve a positive health outcome, and is now on the pathway to become medication free. He holds an MSc in Environmental Psychology, with a focus on human interaction with workplaces and natural environments.

He also presents the Health and Wellbeing show on Ribble FM Radio, and speaks in Educational establishments about his varied career path, health challenges and having a resilient mindset.

Based in Preston in the North of the UK, Lee is currently working with business owners and employee teams to create culture change, wellbeing strategies and champions. He is a father of 2, coaches a disability football team, and enjoys eating good food with good friends. He is currently writing his first book, “How To Conquer Anything”, which will be released in 2020.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and change and transformation specialist, and my co-host is Peter Furness. Peter?

P: Hi there. I’m Peter Furness, and I’m a remedial therapist, ex professional dancer and happiness aficionado. Each week we will bring to you the latest news of research in the world of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.

M: This week we have a special guest who’s here to talk to us about well-being and your environment.

[Happy Music]

M: Lee Chambers is an environmental psychologist and wellbeing consultant. He helps corporations increase productivity, motivation and innovation by applying the latest research from psychology, neuroscience and physiology. His philosophy comes from his own challenges and business journey, having had mental health struggles, being made redundant, losing the ability to walk. And yet, despite all the challenges, he’s gained more clarity and managed to harness elements of the resilience bounce.

M: Hi Lee, thanks for joining us today on happiness for cynics. I’m so excited to have you on the show.

Lee: It’s a pleasure to be on today, Marie.

M: What a story! We touched a little bit on it in the intro, but can you start by delving a little deeper into your background and journey and explain to us what you do.

Lee: Oh, yeah, I’ll try and condense it into a nice, digestible form. So, yeah, I grew up as one of three brothers. We were always fed, watered and had a roof over our heads. We didn’t have a typically fancy life. But what we had, what you could say was all our basic needs. I was the first one in my family to go to university and that again was seen is quite achievement by my parents, and they really pushed me in that direction. I then went into corporate finance and I, very quickly after six months, found myself in the middle of the credit crunch, so people above me started to be made redundant. But only a week later I was pulled in and made redundant myself.

So that really did change my direction and that led me on a path which took me through numerous jobs and brought in a video game business. So I went to the local government and then worked helping unemployed people to find direction, sharpen their interview skills, get more inner confidence and then go on and get themselves a new job on. Then I worked in elite sports which again showed me the cutting edge of performance. How much money and experimental elements I used at that level, both physiologically and psychologically also made me think, if this money and effort and time was spent on the ordinary person, how many millions of people it could help. And at that point in my life, I lost the ability to walk [due to] illness over the course of a week. Completely changed my world view.

M: So within a week you went from being completely healthy and normal to not being able to walk.

Lee: Yeah, So it was my 29th birthday. I was fully independent, fully mobile, playing team spots and doing pretty much whatever I wanted. My son was 18 months old, wife for six months pregnant, and all of a sudden I went from fully independent to not able to drive myself not able to feed myself properly and it was a, it was a major challenge. And I look back now and realise if it wasn’t for the people around me and the position I was in and I was lucky enough to, while I lost my job. I still was able to run the business, because a lot of it was digital.

What kind of happened is at first I was like, Why me? This seems really unfortunate. Chronic disease? I’m not even 30. I’ve looked after myself, that very quickly catalysed into well, you’ve been incredibly ungrateful for your mobility all these years. In fact, you’ve been incredibly ungrateful for all the people that are now caring for you. You’ve been incredibly, you’ve been so ungrateful for the simple fact that you grew up in the first world had a pleasant childhood on all these opportunities. This free education, all these different, all these different jobs that you’ve had all these different careers, you’ve had that, you’ve had the ability and the freedom to start up a business, which is now financing you through these difficult times and just really change my world view everything.

I need to be more grateful. But I also need to be resilient have a mind set and be proactive. Attack this disease as much as it’s attacking my body and that has lead me through to where I am today; helping people, so increase the health outcomes, increase the happiness in the workplace and really just to build a world where we’re all a bit happier and spread that happiness between each other and we go into work happy on we leave work happy.

M: That’s a huge ask, though, isn’t it? [Laugh]

Lee: No, well I see it’s a massive goal that I’ve smashed into so many little pieces. And I can do lots of those little pieces over the course of my lifetime and see if I can get.

M: It is such an inspirational story. I don’t think many people can even imagine what you must have gone through and the struggles that you faced since then. And to see you so proactively and positively attacking the next stage in your life. And what’s next is truly an inspirational storey. So thank you for sharing that with us. What I’m also came to understand now is you’ve taken a whole different direction career wise and started a business called Essentialise. And it says here that you’re an environmental psychologist and you work in regenerative environments. Can you help to explain what it is that that means and what you do with your day?

Lee: Yes, to really kind of explain Environmental Psychology. It’s a relatively new field and you can split it into three, so I have a lot of contemporaries across a lot of different disciplines. But if you split it into three and make it simple and digestible.

There are Environmental Psychologists who deal with urban environments, so buildings, transport, city planning, schools, hospitals.

Then a lot of my contemporary work in our interaction with nature. So how humans interact in natural environments;

And the third subsection of Environmental Psychologists look at environmental behaviours. So, why we see the world the way that we do, why we take sustainability measures, how some people believe climate change is gonna devastate us or some people believe it doesn’t even exist.

I’m looking at how their behaviours and people’s values and really how that then translates into the world and how environmental behaviour could be influenced. So my section is around regenerative environments in sleep and in the workplace. So the principle of regenerative environments is that when you’re in an environment, you have a lot of stresses, a lot of them are sensory, so if you can imagine you’re in an office, it’s noisy, it’s not well lit, there’s pollution coming in from the road. You’re in an environment also where you’ve got mental stresses, so you might not get on with the person sitting next to you, you might struggle with your boss. He’s not very good at communicating, so that kind of builds an atmosphere in the work place. Both physically and psychologically. It’s about looking how we can make the atmosphere more positive. So you leave work as energised as when you went in, as happy as you went in.

M: Mm hmm, and it’s really circular, isn’t it? The more you look after employees, the better they perform for you.

Lee: Definitely. And in some ways, it’s really a hidden performance advantage that isn’t often utilised, but the way the culture’s gradually moving, people are starting to see how important is.

M: Yeah, I heard someone talking a little while ago and they said for too long corporates have broken the employer/employee contract. They’re meant to borrow an employee for 40 hours and then give them back in the same state that they borrowed them in. And for too long they’ve been borrowing them for 50 or 60 hours and giving them back to their families broken. And I thought that’s a really different way of looking at it. And it really shows how we’re evolving our understanding of the role that a corporate can play in looking after employees.

Lee: Yeah, it’s quite interesting though. Because again I’ve got quite a similar analogy within business. So, if you lease a car, you’re expected to return the car in the same condition, minus wear and tear, and wear and tear, we all get physiologically as we live. Obviously, that wear and tear ends up in one day with us passing to the next realm. But if you take your car back and it’s dented it’s scratched, it’s not been looked after inside, you get charged and also the way that companies, especially production companies, building machinery, to be depreciated all the time.

Well, sometimes companies treat employees like a piece of machinery that’s going to depreciate and gradually become obsolete and then they chuck it out. For that same piece of machinery they spend thousands of pounds for thousands of dollars to lubricate that machine over its life. And yet they’re shy to invest in the development of the staff, to even ensure that the wellbeing is kept to a level where they’re able to perform and do the role because they’re the face of the company, they’re the people that quite often would drive in the company themselves and yet you wouldn’t want the person driving your company to not be psychologically or physically well. It doesn’t add up yet it’s so underutilised and finally it’s starting to make that move from humans being a resource to humans being the people.

M: I couldn’t agree more. As someone who’s been through burnout myself in a corporate. I’m a hundred percent aligned with you. What I am still really curious about is the concept of environmental psychology. So for those of us who are new to the field and you mentioned, it is a relatively new field, can you share any surprising or unexpected maybe research your information about your field in general? What does some things that people don’t normally know?

Lee: Yes, I mean, there’s lots of interesting things, and at the moment with Covid[19], strangely, suddenly but interestingly from a scientific perspective, this is like a big experiment that you can’t carry out. You can’t get millions of people across the world to have to isolate in a certain environment and then be able to get that qualitative and quantitative data about how that affects them. So Covid literally is an environment of psychologists dream, because it gives a massive case study and a massive amount of data.

But in many ways, the things that people are not so aware of is just how vital nature is in our regeneration. And as things like Ecotherapy and Attention Restoration Therapy [ART] start to gain traction. They are both cases where we’re given a significant amount of nature exposure, and it actually helps with mild to moderate depression, and it helps with attention deficit disorders. And it’s incredibly powerful to get that at a young age, which is why sometimes you imagine, you know, the outdoor activity centres that take disadvantaged children and go and give them a really powerful dose of nature. Because so many children now live in urban settings, not aware of where the farm animals that they might eat come from, they don’t really link to the understanding of a forest of trees or a field or even sometimes the sea and those [are the] environments where we’re fully ignited from a sensory perspective.

So if you imagine you’re in the forest, you can hear the birds you can smell the flowers, your feet are touching the ground, and you feel that mossy ground and you stood next to a massive oak. And that’s the feel, like a small part of something much, much bigger and the sunlight shines through your eyes and boosting your serotonin production, and it’s just so vital to get outside. And yet, in so many ways, our coming generations spend more time inside than they ever have before. And that is out in the western world people are more concerned about safety, about the increasing vehicles and children not being helped to be dependent and search, go and explore, go on an adventure in the same way that even my generation was 30 years ago and that, in its own way, is a challenge.

But it’s helping people link back and I kind of feel that what Covid has done, especially in the countries where you’ve got you know, your one period of exercise. These people have been walking and finding green spaces only a few minutes away from the house, but they had never taken the time from their busy life to go and explore and finding those foot paths and then going, really enjoying themselves and get themselves out, and we’re only really grateful for the environments we have access to when they’re taken away. In the same way that I was so ungrateful for my ability to walk until I lost it. We are not very good at preventing but we are very, very agile in a crisis.

M: It’s human nature I think. I have a similar story, I had an accident 2017 and couldn’t walk for a long time. And it truly, and there is a whole body of psychological research into the, what happens after you’ve been through a major trauma as well.

So, there is definitely what you mentioned there about going out into nature, is there any research about bringing nature indoors? Is there any benefit to having more plants in your indoor space as well? Or water features? Does that help at all? Or do you really have to get out and make an activity of it.

