Podcast

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: I fully support this forward progression.

[Singing]

P: Da Dum Da Daaaa!

M: Da da da da, da dum da daaaa

P & M: Da da daaaa!

[End singing]

P: Oh wow. You went to the refrain straight away.

M & P: Laugh!

P: God bless John Williams. Is that John Williams? I think it’s John Williams. [Yes, it is]

M: I’ve got no idea.

P: Laugh!

M: I didn’t even realise what we were singing, I just know it. Star Wars? What are we doing?

P: That was Raiders of the lost Ark, laugh.

M: Oh, yeah. Okay. Alright. It was one of those things from deep within my childhood.

P: Laugh!

M: It just came flooding back to me and I was like, I don’t know why I know this, but I do. Laugh.

P: Someone today at our IT meeting said does anyone here remember Xena Warrior princess? I’m like a, duh, laugh!

M: I dressed up as her for Halloween.

P: Laugh!

M: Do I remember her, psht! I have photos.

P: Laugh.

M: So, I’ve decided on today’s episode that we’re not going to mention the C word.

P: Oh! Not the See you next Tuesday?

M: No, not that “See” word.

P: Laugh!

M: The C word that has taken over our entire life.

P: Exactly. I’m all for not saying it ever again.

M: Well, I do think there are times where you need to acknowledge that things aren’t okay. But I also think focusing on bad things too much can just make you get stuck in a rut.

M: So, today we are going to talk about breathing your way to happiness.

P: Oh, you just stole my intro, Laugh.

M: And we’re not going to mention the C word.

P: Laugh!

M: We’re going to talk about breathing.

P: We’re going to talk about the B word, laugh.

M: The B word. Yes. Which as a cynic, and cynic is not the C word we were talking about.

P & M: Laughter.

M: As a cynic, breathing kind of seems a bit far-fetched.

P: I love that you brought this up Marie, because the way I was going to segway into this was actually talking about meditation.

M: Yep…

P: So, in a way, this is,

M: …

P: Uh okay, hold back. Just give me a second, laugh.

M: Go on. Change my mind, Peter.

P: Laugh, I have to explain this to our listeners. Sometimes Marie needs a bridal, laugh. You’ve just got to pull back a little bit and go ‘Okay, hang on. Let me have control here for a second.’ Laugh.

M: Or you could just join in?

P: Laughter!

M: I like to think it is passion and energy.

P: Oh, I support it, yeah.

M: And generally, people just come along for the ride, laugh.

P: True. True.

M: Laugh.

P: You get dragged along kicking and screaming. Both work! Laugh.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Anyway, moving on.

M: Breathing.

P: So, breathing. Well, it melds into meditation. And in the light of some of the episodes that we’ve done the last few weeks, this is this is an episode with a coping mechanism. So, we’re talking about things that you can actually do. And it got me thinking because I’ve recently been exposed to this, I actually realised that I’ve been using breath for a very long time –

M: Me too.

P: and breathing, actually –

M: Since I was born, I’ve been breathing.

P: Laugh, down Bessie!

M & P: Laughter.

P: Once again, bridal moment!

M: Laugh, sorry. As you were.

P: Laugh.

M: As you were saying, you’ve been breathing for a while?

P: Yes, I have been, but using breath, it was something that we did in my dance training. There was a lot of work around breathing, and we did a lot of Alexander technique and Feldenkrais technique and applied kinesiology, which is all about using the breath. These are terms that may not be familiar for a lot of people, but breathing was actually part of our training, if you like.

M: I think you might need to tone it down a bit, Peter.

P: Thanks, Marie. Laugh.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m pushing on here.

M: I love these episodes where I just get to jump in with snide comments or I prefer to call them witty comments.

P: Laugh, witty!?

M: When you’re trying to teach our listeners something.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Anyway, a bunch of fancy names for breathing.

P: Yes. Alright, then meditation comes along, so we know that Marie isn’t a meditator I’m speaking out, I’m looking out into my room here as if I’m speaking to the audience.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m choosing to ignore the person on the computer screen.

M & P: Laughter.

P: Using my nonverbal communication skills here.

M: Laugh.

P: So, we know that breathing is part of meditation. That breath is something that people who meditate train a lot with, and there is science behind it. We’re about to explore that science. So, there is a link between breath and stress, and so there’s been a lot of work in this and as far back as the 1950s. There was a gentleman called Walter Hess who coined the term the trophotropic response.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Now this trophy trophotropic response is about the integration of breath and how it works with the brain and in particular the hypothalamus, which is our sort of brain centre. It takes information and processes and sends it out to different parts of the brain and coordinates how the brain responds to information that’s coming in and out. So, the messages that are coming in from sensory and messages are going out, which is action.

M: And that’s what regulates this [stumbling over the word] tropho-tropic response?

P: The trophotropic response talks about the influence of the breath on the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system.

M: You’re getting really techy.

P: We are getting techy, I’m going for it with my study notes here. Sympathetic is the fight or flight response. So, when we are running away from the lion, we are in the sympathetic response. Our brain is going, ‘there’s a threat we need to run away. Let’s get all the blood and send it to the brain, because we need to activate the muscles. Let’s get all the blood and send it to the muscles because we need to perform running motions and get away. We need to elevate our adrenaline response because we need lots of energy to get moving to run away from the lion.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: The parasympathetic response is the opposite. It’s what happens when we sleep. It’s the rest and digest. So, when we rest were lying on the couch. We’re watching a movie. The blood doesn’t need to be out in our skeletal muscles. So, it goes internal. It goes to our digestive organs. It goes to our immune function. It goes to our defecation muscles down into our bladder and our urethra and things like that, so that we’ve got this resting and digesting.

In Eastern Medicine, they talk about it being descending Chi. So, the Chi goes from the outside, inwards into our organs. Are you with the mouse?

M: I feel like I’m having a science lesson. But how does this relate back to breathing? And what is trophotropic response again? Laugh.

P: Laugh. So, the trophotropic response is coined by Walter Hess to demonstrate an organism’s natural response to relaxation. What happens in our body when we relax, the science of relaxing.

M: And how does that relate to breathing?

P: So, what Walter talked about was looking at the ways that we could influence our relaxation. What do we do when we relax? What is the first thing you do when you finish work and you sit on the couch. What’ s one of the first things you do, Marie?

M: Scratch my ass?

P: Yep, then?

M & P: Laughter!

P: Grab a drink.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Hold on, I will sit with the vodka, generally.

P: Laugh!

M: Alright, I’ll play along, I’ll play along. Take a big, deep breath.

P: Take a big, deep breath. When we’ve finished a project, or we finished a block of study, or we finished an event. You take a big [long deep breath].

M: Mmm.

P: Now if we all just do that. If everyone takes a big breath and lets it out.

M: [Big breath]

P: What does that feel like?

M: [Whispers] Like a deep breath.

P: Notice your voice. It just went quiet. So, it brings us back to centre. If it takes us away from being this, ‘I’m on show and I’m gonna do this and that1,’ it’s like, Okay, let’s bring it all in internally. There were other scientists that explore this in the 1970s Schwartz, Davidson and Goleman and they looked at relaxation techniques which have a relation on cognitive and somatic components of anxiety. So, they’re looking particularly at anxiety and how relaxation techniques can influence what happens in our brain to downgrade anxiety.

M: What’s a somatic component of anxiety?

P: Somatic is movement basically. So, we’ve got cognitive, which is thinking.

M: Ok, yep.

P: And somatic, which is more movement, and this was coined by I’m going to get this wrong, Meryem Yilmaz, who is a Turkish PhD professor. She was talking about this and took this a step further when she was talking about exploring relaxation techniques with post-operative patients. So, patients who have gone in for operations.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Even pre-operative going into operations, using relaxation techniques and seeing how it affected their recovery from an operation. And she found that there was a positive correlation between breath and better recovery from operations. So, really, what you’ve said here is breath impacts, relaxation and relaxation can have impacts on anxiety both mental and physical, as well as pre and post-operative outcomes.

P: Yes.

M: Sorry. Not pre-operative outcomes as in… Okay, we get it though, laugh.

P: The intervention at the pre-operative stage.

M: Yep, helps with post[-operative] outcome.

P: Doing something pre-operatively helps with recovery, yeah. So, we’re talking about things that actually can help you with your health and bring you out of a situation in a better position. Agreed?

M: Got it.

P: Okay, so here comes the science.

M: But what’s the breathing, though?

P: Well, I’m so glad you asked this, Marie. Laugh.

M: I’ve been breathing since, you know, probably a few seconds after birth.

P: Laugh.

M: As has everyone else I know who’s alive.

P: Alright, I’m excited about this, I’m excited about this.

M: Laugh

P: So, if we actually go back to breathing and we look at the science, we’ve got a thing called tidal volume. So, tidal volume is the rate of oxygen and carbon dioxide that is exchanged in a single breath. Now, if we exercise and we breathe, what do we do?

M: When we’re exercising? Breathe.

P: Yeah.

M: You breathe faster.

P: Exactly. A lot of us take short, sharp breaths.

M: Yep, cause you’re trying to get oxygen in quickly.

P: Exactly. So, the other way that some of us will do when we’re exercising or we’re trying to breathe better is to breathe deeper. So we use forced inspiration to bring more oxygen into our lungs and then forced expiration to force more air out. Which do you think is more efficient?

M: Deeper versus shorter breaths.

P: Absolutely right. I’ve got some figures here.

Tidal volume is the amount of air that is exchanged on inhalation and exhalation. Okay?

So, according to percentage, 85% effective to slowly deep breathe as opposed to 40% on shallow and rapid breathing.

M: So, if you’re running or working really hard at the gym.

P: Yep.

M: Even though you might feel like you need to breathe faster and suck air in.

P: Yep.

M It is going to serve you better to slow that down as much as possible.

P: This is one of the things that we’ll come to later, and there’s a gentleman that we’ll talk about that’s actually trained in this. He’s trained his breath and training his body so that he can endure fitness by use of his breath, [and] he can make his oxygen/carbon dioxide transfer more efficient. Obviously, if you’re working at a high level, you need to breathe quickly and you need to expel air quicker. So, there is a certain point where your rate of breathing will increase.