Lee: Yeah, so by incorporating natural elements into the design of offices and houses, it does increase your well-being, and it does bolster your ability to, you know, recover from anxiety and stress. It doesn’t confer the whole benefit that being outside in nature does because it’s not a full sensory experience. However, if you have a good number of house plants they don’t offer you that natural landscape.

We can see more shades of green than any other colour and that’s due not only to our evolutionary biology but where green lies on the spectrum and how our pupils and eyes work. But we have that affinity for natural environment. So if you have a room where you have house plants, you have items made out of natural materials that have a feel on a texture, a grounding. If you say have a landscape picture on the wall, even those really small elements all the time because you’re continually exposed to them you become slightly regenerative to your health.

And then you look at house plants and how much they clean certain pollutants out of the air it’s the natural purifiers and also the fact that you have to mindfully look after them, water them, make sure and in many ways what we do is we represent and we anchor into the fact that they grow as we grow. It’s something that’s only kind of starting to be in research now. But it’s our understanding that actually, as the world revolves around you and moves, if you could make a bit of progress and the things around you are making a bit of progress it actually compounds in your mind to feel like you’re actually generating that forward momentum. It makes you have more energy to wake up in the morning, and it really does propel people when everything around them is just growing. And that’s something that you won’t see if you have an urban environment, which doesn’t really have any natural features.

M: Yeah, so I was gonna ask you if you had any tips for our listeners about how to make practical changes in their homes or office environments to improve their well being. We just talked about plants, definitely. Is there anything else that you can share the secrets of that will help with well being?

Lee: Yes, I mean probably the most important thing is just to step back and have an awareness about how much your environment plays a role in your well-being and starting to just understand the basics that the stress of our environment, it does affect us.

So when you’re kind of working out actual tips and starting to think ‘Ok, so I’ve got my office, or I’ve got my home office and home offices are great, because you have more design flexibility. You just have to incorporate the elements that you work in, in an environment that was originally designed for something else. But you can start to work on that if you treat it mindfully.

So yeah, it’s kind of looking at, you’re working for roughly eight hours a day and sleeping for eight hours a day. So your workplace environment, your sleep environment, 100 hours over a week, two thirds of your life spent in those environments. So it’s important to look to optimise them. So you’re kind of looking at ways to, because of how we work and we have ultradian rhythms so 98% of ourselves have this smaller clock inside. Obviously we have the circadian rhythm that runs 24 hours a day ultradian rhythms run about 60 to 90 minutes and that allows us to really work deeply for that period. But then we need to have ten to fifteen minutes off, disconnected. So we can reconnect to work effectively again. When we continue to push that, that’s when we get burnt out.

So, what I do in terms of suggesting for offices were actually looking at what the environmental stress is.

First of all Noise.

Are you in the seat that’s next to the main road? Are people buzzing, are cars coming past all day? What we do is while we tune out, it gradually stresses you on a low level, and that builds up over time. Other things to consider are:

Density.

So we need personal space in an office we’re too crammed and that can be an environmental stressor. Yeah, we also need to be close enough to build, to socially connect with people so being sat in an office and being completely bereft of anyone else to speak to, is just as dangerous as being crammed in. So it’s about finding that, find that sweet spot. Some people’s personal space needs are larger than others, and that’s about where you become understanding of what your environmental needs are. Other things to consider are:

Temperature.

You can actually find out where people are comfortable and set them in the in the zone that’s best for them and that in itself is regenerative when they understand; Actually, I want to sit here in 16 degrees. He wants to sit there and 19. He feels comfortable. I feel comfortable. We switch places. We wouldn’t be comfortable. And it’s just about kind of understanding that we can use our thermostats in our houses to also create our workspace that is comfortable for us. And then finally, it’s really looking at things like

Lighting.

So thing is that everyone has their individual lighting need as we get older, our lighting need needs change, but you don’t want to be in that grey room yet you don’t want so much light to come through that it’s blinding you, blinding your screen and natural light is always gonna be better than artificial light. But artificial light can be and is increasingly becoming a little bit less invasive than it used to be in the old fluorescent strips, so you can get creative with that. They get that Connection and suddenly they’re more likely to stay, their less likely to go off sick, become more productive, more creative and just happier at work and it spreads.

M: I think that’s, that’s a great place to end with happiness spreading. I’m so upset that we’ve only gone through half the questions that I really wanted to ask you. So we might even invite you back on this show in a little bit to cover some more things if you, If you’re up for it. Before we go, how can people find out a bit more about you?

Lee: So you can visit my website at: leechambers.org, I’m on Instagram @essentialisecoach and Twitter @essentialise

M: Thank you. I appreciate your time and have a good evening. Have a good day, actually all the way from England.

Lee: Thanks, it’s been a pleasure Marie.

[Happy Exit Music]

Related content: Listen to our Podcast: Designing Happy Cities (E19) and Podcast: Enabling Happy Cities (E20)

Enabling Happy Cities (E20)

by

Happiness for Cynics podcast

In the second of this two-part series on happy cities, this week we explore the enablers of happy cities. We look at the research from the Global Happiness Council’s annual Global Happiness and Wellbeing Policy Report and discuss some great examples from around the world of cities which are getting it right.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker, focused on change and resilience [background laughter most of the way through] and we’ve already lost Pete today. 

P: [Laughing] My tummy was rumbling, on cue. [Still laughing.] We should have had pancakes first. 

M: [Laugh] It’s our treat for after we’ve recorded. 

P: So sorry. Hi, I’m Peter Furness, a mover and shaker, Covid[19] time baker, opportunity seeker and maker. Each week we will bring you the latest news and research in the world of positive psychology known as happiness.  

M: You can find us at marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life. We talk about a lot of the same research we cover here on the podcast, including some really practical tips for bringing joy and happiness into your life. 

P: Bubbles for everyone.  

[Laughter] 

P: So on to today’s episode, which is part two of our series on Happy Cities.  

[Happy Intro Music] 

M: Okay, so welcome to today’s episode, which is part two on our series of Happy Cities. But before we get into that, Pete you had a really lovely interaction with one of our listeners.  

P: I did. It was really, really lovely, so we’ll call him James.  

M: Sure. 

P: So James and I had a very brief interaction and basically, I’ll just read that. I’ll just read what he said:  

We mentioned podcasts and he mentioned that he was podcast listener. And I said ‘oh I do a podcast called Happiness for Cynics.’  

James: ‘Cool. I listened to the 1st 2 episodes of your podcast today. I think it was just what I needed to hear. Thank you for putting me on to it.’  

P: ‘Oh, that’s bloody lovely.’  

James: ‘No, thank you.’  

P: And he goes on to say.  

James: ‘Thanks, Pete. I’m naturally cynical, but also believe that it’s up to me to be happy and only I can choose my reactions to things. I still have bad days, and I have to remind myself that that’s okay. But overall, I think I’m mostly optimistic. I’m going to try get to more episodes of your podcast today.  

M: That’s so lovely to hear, it really is.  

P: It was really reassuring that what we do actually is reaching [people].  

M: Yes, and I think that’s the whole premise of the podcast. It took a major trauma for me to reassess my life. I don’t want everyone have to have a major trauma in their life in order to discover that this stuff actually works. 

P: Well I just knew.  

M: of course… 

P: I just bought in from the beginning. 

M: Uh, huh.  

P: Does that make me better than you?  

M: What evs… Happy Cities, Pete.  

[Laughter] 

P: So let’s just recap what we went through on the last episode, Part one was all about the design. Just to recap. We had six major points: 

  1. Urban design in place making so a city plan and design …of connected space;  
  2. The next was access to Nature;  
  3. Third was Mobility, how we move around, how we get around a city and having access to the parts of the city;  
  4. Sustainability and Partnership. Sustainable change and putting things in place that make a city more changeable for the next few generations;  
  5. Culture, Arts and what a city’s culture is; and
  6. The Quality of Services that are accessible to all the population of that city.  

M: You flew through those Pete. 

P: Yes cause I hogged the podcast last week so I’m trying to be really, really good this week. 

M: [Laugh] so, they were all the design elements of Happy Cities.  

This week we’re going to talk more about Enablers of Happy Cities. And enablers are the intangible policy outcomes. So there’s two types of policy outcomes those requiring active engagement from citizens and those that are sensed passively, so they just kind of happen or don’t. As we mentioned in the last episode Australia really is a lucky country when you look at it –  

P: Is it still? 

M: It still is, we are not dealing with slums with huge poverty or famine, war; The infrastructure that we have here, the opportunity that we have here is still, it’s not perfect. I can see you’re looking me! 

P: No, no, no, I’m asking the question. 

M: It’s not perfect. It is not perfect. But we are so much further advanced than so many other countries. We are one of the lucky countries. 

P: And sometimes we may forget that. 

M: Oh, absolutely. 

P: Because I think there’s a lot of things that are different about Australian lifestyle… when you put it in a global context, we’re doing all right. 

M: And back when, even we’ve come in leaps and bounds. The quality of life that we have compared to our parents or our grandparents is it’s so much better. It is not simpler and it comes with its own challenges, but yes, but I’d argue better. Anyway, again, we’ve gone off track, so Australia is lucky. Well, just not perfect, not the best. But we are lucky and so what I want to do is quickly go through the first 4 areas that just aren’t as relevant for our society and then we can spend a bit more time deep diving into the other. 

So first one is Safety and Security.  

And you mentioned American psychologist Abraham Maslow. We mentioned it a few episodes ago, but also he’s famous for coming up with Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. And it’s a way of showing that some needs more important to humans than others. And he displays this by using a pyramid with things like air, food and water at the bottom. I think we can all agree air, food and water are absolutely critical.  

P: Absolutely. It’s a necessity. 

M: The second layer is about Safety and Security, and that comes before things like love and belonging, friends and family and esteem, respect and definitely before self- actualisation. 

P: [laugh] before we get into the fluffy stuff. 

M: Yeah, but in short, people don’t care so much about a vibrant nightlife when it’s not safe to walk the streets. 

P: Yep 

M: So I think that we’re pretty lucky and as a female in this country. I feel very safe to walk nearly any streets in this country. I can’t think of any that I don’t feel safe walking at night, right? So we’re going to move on, safety and security really important for a happy city. We’ll go tick in Australia. 

The next one is Affordability.  