M: Mmm.

P: If you’re under really heavy load and you’re going for it and half way through your marathon you’re having to go up a hill, you need to breathe quickly and you need to forcefully expire and inspire. We can’t change that. But if we look at the ways that we can actually control our breath, there are a couple of things that go on in the body. And the big one that is involved with a lot of research recently is this thing called the vagus nerve. Here we go with more science. I’m getting so scientific, I’m so proud of myself.

M: I know!

P & M: Laughter!

P: You created a monster, Marie! Laugh!

M: Accessible science, Pete.

P: Oh, oh.

M: Without the jargon, laugh.

P: Okay. So, one of the things that this deep breathing can do is it can stimulate the vagus nerve. The vagus nerve is our 10th cranial nerve. Okay, so when we’re talking about the vagus nerve and what it does essentially, if we can tap into the power of this vagus nerve, we can actually control how our body reacts to stress.

M: Ok.

P: And this is where the link with breathing comes in. So, if we can, when we are emotional and we’re suffering [from] stress and we’re running around and we’ve got things going on and I’ve got this deadline due and you start to get all hyper, you start to breathe really shallowly. One way that we can control that is to tap into our deep breathing which, according to the science, activates our vagus nerve, slows down our heart rate. We can use our breath to effectively calm our system.

M: Oh.

P: And there’s a gentleman who’s done this really well. And he’s well known in some of the extreme endurance athlete circles. Wim Hof, who is described as an endurance athlete and a Dutch philosopher.

M: Laugh, Dutch, I tell you, they’re all philosophers.

M & P: Laughter.

M: All those long, long winter nights.

P: Laugh, yeah. So, he’s known colloquially as the ICE MAN, because he goes and sits himself in the ice and snow and this is one of the ways that you can stimulate your vagus nerve. That and cold showers.

M: Hmm.

P: Yeah.

M: Again, another reason why this is just not for me.

M & P: Laughter.

P: But have you ever done that, when you come out of a really heavy volleyball tournament, and you’ve gone for a nice cold shower?

M: Look, we used to do ice baths when I was in college, and at the AIS. So yes, I know, really cold!

P: Laugh!

M: Not comfortable, you know, to the point where it’s painful, but I’ve never been a cold shower person. Never done it for me.

P: Yeah, so this guy has explored this whole idea of cold exposure and stimulation of the vagus nerve and says that this can actually ease yourself into stimulating your vagus nerve and calming your system down and creates better health and better understanding and better mental clarity after a very stressful event.

M: So, have a cold shower or breathe, and you’ll be able to reduce your stress. Is that kind of a summary of what we’re talking?

P: That’s pretty much it. Yeah.

M: Ok, I’m following. Laugh.

P: Laugh.

M: I got it. I got it!

P: Laugh! Took us a while to get there and lots of fancy words in between. I blame Marie.

M: I feel smarter.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Don’t ask me to repeat anything you just said.

P & M: Laugh.

M: But I feel smarter.

P: So, if any of our listeners want to go forth. I’ll get I’ll get this in the show notes. But you can look up Wim Hof and have a look at some of his stuff. They have been researching these claims in the last five years, and out of this research has come treatments for epilepsy. They insert, like a pacemaker into the vagus nerve, which stimulates the vagus nerve and helps people who suffer from epilepsy from having attacks. And they’re exploring this for other conditions, even down to Parkinson’s.

M: Interesting.

P: Yeah, so there is science behind this. So, the takeaway message is that if we can practise and be more aware of our breathing, we can actually breathe our way to better health and better happiness. And we did this a couple of weeks ago in one of our podcasts, where I asked everyone to do a little breathing exercise where we sat down and I asked everyone to take some belly breaths. Do you remember that one Marie?

M: Yeah. So, how much breathing do you have to do? How much like not normal breathing?

P: Laugh.

M: Visual… mindful breathing?

P: I’d have to look up some figures on that one, but it’s like anything. It’s about training, training the breath so that you can pull on this skill when you need it. So, if you feel like you’re just so pent up and you want to hit something because you’ve had a really bad day at work.

M: Because for some reason the idiots and my work are multiplying.

P & M: Laugh!

M: I don’t know if anyone else is experiencing this. Over time, there are more and more of them, I swear.

P: Laugh. We’re not naming Marie’s workplace in this episode.

M: Laugh.

P: Ugh, corporate. Corporate in general, laugh. So, if you’re dealing with annoying colleagues or just stress or you’ve got projects on or the C word is happening. If any of that’s going on, you can train yourself to recognise that and breathe in order to help reduce your stress response.

P: Definitely, yep. According to this, you can breathe your way out of it.

M: And does Ice Man, what’s his name? Wim Hoff. Talk about training yourself to breathe more deeply overall? Like, can you make this a subconscious behaviour? Can you train how you breathe in general?

P: Yes, yogis have been doing it for centuries.

M: So, yogis don’t only breathe deeply when they’re doing their exercises.

P: No, no they don’t.

M: They take that through their life. Do they breathe differently when they’re sleeping?

P: Laugh. Ooh, good question. That would be interesting. Well, it would be because there is a measurement of vagus nerve stimulation. So, you know, I would be interested to see the science behind it.

M: My watch tells me how deeply I sleep at night, how I breathe at night.

P: Aah!

M: It measures my breathing. I think there’s something, I think there’s different value in this. I know for myself that if I can tap into my breath when I’m involved in exercise, when I’m doing a particularly difficult workout. Sometimes I do tell myself, ‘control your breath, use your breath’ because that was, coming full circle, that was part of my training as a dancer, and it’s remarkable how it actually can. For me, it brings me very centred, and it makes me go. Yes, I can achieve this task that I’ve set for myself.

M: If I tried getting it in in volleyball. It would just be too much. There’s already so many things running through my head.

P & M: Laugh!

P: Which is why you’ve got to train it.

M: I think singing would be a great way…

P: Yeah, true.

M: You’re still thinking of a lot of things while you sing.

P: You are, which is why you need to train it so it happens naturally.

M: Yeah, yeah.

P: So, that’s the crux of it. And just as a finishing note, there is little exercise that you can do for this. A lot of people talk about belly breathing and how we should belly breathe and not chest breathe. We should breathe into our diaphragm, which is very true.

M: Yeah.

P: A lot of people associate belly breathing with blowing your belly out, and that’s actually not the best way to do belly breathing. The best way is to:

M: [whispers] I’m doing it right now.

P: Laugh. How do you feel, Marie?

M: Um… A little uncomfortable now!

P: Laugh.

M: But I think, yeah. I could do that.

P: I challenge you. I challenge you to try it and see how you go, laugh. There endeth the lesson.

M: Laugh. Thank you, Peter Furness.

P: Laugh.

M: Professor Furness.

P: Definitely not Professor!

M: It was a pleasure as always.

P & M: Laugh!

P: See what you’ve done?

M: Laugh!

P: Can’t take it back now. Laugh.

M: I’m still going to challenge you. Now you’ve gone the other way.

P: Laugh.

M: And I’m like… nah. Too much thinking, this is a podcast, Pete.

P: Where’s the gongs and incense and sarongs?

M & P: Laugh.

M: Exactly.

P: Laugh.

M: All right, well, I think we could all use a little bit of stress reduction in our lives at the moment. So, I will definitely be looking at breathing.

P: Yeah. Have a look at the website. See, if you can have a practise.

M: Okay. Will do, alright until next week.

P: Have a happy week.

M: Thanks for joining us today if you want to hear more, please remember to subscribe and like this podcast and remember you can find us at www.marieskelton.com, where you can also send in questions or propose a topic.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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The Silver Lining of COVID-19 (E85)

20/09/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about the silver lining of COVID-19, what it has taught us and how it has made us stronger.

Show notes

We are not in the same boat

A poem about COVID-19

Live in the Future

During the podcast Marie talks about an article in the conversation that discusses Why living in the future, rather than in the past, is key to coping with lockdowns – new research

Transcript

Coming soon

Coping with Stress Through Music (84)

13/09/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about coping with stress through music and the surprising effects it has on our mental well-being.

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: [Motherly voice] Hello Possums!

M: Hello! Laugh. Oh, that’s a cultural reference there Pete.

P: Laugh! For those people who aren’t Australian, in our listening audience, Google Dame Edna Everage and you’ll have a little laugh.

M: And look at the fabulous glasses!

P: Oh, yes. That was the Dame Edna of late. The Dame Edna the original was a very dowdy housewife. Yes, comedian character, created by Barry Humphries, 1950’s Melbourne housewife who came to stardom and was reinvented as a celebrity in the 1980’s.

M: It was probably my first ever interaction with a transgender or a man dressing as a lady.

P: Yeah, that character very much helped to normalise the experience for many Australians.

M: Mmm hmm. It was very progressive for that time.

P: It was, It was very brave of Barry Humphries to do that.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Very brave.

M: I’m sure he would have gotten a lot of hate mail. It would have been sent in the regular post. For those of you who remember what that is because it was a while ago.

P: Laugh, a letter? What exactly is a letter?

M: We are showing our age! Laugh. But I have some news today, Pete.

P: Ooh, some news.

M: Look what I got?

P: Oh, wow. Marie is holding up a wristwatch. Is that a…

M: A Fitbit.

P: Clickbit.

M: Fitbit. And now I will know how unfit I truly am.

P: Laugh. Are you lying on the couch eating crisps? Yes. Yes, I am.

M & P: Laugh.

P: And loving it!

M: So, I’m really hoping to rely on my Fitbit to do a bit better measurement of my overall wellbeing.

P: These things are amazing. I came across a client the other day who had a ring.

M: Yes. The Oura ring.

P: Awesome.

M: Yeah, they’re pretty cool.

P: So, he’s been monitoring his sleep, and you and I both appreciate how wonderful and fabulous sleep is and how we don’t get enough of it. We’ve talked about it before, see our podcast list.

Are You Getting Enough Sleep? (E54)

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And yeah, I was, I was intrigued. I was like, I’m going to get one of those, cause they look great.

M: If you want the ring, it doesn’t have as much functionality as I think, ah, what’s the Chinese one? [Xiaomi mi] So, there’s Fitbit, there’s the apple watch and then wewu [venu?] or something like that is another kind of Android one.

P: Yeah.

M: And then the ring does a few things more things, but is a lot more limited.

P: I kind of like that, though, because I don’t want to watch telling me to wake up and to go to the toilet and all that sort of stuff. Laugh, I’d rather listen to my body.

M: Just so that we’re clear my watch doesn’t tell me to go to the toilet.

P & M: Laugh.

M: That is not the functionality of a fit-watch.

P: Laugh.

M: Before we get sued.

P: It’s time for a bowl movement.

M & P: Laugh.

M: On that note. What are we talking about today, Pete?

P: Laugh. Well, we’re not talking about bowel movements, and we’re not talking about watches, but we are talking about music.

M: Oh! Dum dum dummmm!

P: Laugh, and how music can make you happy. Can music make you happy, Marie?

M: It’s not that direct.

P: Ooh, it never is.

M: My big, my big learning here. So, yes, it can help you relieve stress. And the reason I’m really keen to talk about this is because of a new study that came out. And I don’t know about you, Pete, but I am seeing so many more people around Australia experiencing stress and lowered mental resilience.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: And high-strung emotions.

P: Yes, I would agree with you completely.

M: Laugh, it’s the most diplomatic way I can put all of that.

P: I’m seeing it clinically in my presentation of clients at work. Very acutely and oddly, the need for touch is also becoming quite obviously a need for a lot of people who are in Sydney because we are in an extended lockdown. So, yeah, definitely agree with you on that one. And the fractiousness of people is becoming a little bit more obvious. I think there’s a lack of patience. There’s a lack of, there’s chinks in the armour starting to show.

M: Yes, absolutely. And you know, just because there’s a chink one day doesn’t mean it’s there the next.

P: No.

M: I think we’ve called it the Corona Coaster before.

P: Oh.

M: The ups and downs.

P: Ooh, can we patent that?

M: Well, any woman who’s been through a normal menstrual cycle would know how ups and downs work.

P: Ew!

M & P: Laugh.

P: La, la, la, la.

M: I think the whole world is experiencing these in 24 hours cycles right now.

P: Laugh! Hey, I had my man period a couple of weeks ago. I can relate, laugh!

M: Was it the response to covid shop, is that it?

P: No, no, no, no, no, no. I just had a bit of an emotional moment in the park and had to sit down in a gutter and compose myself for a couple of hours. Laugh.

M: Look, exactly, and this is exactly what I’m talking about. And I just want to be really clear that we need to experience those emotions.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: But we also need to pick ourselves up and move forward through them and not get stuck in them.

P: Yeah, don’t unpack.

M: Well, do the opposite. Unpack it, experience it, feel it, talk to people, get help if you need to. But resilience is all about bouncing back and not getting stuck in that space.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: And if you’re going down into that emotional place, it’s really worth looking at all the habits that you have and practises that you have in your life and whether or not they’ve been so disrupted that you’re leaving yourself without happiness and resilience cover right now.

P: Yeah, true.

M: So, if you can’t see your friends, that’s one of the pillars we’ve said. Or if you’re really just missing your friends and family and that face-to-face contact if all your hobbies and exercise, and all of that has just been stripped away from you. And, what’s the third pillar, Pete?

P: Laugh, p –

M: Purpose and meaning!

P: I was just about to say! Laugh.

M: Purpose and meaning. You know, if you’ve lost your job.

P: Yes.

M: And you’re just spending long hours watching Ellen and Oprah.

P: Laugh, or not even lost your job, but just at home and unable to work. This is the thing, a lot of people are at home and unable to go to work.

M: Exactly.

P: And it’s finding that purpose in your daily activities, waking up and going, ‘what do I do today?’

M: Mmm hmm. And so, if you haven’t replaced any of those things and even it’s just one of those pillars that’s been pulled away for the first time ever in Australia, we have so many of us in lockdown, so many in lockdown.

P: Mmm, it’s a new experience for us, isn’t it?

M: It’s a new experience for Australia and particularly new experience for our regional areas.

P: Yes, very much.

M: So, if you have had all these things stripped away from you and you are feeling a bit emotional, you are on the Corona coaster right now. What are going to do to replace some of those things? Because otherwise you run the risk of sinking further down that hole and entering depression potentially or increasing anxiety again, don’t watch too much news.

P: Yep, get those techniques out that we’ve talked about in our happiness literacy episode.

Happiness Literacy (E80)

M: Laugh.

P: If you’d like to go back and check that out. Getting my promotion on!

M: Laugh.

P: I’m dropping all the numbers here, [click, click] Laugh! But, no. Getting active and controlling what you can control and finding a purpose in something that you actually can do rather than seeing what you can’t do.

M: Yeah.

P: Flip the switch.

M: And so, one of those things, and we talk about many things [like] getting exercise, you can do by watching your TV and pulling up a 10, 20, 30 minute exercise or yoga class or any of, meditation even. There’s plenty of things on there that you can do.

P: Mmm.

M: From a mindfulness perspective as well. And it’s all free. It’s just about making sure you introduce these new habits. So, pick one. And now we’re going to talk about music, laugh.

P: Laugh.

M: Back to where we started. So, we’ll talk about this study. The Max Planck Institute for Empirical Aesthetics.

P: I love that ‘empirical aesthetics.’

M: Laugh, it’s a bit of a mouthful.

P & M: Laugh.

M: They have recently done this study. It involved six countries on three continents during the first lockdown in April and May 2020.

P: 5,000 people.

M: Yep.

P: That’s a lot of people, that’s a big study.

M: Absolutely, so from Germany, France, Great Britain, India, Italy, and the U.S.

P: Mmm.

M: A big group of people that they studied, and they looked at whether music impacted their moods and their stress levels.

P: I’ll jump in here, and just go from the complete impassioned response, and music so affects every moment of my day. I’ve always been very affected by music, and I use music as a way of connecting with different elements of my day and in my treatments, and when I’m working out and when I’m having quiet time. There are specific types of music that I tap into, so this is very close to my heart. It’s something I’ve always done. Even as a kid.

M: I tend to agree, but I don’t rely on music a lot it’s not a big part of my life.

P: Right.

M: But, depending… So, my writing days are Friday’s.

P: Ahh, yes.

M: And there’s a very big variety of music.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Depending on what I want to be feeling at the time.

P: Laugh!

M: What this study found, which I thought was most interesting, was that music itself isn’t the coping aid.

P: Mmm.

M: But music related behaviour.

P: Laugh.

M: So, the way people have adapted their musical behaviours during the crisis.

P: Ok.

M: So, if you were feeling down or if I was feeling down, I would put my Disney playlist on.

P: Laugh!

M: And I may or may not, get the shower then and sing to my heart’s content.

P: Believe me people, I’ve heard it. It’s been broadcast.

M & P: Laugh.

M: So, for me that’s the way of actively trying to turn my mood around.

P: Mmm, and it so works.

M: Singing, smiling, thinking back to being a kid, really, just letting it all go.

P: Yep.

M: To help balance the negative emotions. That’s what we mean by a coping mechanism.

P: Mmm.

M: Now, if music was just playing in the background and there wasn’t that intentionality, that mindfulness behind it.

P: Yep.

M: Then it probably wouldn’t have the same effect.

P: Yes, I’d agree. You need to be engaging with it consciously.

M: Yes, picking the music to influence you.

P: Yeah, definitely.

M: There’s good news here, in that people who were experiencing increased negative emotions – so just what we were talking about before – were found to engage with music, primarily as a way to regulate depression, fear and stress.

P: Mmm.

M: And then people who reported more positive emotions overall were found to use music largely as a replacement for social interaction.

P: I like this idea of using music as a replacement, I think that’s again that’s a solution-based perspective. They’re going ‘What can I control? I can control how I feel by using music when I can’t see my friends or reminding me of my friends because of a certain musical interlude or a certain musical experience.

M: And then more than that, a lot of musical people went out and made music.

P: Ah, oh yes! Yes, go the creatives.

M: Absolutely, and they have gone viral in so many ways. So, the company I work for has a fabulous employee who also plays guitar and sings. And she created a ‘Corona sucks’ video.

P: Laugh!

M: Where she lamented all the things that we’re all experiencing that we’ve mentioned many times here before. You know, the stretchy pants and the extra five kilograms we’ve all put on.

P: Laugh.

M: The fact that our hair is twice as long as when we started. There’s some very interesting men with some pretty interesting haircuts.

P: Yep, laugh.

M: Or lack of haircuts. Or they’ve just taken to the razor and taken it all off.

P: Laugh, yeah I’ve seen that.

M: Yep, laugh.

P: I’ve seen some guys come in with some coifs going ‘I just want my barber to be open.’

M: Laugh, mmm.

P: And then you see the guys coming in, ‘Yeah, the wife got to me.’

M: Laugh. And they’ve got a number one.

P: Yep, all over. Laugh.

M: Laugh.

P: Bowler cut.

M: Yep.

P: Laugh.

M: So, a lot of people have been making music about our experiences, and again that really can bond people.

P: Mmm.

M: Help you to know that you’re not alone.

P: Absolutely. There’s a wonderful story of a mutual friend of ours Marie, fabulous Brazilian boy. When the first lockdown happened, he manages a hotel in Sydney and they were part of the… Oh, the words escaped me.

M: Group of quarantine hotels?

P: Yes, the group of quarantine hotels. And on the last night at the 14 day quarantine. So, night 13 our friend Lucas organised for a DJ to come into the courtyard and played all these disco tunes for the people who are in lockdown, who could I think they could open their windows slightly. And they were all kind of dancing around in the disco.

M: Laugh.

P: And I thought, ‘What a wonderful way to bring a group of people who can’t actually communicate or even speak to each other together.

M: They can’t leave their rooms.

P: Yeah, and give them a little celebration. And there was another video that went viral in Sydney of a Sydney drag queen –

M: Yes!

P: – who jumped out on the roof of her apartment building and set up a disco ball and a DJ and got someone to film her doing full drag in the summer sun whilst everyone else was locked up in their rooms, laugh! I thought it was rather fabulous!