Shelter is another item on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, but it’s in the first tier. Alright, you can’t feel safe if you don’t have a home. And you can’t feel secure if you’re constantly worried about losing that home.  

P: True.  

M: So if you’re sleeping in the streets, it’s a very vulnerable position to be in.  

P: Yeah, definitely. 

M: That’s for the small percentage of our population that are homeless but also going back to what we mentioned before. For the 20, 30, 40% of Australians who are low income earners, there is a true week to week struggle to pay your bills and not be evicted from your home, whether it’s a mortgage that you’re paying or just rent, right. And so I would argue that affordability, traditionally 20 years ago, wasn’t so much of an issue. But it’s starting to creep into, well it has crept into our concerns in our country of late.  

P: Oh, for sure, especially in cities like Sydney. Absolutely. The affordability of rent is huge.  

M: All right, we will move on  

Tolerance and Inclusivity.  

So this is about equity, tolerance and justice for all, and some of you might have started noticing that we’re using the word equity rather than equality lately and I really love that we’re evolving our understanding of equality and now focusing instead of equality on equity. And so equality is all about everyone having the same opportunity. And that’s really noble and a great first step. And I will say that a lot of countries and various groups are still fighting for that equal right.

We’re still not there as a society, but the next evolution of that argument or thinking is equity. And that acknowledges that everyone’s different has different needs, and therefore you shouldn’t provide one product or service to everyone. You should aim to provide a tailored product or service to people so that they end up in the same place. And there’s a great video online where they’re talking about white privilege and they get everyone to start at the beginning of a race. 

P: Yeah, I’ve seen this. 

M: Yeah, there’s a great video there, but another way of looking at it is if you have a really tall kid and a really short kid, and they both want to peek over the fence to watch the baseball game and you give them both a box to stand and the tall kid will see over the fence and will watch the game and be really happy. The short kid is still staring smack bang at the fence posts and can’t see a thing, so it’s about giving each of them a box to stand on. But the box for the short kid needs to be taller so they can both see the baseball game.  

P: Right, that’s a great analogy. That’s what equity is about, right? It’s about different solutions based on your needs rather than one solution for all. And I love that that’s the next evolution and that’s what people are starting to talk about here with tolerance and inclusivity. And then the last one is 

Trust.  

Last one I’m going to talk about then I’ll hand to you Pete. [Laugh] It’s definitely not the last one. So, the OECD [Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development] defines trust as a person’s belief that another person or institution will act consistently with their expectations of positive behaviour. And corporates have failed dismally at this in recent years. There is such a lack of trust now between people and large organisations, to the point that organisations are now just as bad as politicians in our minds. 

P: Oh! Yeah. I’ll give you that. 

M: And we used to trust banks with our money, we used to trust big corporations to give us jobs and security. That is no longer the case. And the really interesting part off that quote is that it’s about our expectations of positive behaviour and expectations change over time. And I think what we’ve seen with corporate is that they haven’t kept up with our changing expectations, right? 

P: [Tentative] OK. 

M: And the second thing there is as far as Happy Cities goes, trust is about government’s doing what we think they should do and not being caught out. So no corruption is the big one. But the second thing is opening up your doors, and this is a change management 101 principle co-create and we’re going to come to a few examples that you’ll talk about soon Pete, where governments have opened their doors up and worked with their citizens to co-create solutions and get such better results in the end. But you also get trust and that’s a big one. 

P: Yep, it’s transparency to see what people are doing, what the processes are which gives you empowerment as an individual.  

M: Absolutely. All right, so I’m going to hand to you for the next one. I think you’re going to start with  

Health and Life Balance.  

P: Health and Life, this is right up my alley. A holistic view of city life and activities promoting balance, physical and mental health. We need both for making sure that Happy Cities occur and I want to use a couple of examples here. One is in Bogota, in South America. Ciclovia it’s called, [Chi-clo-veea] I’m not sure about the accent there. Reclaiming the streets and opening them up to millions of cyclists of all walks and abilities, much like running festivals in Sydney. It’s about people custodians of the city, creating the capacity for the population to engage within the streets. 

So what something like Ciclovia does is it lets families, it lets children, it lets senior citizens come out and enjoy car free areas. Now this movement is actually this event actually sparked a movement in other countries around the world where regularly closing down city streets just for cyclists became a huge way for the communities to come out and interact, so that created a sense of meaning and belonging and sociality. It ticks all these lovely little boxes for us. Also looking at things in terms of work hours.

Now, very topical at the moment is the 4 to 5 working week, four weeks in five weeks or the four day working week on. We’ll come back to that at another time, but it has a huge involvement on being allowed people to manage their own time. This creates more balance because you can choose when you’re going to go and pick the kids up from day care or when you’re going to fit in your three mile walk that you might have to do just to get your own exercise and that creates huge health benefits along with your productivity, which we know since the year 2000 in Scandinavian countries, it goes up, 20%, 30% increase in productivity, downgrading of health services, less sick leave all these benefits from allowing people to manage their time better. It’s a huge marker for happy cities.  

M: Yep 

P: Okay, moving along. So 

Sociality

…is that how you say this word?  

M: Yep 

P: Sociality? Sociality? People need people. Battling loneliness. We need other people, we know that having those social interactions really helps with their levels of happiness. There’s a city in Western Denmark that actually initiated counselling services for parents and parents of teenagers if they were having trouble and also for divorced couples. Now this was a free service that they offered and what they found was not only did divorces drop by 17% but they were clocking issues of teenage angst and issue from becoming problems later on and by providing those, those services free of charge, people were less engaged in conflict. They, they were able to manage their lifestyles a little bit better, which makes a huge difference to happiness.  

M: I think this also goes back to what we’ve mentioned multiple times. It’s about understanding yourself. And I think it’s giving teenagers and parents an opportunity to know themselves better and to talk through their emotions in a far more proactive and positive way and therefore it’s created stronger social ties within the family unit. 

P: Which makes the happiness.  

M: Such a great, great initiative. 

P: That and the adopt a grandma. 

M: Oh, I love this one! 

P: [Laugh] So the Dragør, is that how you would say it? in east of Copenhagen in Denmark has the ‘bonus grandma’ or ‘adopt a grandma scheme’. So there’s these ladies who are sitting around in their nursing homes and so forth. They may not have families around them, and people who need a little bit of help can adopt a grandma. Who doesn’t want an extra grandma? I mean, my grandma’s gone. She’s been gone for 10 years, actually. So, it’s great to have that sort of person around if you’ve got kids and you need a bit of help or you need that that maternal figure. 

M: Yep, in particular in today’s day and age, when you have two people out earning an income and people are more likely to move away from their parents. And it’s, it’s really tough to balance full time work and raising kids nowadays, yes, and maintain your sanity and happiness. 

P: [Laughter] Definitely, so we’ll move on to  

Economy and Skills  

A primary reason for people to move to a city is the economic opportunity that this allows. There’s a wonderful example in Vancouver in Canada, of the Vancouver Binners.  

M: I’m going to jump into that, maybe so what was happening was that people were taking their recyclables to the recycling centre to get their five cents or 10 cents per bottle. But these were generally homeless people or people that had been looked down upon by others in society as being a nuisance. And so they called them binners and they weren’t great to have around your neighbourhood. They looked bad. They might have smelled. You know, that’s the general consensus that society had of these people. 

But some great organisation had a look at the good they were doing, saving all of that plastic from going into landfill and said, ‘How do we change people’s perception of these people as a pest to instead show the good that they’re doing for our society and also help them to do it more efficiently and better so that we can again have less plastics going into a landfill.’ Such a great little initiative. 

P: Yeah, utilising the labour force.  

M: Absolutely. So these people were seen as a pest were doing such a service. So really cute little story there. 

P: It reminds me of a story actually, when you came back from Thailand after your accident, Marie and you made the comment to me about you were in hospital and you had like a team of ladies washing you. 

M: Oh, they were fabulous. 

P: [Laugh] You made the point that it was utilising the labour force. So these women who may not have had training and skills and all that sort of stuff. It was washing patients in the hospital and they were utilising that cheap labour force, giving them an occupation, giving them purpose, giving the meaning tick, tick, tick for the happiness counter. 

M: Yep, yep absolutely. 

P: Roman Deguchi is the director off the ‘Inner West Neighbour Aid’ garden in Concord, west of Sydney. And I came across this on an episode of Gardening Australia. 

M: Of course you did. 

P: Because that’s what you do when you’re in isolation. You watch Gardening Australia. It was about utilising the talent within the community and bringing the local community together in a garden setting. Now, one of the first things they did was they had paths that go through the garden and these were all wide enough for wheelchairs. Now, I know this is something that’s close to your experience Marie, as well. 

M: Uh, huh. Yeah  

P: You don’t realise how inaccessible the city is until you’re in a wheelchair and you’ve got to get around. So that was one of the first things that they did. And they also found that there was a disconnection between the elder community and the youth community and this garden brought it together. They brought school kids in to start doing the planting and stuff, and they were bringing elderly people in to direct them and say, look we can’t get down on our knees but you can, plant that over here and do that and there was contact between the generations. 

M: All right, last one;  

Meaning and Belonging. 

P: Ooh, this is a big one, a shared meaning and belonging and a sense of purpose that involves a community.  

M: I think a lot of the things you talked about have covered meaning and purpose. So I think it’s enough on this one to almost say it is really important to create spaces and activities that give people meaning and belonging. But the great thing about the items on this list they’re not mutually exclusive. And you can create a lot of places and activities that give not only meaning and belong belonging, but also economy and skills and sociality and health and life balance. 

P: Yeah definitely, they tick many boxes. 

M: Yeah, All right, well, we should probably wrap that up so. 

P: [Laugh] Way too much information.  

M: So, in conclusion, Happy Cities. Firstly, it’s a choice. It’s about opting in, definitely. And then the other part of this is about the effectiveness of empowering people to take responsibility and get involved in their cities. 

P: The processes. 

M: Exactly. 

P: How do you get people involved?  

M: Yeah, and it’s not just because you want to see the outcome be good or right for your society. It’s because the process of going through it is beneficial to you and your happiness. So getting involved in that garden isn’t just about there being a nice garden in your neighbourhood. It’s about planting herbs with the local kids and the benefits that you get from that.  

P: Exactly.  