M: And do you remember early on in Covid. So, this would have been March, April last year in Italy with people playing on their balconies?

P: Oh, yes! That was amazing. Yes.

M: Yeah.

P: That was incredible!

M: Power of music! Laugh.

P: It is so powerful. And it has such an ability to change your mood. Which is why I’m interested about your point Marie in terms of its not the music, that’s the solution, it’s the behaviour around it.

M: Yes, so again, I think it’s like everything we talk about. You’ve got to be mindful, right?

P: Mmm.

M: Right? So, just putting on a playlist in the background and reading a book and not really registering it, it just becomes background noise.

P: Yep.

M: If, even that same playlist the next day, if you put it on and decided, you’re just going to head bang to it around the lounge room.

P: Laughter!

M: Very different physical and mental response to those two scenarios.

P: Mmm, Ok. And that elevates your mood. It’s that physical response to the music, which is actually doing the things with the neurotransmitters and changing the brain waves and the connections.

M: Physical, physiological, psychological response, all of it together so you don’t have to jump up and down and head bang.

P: Laugh.

M: I don’t want people to hurt their necks, but you maybe sit and just meditate or something over the music. I learnt that the other day, meditation, it’s a thing.

P: Laugh! I’m actually more buying into the head banging thing, because for me, being a former dancer, I wasn’t a technician, I was a musical performer like music. Music and movement was the thing, and I could perform or dance to a certain piece of music in such a way that was completely different to something else. And for me, it is that physical response. It’s that buying into the, putting Julie Andrews on with the opening of The Sound of Music and throwing yourself into a pirouette and spinning out into the backyard, going ‘The hills are alive!’ You know, that laugh.

M: I would have gone with Queen.

P: Yeah, everyone has their, has their breakout song.

M: Queen!

P: Yeah, you do. You jump around, you make yourself physical and I think this is, this is definitely a key for it.

M: I don’t know anyone that can play Bohemian Rhapsody without screaming it from the roof tops.

P: Laugh!

M: And then when, when that guitar solo comes in, laugh!

P: That guitar moment, yeah.

M: The headbang! Yeah.

P: I blame Wayne’s World for that one. I don’t think anyone ever did the head banger before Wayne’s World.

M: Laugh.

P: If you can’t remember Wayne’s World kiddies, look it up. Laugh!

M: There you go. There’s another cultural reference for your Netflix watching, laugh.

P: There you go. I want to just jump in here Marie and mention that it’s not only during Covid that music has been used a coping mechanism. There’s a lot of references to music being used as a coping mechanism in other great trials of humankind. And, of course, one of those is the Holocaust from the Second World War in Nazi Germany.

M: Yes.

P: There was a lot of music being used by people in the concentration camps and people in Auschwitz and things like that to find emotional comfort and also to connect because they couldn’t speak to people in the other gulags. But they could hear them, and it was as simple as whistling. And there’s a story of one young boy who actually whistled along with the band, and it resulted in him getting less, less duties in the concentration camp.

So, there was this lovely connection. I’ve got a couple of quotes here,

‘Music gave us so much. To escape, even for a few moments to a “normal” world. Music allowed us a complete disconnect and emotionally escape from the horrors of the daily life.’

M: That’s so powerful.

P: It’s completely powerful.

M: What do I say after that? [Nervous laugh]

P: Yeah, and it’s momentous. And even after that, it’s that buying in. And again, it’s mindfulness because when you hear the strains of something beautiful. I mean, if anyone’s watched Schindler’s List that that haunting melody it can definitely suspend whatever moment you’re in. And if you can buy into that and choose to listen and disengaged for that 30 seconds that can provide that respite and it can even provide connection.

M: It can take you to another time and place. I think it was, was it a week ago?, two weeks ago? That I wrote to you and I was almost balling, laugh. This is again another Corona stress-filled moment.

P & M : Laugh.

M: Baby Mine came on my playlist.

P: Oh! Disney!

M: From Dumbo, and Dumbo was the movie that we had on VHS when I was little and it was what I watched probably 50 times.

P & M: Laugh.

M: But it was my sick movie, that and Annie, and I watched Dumbo a lot. And so, Baby Mine came on this playlist, laugh. And I got all teary and emotional.

P: Laugh!

M: Poor Dumbo, his mother behind bars.

P: Laugh. Yep, totally agree with that one.

M: And it really just took me back to being in my lounge room on my orange velvet couch.

P: Oh wow!

M: Yeah, yeah. We were out of the seventies. We held onto it a bit longer than we should have.

P: Laugh!

M: But comfy couch. It really just took me back to that place and time. So, I’m just sitting here in my first world home with my income and with my husband and cats. And that was such a wonderful experience of escapism for me as well.

P: Mmm.

M: That was meaningful, but yeah, absolutely there are people going through tougher times than us, definitely.

P: Yep.

M: And music has helped people who have been through probably one of the worst periods.

P: Mmm. And it can help you, I think. And that’s the thing if you are feeling like you’re struggling, maybe give music a go.

M: Well, I think again, as we’re saying, give something a go.

P: Mmm, mmm. Find something you can control and give it a shot. See how you feel, buy in.

M: Absolutely, buy in. We’re no longer cynics you know, you’ve kind of convinced me to buy in.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: We might need to change the name of the show pretty soon, laugh.

P: No, because I think I have moved into the cynic world.

M & P: Laugh.

P: I had a little moment last night, where someone was talking about a certain esoteric absence and I was like, ‘what a crocker!’

M: Laugh!

P: I’m like ‘Oh dear. What has this show done to me? Laugh! I want science. I want studies, I want scientific evidence-based research! Laugh.’

M: I love it, and soon we will be one Peter.

P: Laugh! Oh, youngling.

M & P: Laugh.

M: All right, well, I think we might wrap it up there for today. But we will also maybe finish our episode with a clip from one of Pete’s favourite songs.

P: [Gasp] Oh!

M: I’m not going to tell you what it is. But our producer Lea, will end our episode with that.

P: Laugh!

M: So, until next week.

P: I’m going to have to listen back now.

M & P: Laugh!

M: All right, bye everyone.

P: Have a happy week.

[Snippet from the song supercalifragilisticexpialidocious in Mary Poppins – Julie Andrews and Dick Van Dyke]

It’s supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
Even though the sound of it is something quite atrocious
If you say it loud enough, you’ll always sound precocious
Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious

Um diddle diddle diddle, um diddle ay
Um diddle diddle diddle, um diddle ay
Um diddle diddle diddle, um diddle ay
Um diddle diddle diddle, um diddle ay

[start of fade out]

Because I was afraid to speak when I was just a lad
Me father gave me nose a tweak and told me I was bad
But then one day I learned a word that saved me achin’ nose
The biggest word you ever heard and this is how it goes

[faded out]

The Power of WOOP-ing (E83)

06/09/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about the powerful new strategy for wish fulfilment, devised by a German-American Psychologist, called WOOP.

Show notes

WOOP – Dr Gabriele Oettingen

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: Howdy. Howdy. Howdy.

M: Hi, hi!

P: Hi.

M: I’ve never said “hi, hi!” in my life. Why is that becoming my thing.

P & M: Laugh.

M: [Singing] Hi ho, hi ho,

P: Laughter! We’ve gone Disney, laugh.

M: [Singing] it’s off to work we go.

P: Laugh.

M: Today we’re talking about the power of WOOP-ing

P: Whoop, whoop! What is WOOP-ing?

M: Whoop, whoop! Laugh.

P: I don’t know anything about this one. So, this is all Marie, laugh.

M: All right, so today we’re talking about German American psychologist Gabrielee Oettingen’s strategy for wish or goal fulfilment. And it’s called WOOP. And the reason we’re talking about wish or goal fulfilment is that we understand that you’ve joined our show to talk about happiness.

P: Laugh.

M: And so, you have a want or a need to be happy or happier and that maybe there’s some change that needs to happen. And in order for you to make those changes in your life to perhaps find time to bring meditation into your weekly habits or to do more exercise or to start a journaling practise.

P: Ok.

M: Or gratitude practise, all of the many things to actually change is hard. It really is hard.

P: Laugh.

M: And as we’ve mentioned before, I nearly died. And that is the only reason I have flipped from being such a cynic for this stuff to buying in wholeheartedly. Right?

P: Mmm.

M: And you shouldn’t have to die –

P: Except for meditating, laugh.

M: Except for meditation, yeah.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s a step too far.

P: Laugh.

M: Shh. However, you shouldn’t have to die or have to have a huge –

P: Life changing moment, yeah.

M: – traumatic experience in order to make change. So, this is us coming in and trying to give you the tools to help you make change, to be happier in your life.

P: So this is the, getting down and working people.

M: Doing the hard yards.

P: Yeah, he he he. Is this where we launch into: Hi ho, Hi ho! It’s off to work, we go!

M: [Singing] Hi ho, Hi ho, it’s off to work, we go!

P: Laugh! You can’t see, but Marie is doing some very deep shoulder action. Laughter!

M: Got my pickaxe over my shoulder.

P: Laugh!

M: So, WOOP. W-O-O-P.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Is yet another acronym that we’re throwing your way.

P: Laugh.

M: It is a motivational strategy, so it uses visualisation. Don’t hang up on us now.

P: Laugh.

M: Stick with us.

P: We just lost all the cynics, “visualisation? I’m out of here, bye!” Laugh!

M: Here’s the thing for all you cynics. Don’t knock it till you try it, is what I’m going to say.

P: Ooh! Laugh.

M: So many years I knocked it, but I didn’t really try it.

P: So many times, laugh!

M: Mmm hmm. So, WOOP is a motivational strategy.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Which uses visualisation techniques to help people develop good habits and break out of harmful ones.

P: Breaking habits is hard for anyone. And who doesn’t make a New Year’s resolution and go yes, this year I’m going to do this. And what a lot of people miss is they miss the step of breaking the bad habit and investing in a new habit. That’s hard, Yaka.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: It’s not easy. And so, this is a straight lift of a technique that you can apply to try and make that new habit.

M: Yeah, and to make it stick. And we’ve talked about neural pathways before. When you’re creating new habits, you’re also concurrently breaking other habits, whether they’re not necessarily bad habits.

P: Yep.

M: But you’re replacing one way of doing things with another way of doing things, and it takes time to build that neural pathway. So this is a great technique that you can use to help build that. And, for instance, when I started doing gratitude as a daily practise, I would forget all the time.

P & M: Laugh!

M: It just wasn’t something that was part of my routine. And now it is.

P: Mmm.

M: And now to the point that my husband goes, “You haven’t done the gratitude yet.” Laugh.

P: Oh, wow! Even Francis is buying.

M: I know! He is, laugh.

P: Wow! Nice.

M: Laugh. Okay, so this WOOP or WOOP-ing technique or motivational strategy is developed by someone that we just need to dedicate just a minute to because Pete and I both found this kind of cool.

P: Laugh!

M: So, she is a German American psychologist, and her name is Gabriele Oettingen. She’s a professor of psychology at New York University and the University of Hamburg, And…

P: She’s a princess!

M: A German Princess! How cool is that?

P: A German Princess, I said before, I want to play that part of when I walk into my next high society class/ social function.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: [Upper-class refined voice] “I’m a professor of psychology, and I’m a Princess.”

M: Mmm hmm. A German Princess, thank you very much.

P: Laugh!

M: So I’m going to dust off my high school German.

P: Ooh.

M: And try and read you her full name. So, it is Princess Gabriele zu Oettingen-Oettingen and Oettingen-Spielberg.

P: Why do they have so many names?

M: I think, many cultures unlike ours, keep a hold of the previous generations last name and hyphenate. It looks like that’s probably what they’ve done here.

P: Well, she’s… The lineage goes back to 1141, that’s huge.

M: One of the oldest existing families in Bavaria.

P: Yeah, that’s amazing.

M: So, Gabriele’s father was the ninth Prince of Oettingen-Oettingen and Oettingen-Spielberg.

P: Sorry, I’m laughing [Muppet voice] ‘Oettingen-Oettingen hygge.’

M: Hygge, laugh. Different countries, by the way. So, we’ve spent our one minute on the lovely Princess and Dr Gabriele zu Oettingen-Oettingen and Oettingen-Spielberg.

P: Laugh.

M: And now let’s get into WOOP. So, so this is, and this sounds really kind of cool and a bit sexual.

P: Laugh!

M: It is a fantasy realisation theory.

P: Oh. Well you got me at fantasy.

M: What we mean by that is wish realisation theory.

P: Oh, yeah. Got it.

M: Now there’s nothing, there’s nothing sexual really about that.

P: No, not at all sexual. I’m all into dragons and you know –

M: – Oh! fantasy.

P: Yeah.

M: Laugh!

P: You know, taking a ring and wandering off to the New Zealand mountains with unicorns and all sorts of mythical creatures.

M: So, what… We’re going to go with Dr Gabriele, So they don’t have to say the whole name every single time.

P: Laugh.

M: What Dr Gabriele has found through her research is that mentally contrasting future and present realities, i.e. what could be with what is, changes cognition, emotion and behaviour.

P: Ooh.

M: So, the cognitive and motivational processes are what is responsible for making WOOP work. So, you go through the process. We talked about how it’s a visualisation technique.

P: Yep.

M: But you go through the steps and you visualise and you do what you need to do, and your brain actually changes along with you. So, this is the first part of putting those new neural pathways into practise.

P: Mmm, I like this. I like this idea.

M: So WOOP involves, in case you couldn’t guess, four steps! Because it’s a four letter acronym!

P: Laugh.

M: And WOOP is about finding a Wish…

P: That’s the W. [Singing] A dream is a wish, your heart makes…

M: Exactly. That was such a throw, Pete.

P: Sorry, I wasn’t thinking. I was like ‘Why did she stop talking?’

M: Laugh! I was like, come on, we’re talking about a wish here.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Okay, So WOOP is about finding Wish, envisioning the Outcome, finding the Obstacles and formulating a Plan. So:

Wish,
Outcome,
Obstacles,
Plan.

P: WOOP.

M: It’s a type of psychological strategy that is well known and known as MCII or Mental Contrasting with Implementation Intentions.

P: Wow, is that just a fancy way of saying projection?

M: Mmm…

P: I’m sure it’s more complicated…

M: Contrasting with a real delivery or implementation focus.

P: Mmm.

M: Well, what is? What could be? And how do I get there? How do I bridge the gap?

P: Mmm OK.

M: And it is very similar to what a lot of change management professionals do in a corporate setting.

P: It is? Ahh.

M: What is the current state today? What is the future state we want to get to? How do we get from A to B? Yeah. So, WOOP has a website.

woopmylife.org

P: Laugh, I like that.

M: Yep.

P: Whoop my life!

M: [Singing] Whoop, there it is.

P: Laugh.

M: I had to go there, laugh. And they currently have about 60,000 visits a month on their website and 77,000 WOOP app downloads and a book.

P: Wow!

M: So you can go spend a whole lot of time looking more deeply into all of this, But we’re going to cover at a high level how WOOP works now so that you can maybe start to put in practise off the back of this episode.

P: Laugh.

M: So, firstly, you need to set aside about 15 to 20 minutes by yourself in a quiet place. Next you need to have your goal.

Your wish, your W in the Woop. So, it needs to be feasible.

M: So, you being a Princess, Pete, not feasible.

P: Oh, Come on! I can walk in heels, laugh.

M: Not feasible, laugh.

P: Oh, boo! Laugh!

M: You being a transvestite, feasible.

P & M: Laugh!

M: Pop those heels on and strut honey strut.

P: Laugh. As I do, laugh.

M: So, you might decide that you want to introduce meditation into your week three times a week.

P: Done!

M: That might be feasible, but it could also be challenging.

P: Yes.

M: Given that you’re working from home in Covid and you have young kids around you.

P: Sure.

M: That could be the challenge, finding time to get away and hide from the Children.

P: Yeah, for sure.

M: So, what you need to do is identify your wish and make sure it’s feasible but challenging and the next you need to, and this is where the visualisation comes in, so sit quietly.

You’re going to identify and vividly imagine the best Outcomes [wOop].

P: So, projecting that image of me doing meditation in a space in the place and actually seeing it?

M: And not only that, not only that, what that will give you.

P: Ok. Oh, the outcome, of course.

M: Why is meditation the thing that you picked? Why is exercise the thing you picked? Why is gratitude thing that you picked? So, what are you ultimately trying to get to? If it’s exercise, it might be decreasing stress and getting that six pack, right?

P: Laugh.

M: Let’s visualise what it is that you want as an end goal of not only doing the activity but the end result.

P: Ok, yeah.

M: The wish.

P: Got it.

M: Okay, so sit there and spend a good five minutes, it’s only five minutes of your entire life.

P: Laugh.

M: But spend the five minutes actually, visualising that, how will you feel. You know, if you can add any of your senses in there, what will it look like?

How will it smell? Taste? What are the tangible things that you’ll be able to experience if you achieve that wish and the outcomes?

P: Yep.

M: Next,

You’re going to search for the central Obstacles in you [woOp].

P: Ok.

M: I love that it’s Obstacles In You!

P: Mmm, that’s very telling.

M: That really helps you understand. And we just spent some time talking about control, spheres of control.

P: Yep.

M: What can you control and remove as barriers to your success?

P: Yeah, yep.

M: What is in the way, in you?

P: Mmm and not externalising it. It’s not about the kids running around. It’s like, why are you choosing not to give yourself time? Why are you choosing to dismiss this important aspect of your life? Very important self-reflection.

M: Absolutely. So, after identifying the central or the top few inner obstacles.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: You need to then go back to the imagination and visualisation. So, I want you to visually imagine it occurring. So, asking your husband after he’s been home for half an hour and has decompressed himself. If you can leave the house for 30 minutes.

P: Hmm.

M: And going to your local park and sitting on a bench and doing your meditation for 20 minutes in silence there.

P: Cool. Like it.

M: Or, you know, again we’re going with that example.

P: Laugh.

M: But whatever it is you need, visualise and vividly imagine all the steps that are needed to remove those barriers. Write down those specific actions, those things. So again, just reinforce those things that you need to do to get over the obstacles that you see might be in your way.

P: Ok.

M: And then

Finally, we’re going to form a Plan [wooP], and the form of this plan is, ‘if I do this obstacle, then I will get closer to the goal.’

M: So, it’s the action to overcome the obstacle. So if I talk to my husband tonight about needing a 30 minute time out in the evenings, after being home all day with the kids.

P: Yep.

M: And if I make sure that I can get to the park before you know eight PM at night, whatever it is that works within your schedule, then I’m going to be able to sit down for 20 minutes and meditate and feel happier and more relaxed and less stressed and able to enjoy the rest of my week with my kids and my family.

P: Mmm, yeah. It’s an interesting, slightly different approach in that it’s actually naming the obstacles.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And I think this is the big difference about this approach is spending some time looking at not only what you want and what you desire, but what’s in the way. What is going to stop you from achieving this? And Doctor Pulkit Sharma is a contemporary psychologist, and he says that this approach makes sense when we’re simply talking about positive thinking, that in itself cannot accomplish much at the base level of thoughts.

M: Mmm.

P: Whereas Dr Gabriele’s approach tells you to focus on the obstacles, it takes fantasy into action that turns into reality.

M: Absolutely.

P: Very proactive.

M: This is making it real and really breaking it down. So, you know what steps need to be taken.

P: Mmm.

M: And if you’re talking about a wish that is a real departure from your comfort zone or what you’ve done in the past and might be a challenge for other people around you. It might take some time to work through these challenges, but at least you’ve got them there and you understand your path to success.

P: It’s a very practical approach, isn’t it? It’s taking that, when you first started talking about you were talking about fantasy and visualisation… But when you actually look at the technique, this is looking at the hard yards ass of this. Excuse me for swearing, but it’s looking at the tangible things that we need to change. That’s incredibly practical.

M: Yep, absolutely.

P: So, this should suit all out cynics out there and get them on board because it is something they can really focus on.

M: And on the topic of practical, it’s so important, and Dr Gabriele talks about making sure that it’s within your realm of control. So again, being a size six by Christmas is just not going to happen for me.

P: Yep. Okay.