M: All right. Okay, well, thank you for joining us. And, as always, you can find us at marieskelton.com, where you can ask us a question, recommended topic or suggest someone to interview, and we hope you’ll join us again next week and over the coming weeks, we’ve got a couple of really great interviews lined up, which will revisit the topic of Happy Cities. And we’ve got some experts who are going to cover various elements.  

P: Very exciting. 

M: What makes space and the places that we move in happy for us? What makes us happy when you’re in them? So I hope you’ll join us for that.  

P: No worries folks, buy into happiness. 

[Happy exit Music] 

Related content: Read Moving On article Podcast: Wellbeing and Your Environment (E21), listen to our Podcast: Designing Happy Cities (E19)

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Designing Happy Cities (E19)

by

Happiness for Cynics podcast

In the first of this two-part series on happy cities, this week we explore how to design happy cities. We look at the research from the Global Happiness Council’s annual Global Happiness and Wellbeing Policy Report, and discuss some great examples from around the world of cities which are getting it right.

Episode notes

In this week’s episode, Pete talked about how bicycle lanes are great for city living. This is the book he mentioned.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer and speaker focused on change and resilience.  

P: And I am Peter Furness, a banana bread maker, wall art hanger and occasional wedgie applicator. Each week we will bring you the latest news and research in the world of positive psychology, otherwise known as happiness.  

M: You can find us at marieskelton.com, which is a site about how to find balance, happiness and resilience in your life. We talk about a lot of the same research we cover here on the podcast, including some really practical tips for bringing joy and happiness into your life. 

P: So on to today’s episode, which is all about Happy Cities.  

[Happy intro Music] 

P: So Marie, Happy Cities. What are we talking about?  

M: This is such a hot topic right now. I’m so happy that we’re doing this. So there’s two things that are converging to macro level.  

P: Convergence, we like convergence were converging. 

M: And macro, that’s important. So firstly, we’re seeing huge advancements in technologies in particular the Internet of things, and that’s allowing us to know so much more data and know so much more about what our people are doing and how they’re moving in, how they’re living than we’ve ever had before. 

P: So “big brother” is a good thing.  

M: It can be. I’m not 100% sold, but I think- 

P: There’s a practical application of the “big brother” [concept]. It’s actually working for us.  

M: Yes, exactly. And then the second thing that’s happening is there’s an increasing understanding that human well-being matters, and we’ve mentioned it before. But people are saying to come to the realisation that economic prosperity without well-being is a bit hollow.  

So this really started picking up steam in 2015 when the UN announced its 2030 agenda for sustainable development and that was adopted by all UN member states. And in it, there’s 17 sustainable development goals which aim to bring peace and prosperity to all the world and its people. Now amongst those 17 goals, there’s two that in particular apply to happy cities.  

The first is goal number three, which is good health and well-being. And then there’s also number 11 which is sustainable cities and communities. And when it comes to cities and communities, a lot of the UN plan focuses on getting the basics right, like proper waste management, eradicating slums and providing clean air. But it does also touch on some of the topics we’re going to cover today, like access to green spaces and good public transport, which are key to happy cities. 

So for today’s episode, rather than focusing on the UN sustainable development goals, we have taken a different document, which is a bit more relevant for us in Australia because we have done some really good work to get those basics right. And now we’re talking about what’s next. So the report we’re looking at is the Global Happiness Council’s annual global happiness and well-being policy report.  

So Pete, maybe you can start with why we should be focusing on Happy Cities, not just happy people?  

P: I love that we’re focusing on Happy Cities. I think this is a really interesting segway in global awareness, really, that we’re no longer just talking about economic development and GDP and stuff this whole movement around ‘let’s create good things for people and for all people’, which I think is really important. That’s a point we will come back to later.  

If we’re looking at Happy Cities, what makes a happy city just a bit of background; we’re using cities more. So the human population on a global scale is now becoming more urbanised. Since 2007 we actually have more urbanised population globally than we do rural. So we’ve hit 55% of global population in 2007, live in cities.  

M: I think that’s a really, really good stat to show how, as a society or society’s globally, we’re evolving from an agrarian, hunter/gatherer/farmer to industrial, which did bring a lot more people into the cities and made the need for cities greater. To a service economy now, where definitely everyone is in the city for right now because we haven’t quite gotten there yet, But it’ll be really interesting to see if gig economy and, you know, especially post Covid[19], where we know now that we can work from home and a lot of industries whether we will still need cities as much in the future. 

P: It’s interesting because the predictions are that in 2050 we’re going to have 2/3 of the world’s population in cities, seven billion people as opposed to right now, which is just 4.1 billion people. These are the predictions we’re using cities more and that, the attraction of living in the city is greater. So, interestingly enough, and I found this this odd that as we grow older and as we grow wealthier, we tend to gravitate towards cities. I would have thought the opposite, but it’s not the case. We like being in cities. Cities provide opportunity. They provide better health systems support and all that sort of stuff. So we’re more drawn towards them. 

M: And also more leisure activities. You can always go to the beach or go somewhere quiet for a weekend. I think that on a day to day basis, having access to more people and cultural activities when you’re retired becomes more important. 

P: It comes into the, into the factoring of what makes a happy city actually. When we- 

M: Tell us! Do tell us. 

P: Well actually, there are lots of different things. There’s, there’s the infrastructure. There’s things like parks, cycle paths, piazzas, green and blue spaces, culture. So the art culture, HUGE, massive, so big!  

M: For you the art culture is huge. But for others it can make a break a city, the culture, and it’s not necessarily art, but it is the culture of a city.  

P: Definitely but art plays a big part in that. I’ll come back to that later. So these are all in addition to services such as waste management, sewerage and public transport, which is another big one. 

M: Public transport’s important. 

P: Yeah, it’s a huge one. In terms of the global happiness report, there’s two aspects of this report that come out really, really strongly.  One is that there is a design element of city, so things that we put in place to create happy cities. And then there’s the enablers of city happiness. So I think for this podcaster we are actually going to separate into two different podcasts. 

M: Yes, you’re listening to part one today.  

P: Today we’re gonna talk about the design. So what goes into the designing of a good city and how to create that. And in the report they come up with six different areas of [what a] city needs to create a happy city.  

M: All right, well, how about you start us off with the 1st 3 Pete?  

P: All right. So we’ll talk about: 

1. Urban design and place making 

This is city planning, connected spaces and places that create a good city. Creating and using functional space as well. Now I’m going to launch right into this one with an example. Bike lanes, bike lanes, they’re the new black. It’s the thing that everybody is being measured by in terms of their city ability is, do you have a bike lane concept and our bikes able to operate within your city? And it’s a big one because bicycle riding connects communities, so it makes people able to get around. Now, in terms of a city that doesn’t have good public transport, doesn’t have good access. If you can ride somewhere, to get to the grocery shop, to go and see friends, to hang out in the park, it makes a big difference to how you use a city.  

M: Let me add, if you can safely ride somewhere, no one would let their kid’s ride around Sydney, even though we have a bike lane or two every now and then, the bike lanes through the city are like, if you want death, go ride through Sydney CBD. 

P: [Laugh] that’s such a good point Marie, because there’s some gurus out there and there’s this couple Melissa and Chris Bruntlett, who come from Vancouver and they actually wrote a book on ‘Building the Cycling City: The Dutch Blueprint for Urban Vitality’ and they actually talk about the safety of bike riding and how safe it is for a city to be bike riding in and of course, we all know Amsterdam has the best record. 

M: And Nordic, it’s the Nordic countries again.  

P: That do it well, yep. And it really makes a community come together. It provides accessibility, and, as you say, it brings people together because it’s safe and you could take families. 

M: So that was an example of, what was it? 

P: Design and place making. Designing a city. Examples of how to design a city to create good community interaction.  

The next one we look at.

2. Nature 

Huge, connecting with nature, contact with nature, easily accessible green and blue spaces. And when we talk about green and blue spaces, we’re talking about green spaces, which are obviously the parks, your centennial parks, your Hyde Park’s, you’re access to green spaces at the end of your street. 

M: And your natural bush land and forest areas depending on what country you’re in. 

P: Yep, all that sort of stuff. When we talk about blue spaces, I had to look this one up.  

M: Water.  

P: I know I didn’t think. I was just like what’s a blue space?  

M: [Laugh] It’s not a blue zone! 

P: That’s what I thought.  

M: It’s a bunch of old people… 

P: all hanging out in their bikinis.  

[Laughter] 

M: That would be Florida. 

P: Or Hampstead Heath in London.  

But blue space is access to water, which is hugely important and I actually did a lot of research into this in terms of water being included in a city scape. So water is really beneficial for inspiring awe, inspiration. It has a calming effect, has a white noise effect, and it actually brings down traffic noise.  

M: Yes  

P: I thought that was a really interesting point. So in a city scape water is hugely important for creating not only a visual area of interaction, but also auditory, so you can actually dull down the sounds of the city. And the other thing is it cools, and this is something that comes back to medieval times, in the 13th century in Spain, they used water to cool the streets of the city and having water features and there’s beautiful Andalusian fountains in the middle of the piazza or something. They weren’t just pretty, they were there for a function. But I thought that was an interesting aspect, that it has a function that’s not just pretty.  

M: Yeah, yeah.  

P: Really benefits us.  

Okay, moving on to number three. Let’s look at this one:  

3. Mobility 

And that is the ability to get around. So again, bike lanes as being bike lanes are the new black but we’re also looking in here, we’re looking at public transport, diversity of transport and this is a huge one in terms of the development of electronic vehicles and also automated vehicles, which- 

M: I can’t wait for flying cars!  

P: [Laugh] It’s all back to the future, and the future is here people [laugh]. 

M: It is! They exist! They’re being tested right now. 

P: They’re getting better and this is the funny thing, we had this conversation about a year ago. I Remember Marie, you were all pro automated vehicles. No way it’s going to cause accidents. People, I was wrong. 

M: Yes! 

P: The science says that the ability for automated vehicles to prevent accidents is much greater than human error. 

M: Uh huh, computers win again.  

P: Unfortunately… So in 2011 to 2015 electronic vehicle rates soared by 800 percent. Huge increases, and this is only going to get bigger. Technology is improving in the expansion of public transit networks, along with autonomous vehicles and electronic vehicles, is going. It’s going to be a thing of the future. Infrastructure is going to support that so shared public transport, variable transport, in terms of lane ways and arterial roads, which we’re seeing in Sydney at the moment with this whole West connects drama that we’ve all been going through. It’s the way of the future, unfortunately, and the future of mobility is going to be a massive indicator of smart cities and how a city can increase its happiness.  

M: And I think that newer cities are definitely much better placed because they’ve got wider roads and wider lane ways. So it is really tough in cities like Paris. We were there last year. They can’t put lifts in for people with disabilities into their subway systems because they’re underground is like Swiss cheese, right? And the whole thing is going to come falling down if they keep drilling too many holes in there. 

P: Sydney’s suffers from that a little bit as well. 

M: A little bit but we’ve definitely got accessibility down pat compared to a lot of other countries, but you’re really stuck with the age of the infrastructure that you’ve inherited. It’s like older companies right now that have a tech debt with stuff that they’ve been building on top of and on top of and on top of since the seventies compared to new entrants to the market, who come with fresh, clean technology that is only six months old, right? So for, for cities that are really old, this mobility piece becomes so much more costly and difficult to implement. 

P: But it’s going to make a difference to how people can use the city. That’s the whole point.  

M: Yeah, absolutely.  

P: Getting around a city and arterial roads are a really simple introduction to that. You can bypass the busy area of the city so that you can get across town.  

M: Absolutely. All right, we’re going to keep moving on and we’ll power through these last three in our last three minutes.  

So number four on the list of design elements that lead to Happy Cities is: 

4. Sustainability and partnerships.  

So this is one of the things I really liked about the UN sustainability goals is that Number 17 the last one on their list, talks about the need for partnership, and it’s a concept that’s definitely picked up steam over the last five years or so. The government can’t do it all, and there’s been some great examples of where government, academia, corporations and citizens are all coming together now to change our cities and to plan for the future and its, I think the only way that you get true innovation is in coming out of your bubble and your sector and what you know and partnering with other organisations that bring their worldview and they’re different perspectives to drive towards one common goal. So partnership is so key and there’s a great example in Halifax in Canada of some city councillors there and they get $94,000 a year to spend on city infrastructure projects and instead of just deciding that they’re gonna spend it on fountain’s because they’ve got water. 

P: [Laugh] they’re pretty. 

M: I mean, they’d freeze up in Halifax, or whatever it is, instead of sitting in a room with a bunch of councillors and deciding where to spend their money; each year, they have community organisations come in and set up a booth and the residents come in and they walk around and get a little pitch from each of the organisations and then they vote on their top five and so the community is then invested in whatever is developed. The community organisations get to meet the residents and government get to put money into things that the residents want. And it’s just a great little simple example of how you can bring three different communities together to achieve a common goal. 

P: And it’s also giving an empowerment to the people who occupy the city. They’re in charge of their future. And they’re making conscious decisions on it.  

M: Yes, and they’re more likely to use the end outcome.  

All right, so moving on: 

5. Culture. 

We mentioned culture. 

P: The artists have it.  

M: So this is about a city having a sense of uniqueness and having a soul. It is the soul of the city-  

P: and identity that is unique to that city.  

M: Yeah, definitely. So what we’re talking about here is everything from visuals, lights, arts, sounds, climate and people’s behaviour and attitude as well as their physical structures. So all of those things can contribute to a city’s culture. And you’ve been over, you’ve been to Vancouver, haven’t you?  

P: Not yet! I was supposed to go this year.  

M: OH! You were meant to go. 

P: Bloody Covid[19] My Canadian holiday has been cancelled. 

M: All right, I’m going to tell you about a great place called Granville Island from Vancouver. So in the seventies, it was, a dilapidated, industrial area, and the Vancouver government has taken it back and since then, invested a lot of money and I love their mission statement. So it’s “The most inspiring public place in the world.” Is their mission statement, and today it’s a fabulous, artistic and cultural hub. And it’s got public markets about 50 independent restaurants and also got about 300 businesses employing about 3000 people. And arguably many of Canada’s best artists and designers have their works displayed there or they’re selling there, and we went there a couple of years ago. It’s such a great place, such a great place. Now that is a great example of people coming together to create a space that Vancouver’s now so well known for. All tourists go there now and locals love it. Yes, so culture definitely matters. 

P: And I’m going to throw some stats in there. This is where I find a lot of information from the UK coming through. They’re very good at actually evaluating statistics for arts inclusion and there is an arts on prescription project, which comes from Cambridge in the UK. [Arts on Prescription program is based on a model developed in the UK whereby health professionals, including GPs, write prescriptions for their patients to participate in the arts.]  

They found that for an arts community that was actively involved out there in a cityscape:  

  • 71% decrease in feelings of anxiety,  
  • 73% falling depression and  
  • 76% of participants said their wellbeing was increased and they felt more socially included in a city. 

M: Alright, I’m sold. 

P: That’s 3/4 of the city population going ‘yeah, we like artistic spaces.’ You’ve only got to look at the Instagram accounts of people going around taking photos of the graffiti wings that are on all these buildings around. People interact with art on a street level. It isn’t something to be helping museums. I’m getting on my soapbox here [laugh].  

M: All right, we are going to move on. Oh, we are over time already. So we’ll get to the last one and then we’re going to have to wrap up. So last one is: 

6. Quality of service. 

Okay, So it’s making genuinely citizen centred services easier and accessible. And this one is so important. If you’ve ever been to the DMV in the States or if you’ve ever tried to complete a simple tax return in America, you will know the pain that comes with poorly designed, customer centric or non-customer centric services. And we like to complain here in Australia. But our government has digitised most services, and it does lead to a far easier way of doing those day to day things like renewing your licence or paying your fines.  

P: Okay. I’ll concede to you, they’re on their way Marie.  

M: And not that I’m paying fines on a day to day basis. But what I will also say that is in here is accessibility. And when I had my accident after I got out of hospitals in a wheelchair for 6 to 9 months while I was getting on to my feet consistently and it’s lonely, it really is lonely. And it’s not lonely because I had less friends. It’s lonely because I couldn’t do many of the activities that they were doing. I couldn’t get to a bar and feel safe doing that. I couldn’t get to public transport. It just isolates you. And there are so many people in our community who have disabilities or who are elderly and aren’t stable on their feet and they’re ah… 

P: They don’t do things because they’re too scared.  

M: Exactly, exactly. And that’s what I mean by accessibility. So having accessible public transport in accessible spaces is so critical to a large portion of our population.  

P: It’s interesting the Australian environmental Grant Makers Network chimes in here, saying that Australian cities are failing with social inequalities.  

M: Yep. 

P: Do you agree? 

M: Look, I think we’re better than a lot of other countries. I wouldn’t say, I don’t think we’re there yet. Still a long way to go. But we’re doing a lot better than a lot of other countries.  

P: So if we’re going to wrap this up because we’ve gone over time as we always tend to do, this was such a big topic to try and condense into 20 minutes. I mean, we could go on and on.  

M: Maybe, all right. Well, on that note. Thank you for joining us today If you want to hear more please remember to subscribe and like this podcast. 

P: Stay happy people. 

[Happy exit Music] 

Related content: Listen to our Podcast: Enabling Happy Cities (E20)

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Finding Purpose with the Japanese Secret of Ikigai (E18)

by

Happiness for Cynics podcast

Have you ever wondered if there was more to life? Are you looking for more passion and purpose? Look no further than the Japanese secret to a long and happy life: Ikigai.

Ikigai comes from the people in the small Japanese community of Okinawa, a remote island with a remarkably high number of centenarians (people over 100 years old). IIkigai has also been proven to be a major factor not only in their longevity but also their happiness.

https://pod.co/happiness-for-cynics/discover-your-passion-with-the-japanese-secret-of-ikigai

Episode notes

In this episode we spoke about how many low income earners might not have much choice in the jobs they perform – Marie pulled a number out of thin air to make a point (30%). To ensure we don’t get angry emails, and to set the record straight, this ABC news article from last year can give you’re the real stats. In short, the average Aussie (median income) is $48,360 before tax, according to a report released by the Australian Bureau of Statistics, and many people below the median struggle to pay bills and meet healthcare needs.

Transcript

M: You’re listening to the podcast happiness for cynics. I’m Marie Skelton, a writer, speaker and expert in change and resiliency, and my co-host is Pete.

P: Hi there. I’m Peter Furness, and I’m a bicycle meander, baking indulgent and non-morning exerciser. Each week we bring you the latest news and research in the field of positive psychology, otherwise known as Happiness.

M: You can find our podcast at MarieSkelton.com, which is a site about major life changes and how to cope with them. The site uses a lot of the research that we talk about here on the podcast and has some really practical tips for bringing happiness and joy into your life.

P: So on to today’s episode, which is all about finding your passion and purpose.

[Happy intro music]

M: So welcome to today’s episode, which is about finding your passion and purpose.

P: Everybody’s gotta have a purpose. There is a song to go with that Marie, ‘Avenue Q’ people look it up.

M: So today we’re talking about having something to do in life, and the reason this is so important is that people who are happy and fulfilled live longer and people who have purpose in their life are more happy and more fulfilled. So you live a better life and the longer life.

P: Absolutely.

M: So, the opposite is also true for people without purpose in their life. And when we say purpose, really, lot of the time for most people, it’s their job.

P: Much of our purpose is lined up in our identity of what our occupation is. Definitely.

M: Absolutely. And that doesn’t mean that it has to be your job, and it only has to be your job. And jobs are taking on a lot different looks and feels nowadays. Definitely a lot more people working from home and the gig economy and services that you can provide online are changing the way that people work, definitely. But for a lot of us, when we talk about purpose, it’s what gets you out of bed in the morning and what you do with the bulk of your hours during the day.

P: But I think some people fall into the trap of not taking charge of that.

M: Absolutely.

P: They’re being led down a path that they think is this’s what I do. But when they actually do the work on themselves, it’s actually know what they want to be doing. That’s possibly what we’re going to talk a little bit more of today.

M: Definitely. And I think this concept of what you want to be doing is pretty new. To be quite frank.

P: Really?

M: Yeah. I don’t think our parents had as much luxury of choice.

P: Yeah, fair enough. They didn’t. They did the solid job. Get a good job. Stick at it. Don’t change jobs. You stay in the same job for 40 years, you stayed with the same company or that sort of stuff. You’re definitely right there. We jump around a lot more and we’re actually encouraged to. I remember sort of hearing from different people saying, I’ve got to move it’s been three years. I’m like ‘Oh, really? Three years and one company. Wow.’

M: Yeah, definitely.

P: You know everybody and the tea lady.