M: Just not going to happen. I’m over 40 now.

P: Laugh.

M: I’ve said it and I have other things going on in my life as well, and I like food, and that’s a challenge.

P: Yep.

M: That’s one of my many challenge.

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: And even if I was to exercise and eat well between now and Christmas, being a size six is highly unlikely without doing some real damage to myself quite frankly.

P: Yeah, and being dangerous.

M: Yeah, and so it’s really out of my control. And aiming for that only does more harm than good.

P: Mmm.

M: She’s really clear to say, don’t use WOOP for wishes that are outside your control.

P: Ok.

M: Or outside your sphere of influence, which we’ve spoken about recently as well. So, the team that has done experiments around this WOOP technique has found that putting future outcomes against the obstacle tweaks are non-conscious brain circuits.

P: Ooh.

M: So, there’s a lot going on around this technique that’s backed by science and how our brains work as well. It’s not just, you know, the next coach, business coach or leadership coach who’s come up with an acronym.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: There’s real science behind a lot of this stuff. The team said they did a lot of questioning on how mental contrasting works and the research shows that focusing on both the desired future and the obstacle in yourself is helpful to get engaged and to get out of that passivity and hopelessness.

P: Mmm.

M: So, it’s really about, as you said, getting started on making the change rather than just thinking about it.

P: Mmm hmm, yeah.

M: So, focusing on the desired future provides a direction to act, and focusing on the obstacle provides the energy to act.

P: There’s no point going into a battle if you don’t know the opposition. It’s about doing your homework before… I’m thinking Gladiator, walking into an arena and not knowing that there’s going to be three lions coming at you means that you’re not prepared. So, identifying the obstacle.

M: Yeah, but more than that, knowing that there’s three lions and then knowing how to kill each of them.

P: Yeah, exactly.

M: Right?

P: It’s very practical, yeah.

M: Absolutely. Okay, the WOOP technique just to start summarising… You’ve got a few good quotes actually here, Pete, that you wanted to throw in from people who have been using the whoop technique.

P: I talked about Dr Sharma before, and I’ll go back to Dr Gabriele herself, “The obstacles we think most impede us from fulfilling our wishes can help us realise them. WOOP instructs us to dream our future dreams (first) but (then) to imagine what obstacles in our psyche prevent us from achieving them”.

A WOOP user, Kamakshi Sinha, sorry for butchering that name, says that this has really helped her identify doable wishes, even though she can identify the hurdles in the if and then plan, she has a tangible approach to that. And again, Dr Sharma concurs, saying these approaches need intrinsic motivation in his 17 years of experience most approaches depend on you to change, so it is not a magical power or formula. It needs burning desire!

M: Come on, you just said magical, and you didn’t go Disney?

P: Laugh, I was on a roll and I’m on a time constraint here!

M: Laugh.

P: If I keep going it could be another 20 minutes here. Laugh!

M: All right, well, we are coming to the end here, so that’s a really good place to end. You’ve got to want to change.

P: Yeah.

M: But this is really about breaking it down into practical steps that you can take and then couple that with the research in neuroscience about changing behaviour. You’ve then got to stick with it. And as we’ve said, easy to say, not so easy to do.

P: Laugh.

M: We’ve all set New Year’s resolutions that –

P: Failed miserably.

M: -we’ve forgotten about very quickly. Laugh.

P: Yeah.

M: Moving on, laugh.

P: So, if you have been that sort of person and you haven’t had some tangible tools to actually deal with it. This is one of them that you can actually try.

M: Yeah, and then that next really tangible step that you can do is pop these into your diary.

P: Mmm.

M: So, that’s the final piece of advice that I’ll throw in there. It’s not part of WOOP, but it’s definitely part of a lot of the science of change and making change and personal change. So, once you’ve done all of your visualisation, you’ve worked out your Wish, your Outcome, your Obstacles and you formulated your Plan. Pop the steps into your diary and you’re more likely to do them.

P: Sounds good.

M: And on that note, we’ll leave it there until next week.

P: Go and be a German princess.

M: Please do.

P & M: Laughter.

M: See you next week.

P: Bye.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Are You Getting the Rest You Need? (E82)

30/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics

This week, Marie and Pete discuss the latest research on different types of rest, and pose the question are you getting the rest you need?

Show notes

Rest Quiz – What type of rest are you not getting?

Go to: https://www.drdaltonsmith.com/ and complete the free Rest Quiz on Dr Dalton’s website

Physical rest
Mental rest
Sensory rest
Creative rest
Emotional rest
Social rest
Spiritual rest

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

P: Hi, hi, hi 😊

M: How’s this for country hospitality. I ran away from Sydney just before the latest lockdown and have joined my husband, who’s been working up in Tamworth, which is in regional New South Wales in Australia. And instead of knocking on our door during these covid times, I got a handwritten note from our local Mormon.

P: Yep.

M: Inviting me to join them.

P: I’ve heard of this! Laugh. I like it, I think it’s funny.

M: Country hospitality, laugh!

P: Exactly. Good on them for being adaptive. I think it’s great. I think we should take note.

M: Absolutely, a handwritten note and in beautiful cursive writing. I was like wow.

P: There we go.

M: Nice, laugh.

P: But we know that church is good for us because Self-care is church for non-believers.

M: Absolutely. The rituals that church provides, absolutely.

P: Or did provide, yes.

M: Yeah. Or does for those who attend, Yep.

P: But we’re not talking about church this week, what are we talking about this week, Marie?

M: Rest! I’m tired, Pete!

P: Laugh.

M: Always tired.

P: Have a rest and a lie down.

M: Ah, that’s a really good point. A while ago, if people said they were tired, maybe, you know, have a cup of tea and then go to bed.

P: Absolutely.

M: So really, sleep is the way that we have always thought to solve that question of tiredness.

P: Mmm.

M: But today we’re going to talk about how sleep alone isn’t enough.

P: Oh!

M: And there’s so much more to rest than maybe we’ve been led to believe in the past. And we’re really taking a lot of the tips and hints and research in today’s episode from Dr. Saundra Dalton-Smith. She has just written a book called Sacred Rest: Recover Your Life, Renew Your Energy, Restore Your Sanity.

P:That’s a New Age slogan right there, laugh!

M: It sure is.

P: Now Marie, having known you for a little while, I reckon if I had read that out to you about three years ago, you would have scoffed and walked off.

M: Yeah. What a waste of money. Why would I buy that?

P: Laugh!

M: I’m gonna take my $10 and by a martini, thank you.

P & M: Laughter!

P: How we have changed, laugh!

M: Absolutely.

P: So, what does Dr. Saundra have to say about rest?

M: She says that there are seven types of rest and that really between all seven. If you take care of all seven types of rest, that impacts how you show up in the world. It impacts how you get out of bed.

P: Mmm.

M: It impacts your mood throughout the day. It impacts whether or not you drop after lunch.

P: Oh, so true!

M: It impacts whether you’re tired at night. You know, the first one to go home after a good night out with friends, it impacts your happiness levels as well.

P: Mmm.

M: So, in impacts how you show up each and every day.

P: Yeah, What I like about this approach as well is that she’s not just looking as sleep as being the only factor that’s at play here. There are so many factors that affect our sleep.

M: Yeah.

P: And what I think this this premise does is it addresses some of those lifestyle characteristics that contribute ultimately to our sleep. We know that a one-hour loss in sleep results in a 30% drop in immune function. That’s my little catchphrase from some of the stuff that I’ve read. What I like, about what Dr. Saundra is talking about is there’s always other elements in there which we can address as rest.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And changing our lifestyle habits, that really does have an impact on how we get to sleep in the positive.

M: It’s all interlinked, isn’t it?

P: Yeah, so much.

M: And so for me, with my medical history, I’ve had a long and bumpy ride with food allergies and food intolerances, and it is amazing to me how much my sleep quality is impacted by what I eat. Now that’s not everyone and that obviously we all have our own issues, and you know what you know, and you think it applies to other people.

P: Laugh.

M: When people have sleep issues, I’m like, Have you looked at your diet?

P & M: Laugh!

M: There are many reasons why we might not be getting a great night’s sleep. But for me back again and three years ago, I may not have been saying this either.

P: Laugh.

M: Mind and body are just so interlinked and everything is part of the same ecosystem. I’ve just written an article on my blog on gut health, actually, and how that your happiness.

P: Oh, yes. Yes.

M: So, I’ve got a great quote and then we’ll go into the seven types because I know everyone’s just wanting to know what seven types we’ve spoken about are.

P: Laugh.

M: So, a quote from Dr. Saundra, she says “Rest is not simply the cessation of activity, the core of rest has to be restorative.”

P: Oh.

M: And that really opens everything up to more than sleep, right?

P: Mmm, it does.

M: Which is exactly what we’ve been saying.

P: Yeah.

M: All right, so we’ll start with the first one physical rest.

P: Mmm, you need to take a break. This one applies to me actually.

M: This one is the one that we’re probably going to spend the least amount of time on is the most self-evident. There are two types of physical rest. One is passive, which is sleep.

P: Yep. Easy.

M: Right? Lay down, sleep, physical rest, tick.

P: Yep.

M: The other is an active physical rest, and this includes things like yoga or stretching or light walking. It’s just resetting your body. Gentle, rhythmic, you could probably put swimming in there maybe, gentle physical activity that is not exciting your system.

P: Mmm, downgrading.

M: Exactly, exactly.

P: She actually does list massage therapy in her Ted talk on this subject, So that’s a big tick for me! Laugh. Come get a massage, people!

M: I will do A massage over an hour of yoga any day.

P: Laugh. Ahh… good if we could get massages though… sigh.

M: Yeah. Laugh.

P: Laugh, Ok. Moving on the second type of rest is mental rest, and she talks about irritable and forgetful people, people who find it difficult concentrating at work. All these sorts of people just can’t seem to turn themselves off. What she says is, the good news is you don’t have to go on a vacation or quickly job to be able to do this. Scheduling short breaks into your day are vital. This I have to definitely put my hand up having been the person that you know works from eight o’clock in the morning, through to seven o’clock without a lunch break.

M: [Judgemental tone] Mmm hmm.

P: Laugh, this is me. Making sure that you’ve got some time where you stop and rejuvenate. Allow your energy levels to re-jig and to get some, some focus back to get some ingestion going on. Slow yourself down.

M: Slow your brain down.

P: It really helps. Yeah, it really helps.

M: Yeah, and this is also more difficult in today’s society because we are pulled in so many different directions. If you’re not sitting at a computer all day, you’ll definitely nowadays have a phone and we say we know we should turn off notifications, but so many of us don’t.

P: Yep.

M: And even when you do, you know that that little red dots sitting there after lunch.

P: Laugh!

M: You know it’s there, even though you haven’t heard a ping or buzz at you.

P: Yep, laugh.

M: So, it’s really also mental rest is about mindfulness and stopping and taking a big, deep breath. And just letting your mind wander for a bit, doing the dishes without any TV or music on and just focus on doing the dishes.

P: Mmm.

M: Or, you know, washing your hair.

P: Mmm.

M: There’s many activities during the day that we add unnecessary noise into. And our mind is just being bombarded with stuff and noise and sensory input.

P: Information overload.

M: Yeah, let your mind focus on one task or on no task.

P: This is where the cup of tea comes in really well. Having a cup of tea is the old English way of stopping.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: You stop for a cup of tea and you sit in the office, in your backyard, I sit on my balcony when the sun’s out and I have a cup of tea and it makes you stop, lovely.

M: So, this fits well into number three, which is sensory rest.

P: Mmm.

M: So, you’ve got mental rest, that’s really stopping your mind from having to think.

P: Yep.

M: But just as important. And this one really made me look at my habits.

P: Yeah.

M: I would finish a long day at work. So, I get up, I try and get some exercise in then do some writing or you know, editing the podcast or blog writing.

P: Mmm.

M: All of that kind of stuff and then I start a 10-hour workday.

P: Yeah, woah.

M: And so, at the end of the day, all I want to do is crash in front of the TV, and that doesn’t take into account the fact that you can overload on sensory input.

P: Yeah.

M: So, at the end of the day, what my brain needed was a book, or for me to have a shower and wash my hair or for me to do something that was really not going to continue to overload me from a sensory perspective.

P: Yeah, I was going to say that that sensory stimulation is coming in through your eyes, like that light pollution that we talked about before.

M: And it is. So, you sit yourself down in front of the TV and your brain is like, Oh, gosh more.

P: Again!

M: So, while you might be sort of zoning out in front of it, your brain is still processing all of those images and noises.

P: Yep.

M: Plus, you know, the dog wants to be let out for a walk and is scratching at the door, and your kids are not going to bed. And you know your husband’s asking when dinner will be ready.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: Like all of this stuff, the life stuff that adds to sensory input. And it’s really important to find some time away from all of that sensory input and get your sensory rest.

P: Yep, schedule it.

M: And then find the time. So, just to be clear, that’s no devices, no noise, no screens and no people, either. No demands on your mind.

P: Oh really? Oh.

M: This is really about shutting down, and meditation would be great, just going into the garden or just somewhere that you can really reduce your five senses.

P: Mmm.

M: Reduce the assault on those five senses and just take some quiet time. And it could be 20 minutes once a week if that’s all you can manage.

P: Yep.

M: It doesn’t have to be daily, but do you find time to, to shut down all that sensory input sometimes.

P: I like it.

M: Number four, Pete?

P: Number four, creative rest. Ah hah, creative rest is about happiness. It’s about having fun! It’s a little bit of activation, in a way. Creative rest is about taking inspiration, finding awe, so remembering the first time that you walked and saw a cliff face into the ocean. For me I’ve got images of Southern Italy with my niece and doing a trek and getting to this nunnery that looked out over this blue, blue ocean. That is creative rest.

M: Mmm.

P: That is inspiring awe and wonder and allowing yourself to take in some beauty and revel in that moment.

M: The easiest way to get this is to just get out into nature, isn’t it?

P: Yeah, she talks about that a lot, and she says that’s not the only way. But it’s the easiest, the easiest way because it makes you stop. It makes you breathe. It makes you pause because you’re in front of this incredible scenery.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And what Dr Saundra talks about as well is having that in your daily life as well. So, if you’re around on your desk having those images up and around you make a big impact. I was doing some work recently on all the supportive things that go towards making a therapeutic environment; and being a health care professional, I was sort of being informed about all these elements, and there’s a reason why you put images of greenery and rocks.

M: And Buddhism candles!

P: And Buddhism candles, laugh, in your space because that placebo effect is scientific. It has a scientific reaction on someone’s receptiveness to a treatment or therapy. So that’s another way of gaining some creative rest.

M: I remember the first apartment I ever had or rented, and I decided I was going to use red and black.

P: Laugh.

M: You know, it was cool, it was funky. I decorated with red and black, and it was aggressive.

P: Laugh!

M: I think it lasted about two days, and I was like, not happening, you know, coming back into that space.

P: Aaahhh!

M: Laugh, a murder scene had gone on in there, right.

P & M: Laugh!

M: It was just palpable the way it made you feel because it was so aggressive in its colour scheme.

P: Mmm.

M: I 100% agree with you, Pete.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s so important to get it right.

P: You know a really nice thing? Get a pot plant. Put a pot part in your workspace. It can be really small, a tiny little one, a little succulent that you don’t need to take too much care of pop it on your desk and have two and rotate them between the sun. Really good way to bring in some green.

M: I have a plant here with me in my study. And the only reason it’s here is because this is where I spend my days and otherwise the cats eat them.

P & M: Laughter!

M: So, it’s the only way I can have a plant, keeping it with me during the day so I can keep an eye on it. Laugh!

P: So the cats don’t eat it! Laugh.

M: And then at night, I close the door to my study and the plants get closed in there too.

P: Laugh. Funny.

M: So recently, as part of my certificate in happiness studies, we did a week studying meditation, and one of the –

P: Ha, ha, ha.

M: – Yes, I know you’re laughing at me because I’m still a cynic when it comes to meditation, it’s just not my jam.

P: Laugh.

M: But one of the ways you can meditate. And this is actually something that does come from studying this stuff is actually getting a deeper understanding of all the different types of meditation, and one of them is music meditation.

P: Yep.

M: And so, to this creative rest category here. A great way to get rest, creative rest, is to put on a track of music and close your eyes, sit down and really listen to it in a deep and meaningful way that you haven’t before.

P: Yep, really engage with it.

M: Yep, and that’s just a three minute exercise. And it’s part meditation, so you’re getting a bit of mental rest in there, but you’re also getting a bit of creative rest. And it’s amazing when you do it, how much you can reinterpret a song or a piece of music that you’ve known your whole life and hear new things that you’ve never noticed before.

P: Music without lyrics actually works really well for that, because it is that depriving of the senses. So going in like a violin piece or a piano piece.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: It’s really easy to engage, and it’s a type of meditation. We talked about this in a meditation episode, right in the very beginning I think it was, Marie.

M: I wasn’t listening back then.

P: Laughter!

M: That was your show, laugh.

P: Delete, laugh. Anyway.

M: I did it cause Pete wanted to do an episode on meditation and I was like ‘why?’

P: Laugh!

M: And I have to say for everyone out there listening, meditation has so much research, so much research into the benefits for you, particularly in today’s day and age, which is, you know, as we just said, such a sensory overload kind of world. So, it is not that I am arguing against the validity of it as a way to increase your health and wellness. What I’m saying is, it just doesn’t work for me. I haven’t really found my type of meditation.

P: You’ll get there, oh budding grasshopper.

M: Laugh.

P: Emotional rest.

M: Yes, number five, emotional rest. Find a good friend. Well, you know, a therapist.

P: Laugh.

M: Find a good friend or therapist, be authentic and vulnerable with and let your guard down.

P: Mmm.

M: And really, there’s still so much more research. I was just reading another piece of research that was in an article today on psychology today again saying that close relationships are so important and there’s so many reasons why and this is one of them.

P: Mmm.

M: Emotional rest, if you are constantly wearing a mask, you cannot let go or be the true you.

P: No authenticity.

M: Yeah, and sometimes it’s dangerous for you to be the real you. The environment you’re in would not allow that.

P: Yep.

M: Other times it’s emotional or mental barriers and scarring from, you know, growing up. There’s a lot that can play into this. So, we’re not saying that you have to all of a sudden come out or be authentic, but it’s worth understanding that that lack of authenticity in your life has a huge impact on your mental well-being.

P: Mmm.

M: We did also do an episode on this before, Pete.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: And really, if you can keep searching for your tribe, the people that you can find who you can be authentic around.

P: Mmm.

M: People like Pete.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Who love you for who you are.

P: Aww, stop it I’m going to cry.

M: Aww.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Then that provides so much emotional support and so many benefits outside of rest, which is what we’re talking about now. But so many benefits in so many different ways.

P: Yep, definitely.

M: So keep searching for your tribe if you haven’t yet found those people and make sure you spend the time because it takes a good 2 to 3 years to make that deep friendship and time and effort over time to do that.

P: Yep, mmm.

M: So don’t give up too early on people either. But keep looking, because the benefits when you find your tribe are amazing.

M: Number six-

P: Last one.

M: – is social rest.

P: Oh, missed that one.

M: And this one is big for me.

P: Mmm.

M: So if you’re an introvert. Social rest is so important and you’ll crave it and fight for it and hopefully protect it as much as you can, fight for it. And this is really about getting away from negative people and spending time with people who renew your energy rather than take it. And in a work environment, when things are stressful, a lot of the time we can spend 40 hours a week or more around people that we’d rather not prefer to spend time with, and oftentimes around people who are negative.

P: Yeah, it’s a hard one, but it’s really important.

M: All right. Now you can take us to the end.

P: Now I can do the last one.

M: Number seven.

P: I can drive it through the end, I’m the finisher. Spiritual rest, the ability to connect beyond physical and mental and feel a deep sense of belonging, love, acceptance and purpose. It just rounds it out so beautifully.

M: [vomit noise]

P: Laugh! Marie just threw up a little bit in her mouth.

M: Laugh, eeuggh.