M: I’m one of those. I’m bored now.

[Laughter]

P: Well, that’s the other thing. If, if you’re not having a purpose or you haven’t done the work on finding your purpose, you may find yourself saying, oh I’m really bored with life. Why am I bored with life? This could be a good episode for you people out there that are feeling a little bit stale or a little bit stagnant and wondering ‘Is there a bigger picture?’

M: Yep, definitely. So we’ll look into that in a second. But firstly, I want to, of course [be]cause it’s me, throw some stats in there.

[Laughter] It’s all about the research.

M: Absolutely. But discuss what happens when you have no purpose, and that is such a bad place to be in when you look at the stats. So again, here we go with stats.

So in the US [United States]. Gallup[i] found that the longer you experienced unemployment, the more likely you are to report symptoms of psychological unease, so that can include things like anxiety and depression. Also, they found that one in five people without a job for a year or more report that they have been or are currently undergoing treatment for depression. So one in five people and the rate is about double the rate of depression of those who’ve been without a job for fewer than five weeks. So what that means is, if you’ve got a job, you’re less likely to have depression. If you don’t have a job, you’re more likely to get depressed. And the longer you go without a job, the more your chances of being depressed increases and another way of looking at a major life moment where your purpose might change is retirement.

P: Hhmm. [Sound of agreement]

M: And there’s a study by the London based Institute of Economic Affairs that looked at the likelihood that someone would suffer from clinical depression. And it actually goes up by about 40% after retiring.

P: Very surprising that figure and yet when you think it. I remember when my parents retired, they both retired at the same time and we were all focused on Mum. But what we didn’t realise was it was actually Dad that we had to worry about because Mum made the transition really well. I think because we pushed her to get a hobby. It was like, ‘You’re not going to sit at home and do nothing, so let’s find you something.’ And we forgot about poor old Dad, and it was Dad who actually suffered. He started painting everything yellow.

M: [Laugh]

P: He had some yellow paint, and so everything in the house got painted yellow, the barbecue, the stakes in the garden, the fence.

M: Oh dear..

P: [Laugh], poor Dad.

M: I think that is also a little bit just the way that we’ve expected men to suck it up and move on, and there’s so many great movements out there now about men’s mental health.

P: Mmm, oh definitely. And it’s been, it’s the planning and it’s having the foresight and the forethought to go right ‘I’m retiring in five years. What can I do?’ What can I be a part of? That’s where volunteering comes into it. Our extracurricular activities and if you’ve spent the time during your working life developing strong social connections in those extracurricular activities, albeit sport, church, community groups, all that sort of stuff. That and I think the science would probably back me on this is that that’s going to set you up well for retirement because everything doesn’t stop. I feel sorry for the blokes, particularly in rural areas where men get up and go to work. That’s what they do and then all of a sudden, when they’ve stopped working, there’s nothing to get up for.

M: Absolutely. I’ve been interviewing quite a few people for my book on this topic. So yes, the science does back you up on this.

P: Yay!  I was going out on a limb, quoting without looking at research. There we go!

M: Yeah, absolutely. And look that 40% who struggle after retirement. There’s a whole body of research on that, and one of the big things is purpose. And the other big thing that you mentioned, there was those social connections, so important for your retirement years.

P: Which is a nice segway into what we’re going to talk about today-

M: Actually, it is.

P: – Which is the Japanese concept of Ikigai. What is Ikigai, I hear you ask?

I love this explanation we came up with when we were talking about it. It’s a bunch of circles.

[Laughter]

P: It’s bubbles people. It’s all about bubbles. Bubbles, so in English a rough translation for Ikigai is a reason for being and it finds its origins in a little village in Okinawa, which is little island in Japan that has a high, really high number of centenarians, which is people over 100 years of age. We call it a blue zone, the amount of people who are centenarians and have quite a number of them in one location it’s called a Blue Zone and while their age may have been attributed to diet and lifestyle, there is the practise of Ikigai, which has been noted as a major factor not only in their longevity but in their happiness. So we can talk about Ikigai being, it’s a tool. It’s a way of doing some work. It’s a series of questions that you can ask yourself that look at the four major components of… and I’ll go through these if I can.

  • What you love;
  • What you’re good at;
  • What you can get paid for; and
  • What the world needs.

So we’re looking at passion, your mission, your profession and your vocation and that lovely little sweet spot where all those four elements tie in is what your Ikigai is. The reason you get up in the morning, it’s the reason you wake up and go ‘today I’m doing this because this is what I do.’

M: And I, I think that every year 11 student should have to do this exercise.

P: Oh, I agree. Definitely.

M: Right, because I remember filling in a bunch of circles A, B, C or D. Or would you prefer to be a gardener or an astrophysicist?

P: [Laugh]

M: And, and I said Gardner there, because it’s top of mind because Gardner came back as something I should consider as a career choice.

P: Oh, really?

M: Yes, anyway.

P: Surprising considering you can’t keep a herb alive.

M: I can’t, at all. I just have to look at a plant and it dies.

P: [Laugh]

M: Seriously.

P: Your terrariums doing okay.

M: I haven’t killed the plants that live in a desert? Yeah, Thanks.

P: [Laugh]

M: But I love that this considers not only the realities of what you’ll get paid for.

P: Yes.

M: But also what you’re good at and what you love. And I don’t think that enough emphasis is put on finding a way to get paid for what you’re good at and what you love. We, at school are taught more here are the things that you need to learn, and it doesn’t matter if you’re good at them, you’ve got to work harder.

P: Oh, yes. The markers, yeah.

M: And it doesn’t matter if you love them. That just wasn’t a factor at all. But this is about finding what, what sparks you.

P: Yeah.

M: And then how you can make a career out of that. The other thing that I will say though, is so many of us don’t do what we love and what we’re good at or even what the world needs on a daily basis. We do what we can get paid for.

P: Exactly. We put too much emphasis on one element of the off the four. And I think that that’s something that we could all do a little bit. This’s the thing about doing these exercises, it makes you look at the process of what you should be doing in a much more, I’m going to say spherical, and you’re probably going to pull me up on that one Marie, it’s a more rounded perspective of looking at it. It’s not just looking at what can I get the most amount of money for and what is my profession going to be according to how much money I can generate? That’s not the way to make this decision. And that’s what I like about the Japanese principle is it’s a much more rounded, much more spherical perception of coming at what, what choice should I be making?

M: I absolutely agree with you. The other side of what I was saying, though, is that for a lot of us, we don’t have that choice. You have to solely look at what can I get paid for?

P: Okay. Yep, true.

M: So for a large portion of the population, I think that you take what you can get.

P: That’s an interesting one. I guess I wasn’t part of that large portion, and it’s funny, I was watching Gardening Australia recently.

M: As you do Peter [laugh].

P: It’s a Covid[19] thing. It’s gotten me into gardening Australia. I actually love it, but they were interviewing this, this couple that we’re doing a garden and he was a sculptor and she was an artist and forgive me for, for being a little bit coy here, but sculptors and artists and those people, we don’t make choices according to money. We’re like, I’m going to go and be a plant specialist. They take that passion side, and that’s what they run with. They don’t go with what can I generate my income with.

M: And I think that’s such a blessed and privileged position.

P: It is a privilege definitely.

M: Yes, I guess what I’m saying here or what I’m trying to get at is that some of us have a reality. That means they have to work 60 hours in a minimum wage job in order to pay the bills and provide food for the family, right.

P: Yeah, well we all have to pay the bills and so forth.

M: But what I’m trying to say here is that you can do that with passion. So you’ve mentioned it before Pete. And I worked retail through university. You can bring a passion to living to a retail job that really doesn’t excite you. I worked in a muffin shop for the longest time.

P: [Laugh]

M: It was not lighting my fire, let me tell you that. But I had some of the best memories from great customers, good colleagues, lots of laughs. And I just don’t want this to be inaccessible to the, I’m going to pull a number out of whatever, you know, the 30% of Australians who have to take what jobs are available and who don’t have the luxury or the privilege that we have off choosing from a wide range of different career options or vocations.

P: Okay, so if we if we if we look at that 30% and we look at the concept of Ikigai, I actually believe that this process of going through this tool and using this tool is a way to unlock maybe some of the passion and unlock some of those other elements that does help you to bring purpose and fulfilment to a role that you’re really not wanting to do.

M: Absolutely and then the other thing is again. It doesn’t have to be your job. So if you find that your passion is an art and you cannot make a living out of your art.

P: So many of us can’t.

M: Then how do you bring your passion for art into your life in another way?

P: And that’s, that’s the, that’s the key. That’s the golden little .. nugget of jewel right there.

M: Absolutely. Well, good. I think we’re finally getting to the same point here.

P: It just took us a little round about.

M: Ha, Ha, I, I just don’t want to forget that I feel like we’re really quite privileged when it comes down to it to have the choice, and a lot of people don’t. But that doesn’t mean that this isn’t accessible for them as well.

So if we come back to the older generations in Okinawa and the concept of Ikigai, this is baked into the way that this society works. It’s really worth having a look online. If you haven’t looked at this before.

So they, they put the principles into practice. The community is really geared to activities that bring joy, and, like dancing and singing and giving back to the community and doing all these things in social ways as well. Not, not by yourself. And the impacts are huge.

P: Yeah, it’s a supported environment. If you, if you like it, it’s part of the culture.

M: Exactly.

P: It’s part of the infrastructure that’s already there. It’s geared towards this practise and it’s proven, it’s proven to be effective. As we can see, it’s a blue zone.

M: Yep, all right. So do we have any tips?

P: We do [laugh]. I’m going to let you go with those ones Marie, to start off with.

M: All right, I’ll go.

The first step to changing your life… That’s huge!

P: OH, that’s a massive leap into the unknown there.

M: [Laugh]  

P: Just dive right in!

M: First step is to understand yourself better.

P: That’s very Jungian[ii] thing isn’t it?

M: That’s not the cynical Marie that I’m used to being is it?

P: [Laugh] maybe you’ve gone through this process already Marie. You’ve done the work and it’s all about working. This doesn’t happen, magically. And I think that’s one of the points I do want to make. I’m going jump in here Muz. This stuff is hard. It’s hard yakka. You can’t just cruise along and expect it’ll just, to come through. It’s got to come up. You’ve got to actually go and do the work and do the exercise. And this is what this tool is great for its. It’s asking the right questions, so that you do sit down and go right ‘What is my purpose?’

M: Absolutely. So go online. Have a look for Ikigai, it’s I-k-i-g-a-i, and you’ll see the circles that Pete was talking about with the four elements of Ikigai.

And the first step is to write down all the things that you love, that you’re good at, that you can get paid for and that the world needs. And next, once you’ve written down all of those things, you need to set some goals. So once you’ve worked out where the intersection of all those four things lies best, might not be perfect. You might not find one thing that fits right in the intersection of it all-  

P: I think that’s really important to keep in mind it doesn’t have to be perfect. Just go with it. Have a little faith.

M: – but might find something that meets three of those four.

P: Exactly.

M: So once you’ve got that, knowledge without action is useless. So to reach your goals, you need to change your behaviour, which means you need to change your habits. And there’s a great book that is an international bestseller about changing habits, and it’s James Clear’s, ‘Atomic Habits’. So pick up that book, and in that book he talks about how and, and it’s a proverb that’s been around for centuries. You know, ‘the journey of 1000 miles starts with one step.’ And taking one step is so easy to take. That small, tiny habit that you start adds up over a lifetime to be massive.

P: Starts the ripples.

M: So take the time to do the brainstorming and the self-reflection, and then you’ve got to put into action.

P: And this might be, I’ve got a little list here Marie from two people who have written the book on Ikigai basically, they are..

M: Hector Garcia and Francesc Miralles.

P: Well done Marie, was a nice pick up there. I just dropped the mike. So these guys are well known Western authors of the Ikigai method and How to Find Your Ikigai, the Japanese practise and these steps all are pretty easy steps to sort of follow to keep you along the lines of maintaining that Ikigai, because Ikigai is not a static concept, it’s, it’s an ever changing concept. Our purpose in life changes from when we’re 17 to when we’re 45. We don’t have the same purpose. So this is not something that you do once, and you just keep following that path blindly. It’s something to revisit every now and then, so that you move along with your life changes and with your systems that are in process and buying a house and having Children. Your, your needs change your, your purpose changes.

So this is something to revisit all the time.

M: All right, so you’ve got 10 steps don’t you Pete?

P: I do, Thanks to Hector Garcia and Francesc Miralles, who wrote the book on Ikigai. The 10 steps include:

  1. Staying active, not retiring.
  2. Leave urgency behind and adopt a slower pace of life. Chill out people.
  3. Only eat until you are 80% full. I like that one it’s such a conceptual one.
  4. Surround yourself with good friends. Social connections.
  5. Get in shape through daily gentle exercise. That’s that lovely idea of maintaining gentle exercise and not hitting the intensity all the time, because is a negative influence on our longevity.
  6. Smile and acknowledge the people around you. See the people when they’re in front of you.
  7. Reconnecting with nature. Forest bathing, I keep coming back to it. It’s a real thing, look it up.  
  8. Give thanks to anything that brightens your day and makes you feel alive. This comes back to what we’re talking about, about self-care being church for non-believers. It’s another one of our episodes. M: And Gratefulness. P: Gratefulness definitely.
  9. Live in the moment. Mindfulness. And then the last one.
  10. Follow your Ikigai.

M: All right. I think that’s a good place to stop. Thanks for joining us this week. We’ll see you next week.

P: Stay happy people.

[Happy Exit Music]

Please note that I get a small commission if you buy something from my site. Your support helps to keep this site going, at no additional cost to you. Thanks!

[i] Gallup, Inc. is an American analytics and advisory company based in Washington, D.C. Founded by George Gallup in 1935, the company became known for its public opinion polls conducted worldwide.

[ii] Jungian – In reference to Carl Jung. Carl Gustav Jung was a Swiss psychiatrist and psychoanalyst who founded analytical psychology. Jung’s work was influential in the fields of psychiatry, anthropology, archaeology, literature, philosophy, and religious studies.

Self-Care is Church for Non-Believers (E17)

by

Happiness For Cynics podcast

More and more people around the world do not believe in a God, and therefore do not attend church regularly. This is such a shame, as the act of going to church has so many benefits including making your happier. In this episode, we discuss the ways in which you can replace some aspects of church, if you’re a non-believer, so you can bring more happiness into your life.

https://pod.co/happiness-for-cynics/self-care-is-church-for-non-believers

Transcript

M: Hi. I’ve forgotten our intro.

P: [Laugh] we should never have negroni’s before a podcast.

M: We should always have them.

[Laughter]

M: Welcome the happiness for cynics. That is not how this normally goes. I’m Marie Skelton a writer, podcaster supposedly and an expert in resiliency and change.

P: Hi, I’m Peter. I’m the co-host. I’m a herb harvester, a Feng Shui factualiser and I can’t remember the third thing that I am this week.

M: Maybe we shouldn’t do negroni’s before… [laughter].

This week however, we are talking about self-care and how self-care is church for non-believers.

P: I love that quote. That’s a brilliant that’s a Marie-ism, by the way, folks, that’s a complete Marie-ism.

M: I’ll have to turn that into one of those quotes.

P: Yeah do.

M: You know like the image on Facebook.

P: Think about it ‘Self-care is church for non-believers.’

[Happy intro music]

M: Okay, welcome back. That was probably the weirdest intro we’ve ever done. Alright, self-care we’re here to talk about self-care. We were talking the other day about how self-care is really important, and it’s, it’s important to do all the fabulous things that we talked about. But you’ve got to balance that with looking after yourself as well and taking time to relax and recharge and really focus on your inner self as well, so we were keen to do an episode on self-care and then we came across this idea of self-care being church for non-believers.

P: I love this, it’s brilliant. Such a good quote.

M: So reason that we say that, there’s a couple of stats here that I’ll paint the picture with. So we start in the States. There’s a recent study by the Pew Research Centre, which says that the percentage of Americans who believe in God attend religious services and pray daily has declined significantly during the last eight years. And then, if you look at the latest census results on religion from 2016 in Australia, about 30% of Australians selected no religion, and that’s more than 7% higher than the previous census, where they measured religion in 2011.

So one in three-ish Australians no longer believe in religion and ergo we will assume they don’t go to church.

P: True, I’ll give you that.

M: Making a leap there, but we’re going to make that assumption. And again, I’m not religious and you know each to their own is my philosophy on that. However, one in three Australians are losing the benefits off attending church and that’s just such a shame. So whether you believe in God or not, the benefits of going to church include learning things like kindness, gratitude, service to others, mindfulness having social interaction on a regular basis, meditation, awe and forgiveness.

And we’re going to go into a few of those right now because they all make the wonderful bucket of self-care. But they’re also critical for happiness.

P: I’m sorry. I’m just thinking of Kentucky Fried Chicken now you said, Bucket.

[Laughter]

P: It’s like a little bucket that you can choose from.

M: Exactly, there’s wings, there’s drumsticks.

[Laughter]

M: So let’s start with your, your church bucket here.

P: [Laugh] Do I have to wear my Sunday best? Do I have to dress up?

M: No, this is all about you-

P: – Oh, but I want to wear my hat with the fascinator.

M: You don’t have to but you can.

P: Well, this is the interesting thing is that I think that before we get into everything I’m going to segway here Marie. The fact of going to church, it was a huge social construct, traditionally in, especially in Australian lifestyles. But in Western lifestyles in general, actually, no, that’s not even true.

M: In the states you get dressed up there too. For those of you who think what enough does this Aussie girl know about the states? I did live there for eight years, some I’m kind of semi sort of calling myself a little bit American and I married an American.

P: You’re married by passport.

M: [Laugh] Exactly.

But oh, in the South.

P: Oh yeah, that’s the image I’ve got.

M: They get dressed up for church.

P: Definitely. It’s the social construct. So, the fact of actually going to church of actually taking the time in your weekly schedule to allocate one hour to go to a location, to go to a ceremony to get dressed up to invest in an action that is community driven. It’s something that set a precedent for interaction on people on so many different levels. And that’s what we’re going to talk about with when we talk about the sections that we’ve nominated.

M: What I love about the social interaction piece there Pete, we’re starting with that one, is the church construct encourages people to think about others and you welcome new people into the community. It’s just like, so we met through volleyball, and there is a tribe aspect to that as well. Definitely just like with church, where you look, well you should there’s always the misfits, but you should look after the new people that come into the club or the church or the environment that you’ve got there and you look out for them and you look out for each other. And for people who have never been to church or who haven’t maybe had that team aspect in their life that we have, I think it’s, it’s scary to me that they may never have experienced that community welcoming them in. I think everybody can experience this. It’s like starting in your job, the first time you walk into a new office you don’t know anyone. Everyone has their mates that they say good morning to, everyone hangs out in coffee shop. You’re the, you’re the newbie. You’re the brassy eyed, bushy tailed woman with your negligee scarf. It’s Jane Fonda in 9 to 5.

M: Here’s the thing though. The expectations on a workplace is very different from those at church or in a team sport.

P: OK, fair point. I’ll give you that.

M: You don’t have to, give two hoots about the person you work with.

P: All right, fair yes.

M: You don’t have to be nice to them if the boss isn’t looking, right?

P: Yeah

M: And so there’s a very different social element, and that’s why when we’re saying self-care is church for non-believers, finding your tribe, and there’s a lot of talk out there about finding the tribe and its people who will look out for you and go above and beyond for you. There’s a lot of lonely people out there who don’t have a tribe.

P: Exactly

M: And church would always take everyone in. Yet regardless of your personality, differences, preferences, all of that. Sports, there’s a little bit more argy bargy there, but –

P: – Especially if you play with Brazilians.

[Laughter]

M: – but you’ve got to bring everyone in to achieve a goal, right? And in theory you have to do that in workplaces. But in practise, I don’t think that drive to be accepting and welcoming to everyone is there.

P: Which I think brings up a point that’s really valid is that you’re putting yourself in the space by going to something like church. It’s, you’re expected to be friendly. You’re expected to welcome new people in. So there is that expectation of like ‘you will be nice, eh?’

M: So that social interaction. So I think, for people who are not going to church anymore they’re perhaps missing that tribe. And there’s a few definite opportunities for people to find that in other areas of their lives. But perhaps not as easy as just rocking up to church.

P: Oh, I agree. Definitely.

M: Whatcha got next?

P: Oh, kindness.

M: Yes, be kind. So the whole process of going to church, you’re putting yourself in a place where it is expected of you to contemplate kindness. Contemplate being good to your neighbour. Being nice to your fellow man. All those kind of community constructs that are really based on every society. I’m not just talking about –

M: Do unto others

P: – Western society.

M: I know that one, do unto others!

P: [Laugh] Go Muz, quoting the… what is it 15 commandments.

M: 10

P: It was 15 first, Moses threw a tablet.

M: We should not –

P: – Moses had a hissy fit and he threw a tablet [laugh].

M: Again, I apologise

P: He so did it was Charlton Heston.

M: Alright, maybe we shouldn’t use popular culture as a reference for peoples religions.

P: That’s fair, I get it.

M: Because this matters to [some] people.

P: But my point is you’re putting yourself in the kindness space and you’re expected to be [a] kinder [person] tapping into that. It’s like, OK, I’ve got to be nice to this person and it’s the fake it till you make it concept by putting yourself into a process where you’re forcing yourself to be kind. Maybe you actually might get a bit of beneficial kick-off from that being kind not only to others, but to yourself.

M: Absolutely so as we’ve mentioned in previous episodes the research on kindness is kind of one of the most selfish things you can do. I think we’ve said before another Marieism. The benefits from oxytocin I think and again we keep talking about all the fabulous chemicals in our brain, but the benefits that you get from being kind others are huge. So much so that being kind to others can be seen as a selfish act. And one of the major tenets of nearly all religions is ‘do unto others.’

P: That’s right.

M: So if that is not being reinforced through Sunday school and through your life once a week –

P: Yep, it’s a little reminder when the pastor or the person is standing up on that pulpit saying, “who have you loved of your fellow man this week?” And it’s like forcing you to go ‘right, I have to do this’ and that’s a weekly reinforcement.

M: I think it is that real weekly reinforcement. So whether you’re helping out with tea after the service.

P: Oh yeah, they always had good bickies at the Salvation Army.

M: Or whether you’re participating in a more formalised church program that helps the elderly mow their lawns, what whatever it is that your church environment does not having that in your week because you’re not religious, is a real loss.

P: Definitely, which is a nice segway into, into-  

M: – gratitude.

P: There we go.

M: [Laugh] I read your mind.

[Laughter]

M: And we’ve talked about gratitude, I think it was our third or fourth episode in season one, but again, being grateful for what you have and prayer is one of those things where you thank the Lord for the blessings that you have. And again, if you’re not going to church on a regular basis, the need for being grateful is not being reinforced in your day to day life.

P: Yes.

M: And again I would argue that in the absence of church, what are you doing in your weekly lives to remember to be grateful?

P: Yeah. If you’re not being like the self-help gurus and certain people like yogis who practice every day sitting there, looking at your mantras and looking at your chants and saying these things to yourself as a matter of wrote that’s a daily reminder as much as what church is if you’re not involved in those daily acts, even the act of saying a prayer before dinner that was a big social construct is that there was always the expected thing, and –

M: Two, Four, Six, Eight

[Laughter]

M: Dig in, don’t wait!

P: [Laugh] you could take that one. Yes, well, if we take it in the in the literal sense, you’re being thankful for the fact that you have food on your plate.

M: Which and I’m sure if any of us Journal on gratefulness. Having food is such a First World right.

P: Exactly.

M: It’s not a privilege anymore. I bet you, you pick up anyone’s gratitude journal in the First World and they’re not thanking people for the food on their table.

P: Okay. What’s next?

M: Service to others.

P: Aahh, being generous to others, it’s such a fulfilling action. There’s a lot of research out there that the supports the fact that if you are actually giving away 10% of your time 10% of your income, 10% of your energy in the service of others, you gain back tenfold what you’re giving out.

M: Absolutely.

P: It’s a no brainer, by giving out your generosity and actually offering up something that you have, it invites so much goodwill back into yourself. And again, it’s that selfish act, not a self-less act. It’s reinvigorating your own self esteem. It’s making you feel good. Who doesn’t feel nice when you give a dollar to the person who’s on the street corner begging for money? You think I’ve done my good deed for the day that reverberates through your day hugely. And if something’s – I’ve gotta stop clicking sorry – [Laughter], if when you’re having a bad afternoon, sometimes it’s enough to go you know what my karma jar is full because I gave that dollar to the homeless person this morning.

M: I think there’s also an even greater benefit. So, I’ve done a lot of coaching and a lot of the time for free.

P: Right.

M: Sadly, I’m not making money off my volleyball coaching, but there’s, there’s a sense of the inner satisfaction, and I don’t even know how to describe it. When you have those moments through a season, when a player executes a skill that you’ve been working with them on or they finally get it, and a lot of the time they’ll perform the skill and the first person they lock eyes with is you. You know?

P: Absolutely.

M: Right? Those moments where you’ve spent hours trying to help someone else to be better and they are executing what you’ve been working on together. They’re so valuable, so, so valuable, and you remember those, I remember those moments with those players years later. I don’t remember the projects I’ve worked on in corporate life or a lot of other things. But helping others to grow is such a positive thing.

P: Tim Minchin talks about it in his address to the Melbourne University [and others] a couple of years ago when he gave his ‘Nine Lessons of Life.’ If you haven’t watched it, watch it, it’s fabulous. Tim Minchin says “Be a teacher. Share your love, Share your passion. Share what you know because it will come back upon you.”

M: Yep.

P: And it’s so true.

M: Absolutely. All right, so I’m going to bucket two other benefits of church together here and they’re definitely more your areas of expertise than mine.

P: Yeah.

M: So mindfulness and meditation.

P: Oh dear meditation.

M: I’m bundling them together because we are running a little short on time now, But really, I think we should bump out to 30 minutes because every episode we say we’re running short on time don’t we.

[Laughter]

P: Maybe our listeners should vote on that on the poll.

M: We’re trying to keep it 20 [minutes] so it’s short, sharp commute time. But anyway. So there is definite research about attending spiritual retreats in particular if you’re talking about mindfulness and the greater psychological well-being that you get and feel good hormones in the brain from mindfulness in particular, and then meditation, you’re into meditation.

P: I’m a big time meditator. And I’m a big supporter of it because it is, there are so many benefits that lead to some of the other things that we’ve already talked about today. Kindness and gratitude. When you meditate, you calm your mind down. And it’s not about eliminating thoughts. It’s about recognising thoughts and giving weight to them. It’s such a brilliant way of accessing parts of our physiology and our mental capacity that has huge benefits.

M: Actually, the title of this is self-care. And if you can’t take in the negative and let it go, then you’re not looking after your mental health.

P: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, definitely.

Yeah, and actually, I’m gonna skip, we’ll end on your last one here. But skip to forgiveness, which is another teaching in many religions around the world forgiving others.

P: Yeah

M: And again this is, this is a way of letting go of that negativity. And there is yet again a lot of research about the positive benefits of letting this stuff go, allowing yourself to move on and not holding yourself back because of what others have done to you.

P: Being kind to yourself is part of self-care. Very, very important factor. Don’t be too hard on yourself people. Everyone is human, everyone makes mistakes, and it’s OK to make a mistake, as long as you learn from it.

M:  And it’s okay to have negative emotions too.

P: Absolutely. They serve you well. They’re a great lever.

M: And I think right now we’re all experiencing the full pendulum swing of emotions being in isolation and dealing with Covid and the increased anxiety we need to be okay with that. I think we’re learning some really good self-reflection and growth lessons from an emotional perspective because of Covid.

P: I think the awareness has brought it definitely back onto the floor where we’re now concerned with our community connections. We now are concerned with how our daily actions affect not only ourselves but others.

All right, we’re going to move onto the last one, awe. We’ve talked about this before awe inspiring stuff.

M: Awe, A W E, it’s very easy to be like or what? Or what?

P: [Laugh]. I’m going to tell a personal story here. So going through Italy with my niece a couple years ago in Europe, we went to Florence. We’ve done gone for a walk down to the Duomo the cathedral in Florence, and we stood there in the evening light and I’ve got to say it was a pretty amazing aspect. I didn’t know anything about this cathedral I didn’t know about the Medici’s at that time. But I’m standing there in front of this cathedral and it looked like something made out of cardboard, But it was so incredible and the way the light hit it, I was having a moment. Uncle Peter may have got emotional and had a tear in his eye and my niece turns around to me and says “You ‘right.” “It’s okay darling Uncle Peter’s having about a moment”, and she said “Okay, I’m going for ice cream.”  [Laugh]

M: I, especially coming from Australia, I could not agree with you more going through Europe I, I guess there’s a point where there’s only so many churches you can see but when they’re all 15th, 16th century churches and I can only think of Notre Dame and it still breaks my heart that it burnt down but thankfully we got to see it. But there is this understanding in a lot of religion that the place you go to worship should inspire awe.

P: Which brings us back to the point. Churches were built to inspire people they were a connection with the higher power. There were a connection with God. They were meant to lift you up.

M: So as far as awe goes, you don’t have to find it in buildings only as we’ve discussed in the past, we can find it in nature very often. It’s about putting yourself in those moments where you’re standing in front of the Grand Canyon or beautiful mountains, and you take the moment to be mindful and experience your place in the vastness around you. So we are needing to wrap up now Pete.

P: Oh dear. We’ve gone overtime again.

M: But I guess the last thing I just want to say to people is if you are not religious. How are you bringing these items into your life on a weekly basis? How are you replacing what church used to bring to people which was happiness. These elements that we’ve talked about kindness, gratitude, service to others, mindfulness, social interaction, meditation, awe and forgiveness, all of them were being reinforced in people’s lives, and they’ve all been scientifically proven in multiple surveys and research to bring happiness. So that’s my challenge. Find your church, find your church, find your tribe and find ways to make these habits.

P: And really invest in them. So, so make sure that you clock them, write them out and say, like, to a daily check and see if you can tick all eight of those boxes. Eight? Seven? [Laugh]

M: That many boxes, tick all of those boxes! [Laugh]

P: And that’s the benefit and whether you believe or not in religion, church served that purpose. So we need to find a way to invest in that. And it can be as simple as spending 15 minutes at home being mindful or meditating all those sorts of actions. Church doesn’t need to be a building. You’re absolutely right. It can be your backyard as long as you invest –

M: -Or your mind.

P: Exactly. You can invest in that but being mindful and being open to it is really important.

M: I think that’s a great place to end. Thanks Pete.

P: Aww, no worries.

M: See you next week.

P: Stay happy, people.

[Happy Exit Music]