P: It’s about finding something bigger than you, and we talked about this again about in terms of awe and inspiration. It’s finding a process of connecting with something that’s beyond. That takes your focus out of your issues, your life, Mrs. Blogs down the road who keeps throwing her rubbish in your flower bed or whatever, and looking for some awe and inspiration on a different level perhaps.

M: Is that happening to you? Someone throwing their garbage in your flower bed? Laugh.

P: No, I was actually thinking about my mother, laugh.

M: Is she throwing rubbish in someone’s flower bed?

P: No, someone’s been throwing rubbish in hers.

M: Oh dear!

P: And apparently some in the rose bushes. Apparently or alleged, laugh.

M: Geez, and she’s out in the country!

P: Yeah, she’s not far from you.

M & P: Laugh.

P: Anyway.

M: So spiritual rest, I think for me I get from helping others.

P: Mmm, interesting.

M: That, for me is a really easy one to tick off. I get that good, warm and fuzzy feeling, when I go donate blood. Or if I coach volleyball or you know there’s a whole range of things for me that make me feel I’m giving back to society and people around me and to my community, and that’s really important to me.

P: Mmm.

M: And again, it doesn’t have to be religious. A lot of people jump straight to religion, and that’s what turns them off, exploring this element of rest.

P: Mmm.

M: So, there are other ways that you can feel connected to community or to nature or the world around you. It’s just about finding what works for you.

P: Oh, lovely. So, it’s not all about sleep? Laugh!

M: No. So, physical, mental, sensory, creative, emotional, social and spiritual. And we’ll finish up by letting you know that Dr Dalton-Smith Saundra Dalton-Smith has a free rest quiz on her website that you can complete.

P: Ooh, homework! Yay.

M: Laugh.

P: Audience participation, yippee!

M: And if you do the quiz, you can get a bunch of feedback into areas that you might be able to improve on. So, her website is Dr Dalton-Smith, d r d a l t o n s m I t h . com. Really simple. I think I’ve got some rest I need to maybe address in my hectic life at the moment.

P: Laugh, we could probably all do that. So, get some rest people.

M: And stay happy. We’ll see you in a week.

P: Bye.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Emotional Reframing and Happiness (E81)

23/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about emotional reframing and happiness– it’s not about what happens, but how you frame it.

Show notes

Cognitive Reframing

Link to article on cognitive reframing

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: And we’re back again.

P: Howdy, howdy, howdy.

M: Hi, hi, hi.

P & M: Laugh.

P: I’m trying to be really nice and open because it’s a miserable day here in Sydney. Laugh.

M: I think it’s miserable everywhere in Australia.

P: It’s so cold! Eh, true.

M: Yeah.

P: Even if it was sunny.

M: Yeah, pretty much… Well, no… Look, Brisbane might get out of lockdown today.

P: Yay!

M: Possibility?

P: Laugh.

M: Everyone else is going into lockdown. So, you know, poor Melbourne back again. More areas of Sydney, Newcastle, Armidale.

P: Mmm.

M: Yeah. So, this is actually a really good time for us to be talking about emotional framing and reframing.

P: Ooh, reframing. Let me get out my chemistry set, laugh.

M: I kind of go more towards like the pretty pictures on my wall. Do I want a white frame or a black frame?

P: Laughter! Whichever analogy works for you folks.

M: Laugh.

P: This is exactly what we’re talking about reframing. Looking at things from the other point of view, laugh.

M: Exactly. So, I think what we’ve just proved Pete is exactly what this conversation is about.

P: Laugh.

M: Which is that the same event, can be perceived differently by two different people. So, the difference is due to internal factors, and it really comes down to the fact that we’re all unique. We’re all individuals, and we all bring with us a whole lot of emotional baggage, which shapes who we are in both positives and negatives.

P: What are you talking about? I’m not emotional at all!

M: Laugh.

P: She says, casting a thing [rucksack] over a shoulder.

M & P: Laugh.

M: Yes, so we all come with our life experiences and that shapes how we see everyday events and how we live our lives.

P: Very much,

M: So, we all subjectively evaluate our experiences, and we can, unfortunately, shade experiences with negative emotions because we’re seeing things through a negative lens when they’re not actually negative.

P: So true, and it’s interesting that that’s the first place that I went to when you spoke about this reframing. I went, ‘Oh, it’s about the negative, half cup full [empty]’ kind of thing. Let’s flip that on his head, but it goes a little bit deeper than that, Muz. You sort of mentioned that this is not just about being negative and positive.

M: Yes, and look, we’ve had an episode on positive affirmations before, which really kind of rubbed the cynic in me.

P: Laugh!

M: I just felt uncomfortable the whole episode.

P & M: Laugh!

M: And cognitive reframing or emotional reframing also is that borderline. But I think everyone out there knows someone who is just negative, so negative.

P: Mmm, mmm, mmm.

M: And my heart goes out to them in theory in the safety of this conversation, because there has obviously been something that has made them feel that they need to respond that negatively to everything that happens.

P: Yes.

M: And that thing can’t be a good thing.

P: No.

M: Right?

P: Definitely.

M: But gosh, their hard work those people in practise.

P & M: Laughter.

P: They’re energy suckers. If we put it into an energetic context, they are the people that just drain you physically and emotionally, and you come out after 15 minutes with them like Oh my God, I need a martini!

M: Uh huh.

P: Laugh.

M: And you feel like crap sometimes too!

P: You do! People who are aware of this energetic transference call it energy suckers. And it’s this whole thing of pulling from your belly button and they just drain everything from the bottom of your reservoir. Laugh.

M: Absolutely. Yeah. So, for those people, welcome to the show.

P & M: Laughter!

M: Good for you.

P: Can you identify yourself as an energy drainer?

M: Laugh.

P: I don’t think anybody would.

M & P: Laugh.

P: I’m one of those people, I suck… [internet issues]

M: Laugh, you suck.

P: Oh, this is hard. Laugh!

M: Um, I will apologise for everyone. I think we’re doing OK at the moment, but we are having Internet and bandwidth issues in lockdown. So, there might be some conversations that end with Pete saying, “I suck.”

P: Laugh!

M: You know.

P: This could be fun.

M & P: Laugh.

M: All right. So, cognitive reframing it is transforming specific negative events into more positive ones.

P: Mmm.

M: Which sounds like throwing out a memory and recreating it. And it is not that at all. It is not about distorting reality. It is about understanding the bias that we apply to reality and looking through different lenses.

P: Dare I say it? That’s again, the hard work. You can’t just paste something on top of it and go, ‘Oh, I’m just going to change this from an orange lens to a green lens.’ Doesn’t work that way, unfortunately. You’ve actually got to dive a little deeper into that and actually do the work of understanding. And that can be confronting because that brings into play your biases, your prejudices, all those conditional elements that can go right back to your childhood.

M: Oh, absolutely. And that oftentimes are formed in your childhood in your early formative years.

P: Yep.

M: You know, when Sallie Mae dumped you in front of the football team.

P: Laugh!

M: That sticks with you, that hurt. It’s embarrassing. And it’s part of how you’ll relate to other women moving forward.

P: Mmm.

M: Things like that, for instance.

P: Yeah, definitely.

M: I don’t know why I went there specifically.

P: Sally Mae, what a mole.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Mole.

P: Laugh.

M: Alright, so from Sallie Mae, we’re going to jump to Lester Levenson. I’m going to tell a little story. There was a gentleman called Lester Levenson, and at the age of 42 he found himself in hospital following his second heart attack.

P: Oof.

M: And the doctors pretty much said, ‘you might have a couple of weeks to live.’ And with no, no additional hope to give him.

P: Mmm.

M: He had major liver problems, ulcers and was also depressed, so he was sent home for bed rest and pretty much told to prepare for the end.

P: Okay, all right, yep.

M: And so, he got home and you know, he was obviously very depressed and contemplating suicide, and that, that really is a shock to the system. That type of thing, right?

P: Mmm.

M: So, he was contemplating life and death and realised that he had so much knowledge that he gained over his 42 years of life. He had been a successful person in life, but he had no knowledge about how to live a good life. And what living a good life meant.

P: Ah. He was following the formula.

M: He had this realisation that, Yep.

P: Laugh.

M: He’d gone to work. He was a typical, I think 1950s or 60s man who had the promising career and a lot of stress and none of the tools at that stage to discuss emotions as many men in that generation, also had.

P: Mmm, very much.

M: And so, in that moment, he decided to dedicate what little of his remaining life he could to understanding what life is actually all about and how he could find happiness.

P: He gave it two weeks?

M: Exactly. And, you know, if it was only going to be two weeks, it was only going to be two weeks.

P: Oh.

M: But, you know, it lit a fire. That death sentence lit a fire in him.

P: Mmm.

M: And he decided he needed to know what lead to happiness and a good life.

P: Mmm.

M: So through – Here’s the good part story.

P: I was about to say we’re going down a really negative path here. Let’s bring some light and colour back in. Laugh!

M: Through years and years of research, and he found that the path to a good life is internal, not external.

P: Mmm.

M: And he started by looking at what made him happy. And he realised that through his very successful life that success has only led to temporary happiness. He thought about being loved as happiness, and we’ve spoken a lot about social bonds and relationships.

P: Yeah, mmm.

M: But he was loved by his friends and family, but he was still unhappy.

P: Mmm.

M: Still depressed. He thought about the joy of camping with his friends and the joy of being with his ex, and he found the unifying theory. So, it’s not being loved. He thought

‘Happiness is when I am loving.’

P: When you’re giving love.

M: And so, he resolved to be loving towards everybody.

P: Fabulous.

M: So, he directed his love towards the doctor that had told him he only had two weeks to live, and he sought to turn the anger that he felt towards that Doctor into love.

P: Interesting.

M: And once he realised that it was about him and not the doctor, he felt that weight lift off his chest.

P: Mmm.

M: And he continued to release the anger, moving slowly to resentment and then finally moving to love and realising that that doctor was trying to do his job and deliver news that he didn’t want to deliver either, that he felt helpless delivering that news.

P: Yeah.

M: And so, this really triggered a cascade of, uh, you know, cognitive reframing within him, which wasn’t a term at that stage.

P: Laugh.

M: And through the rest of his life, he kept asking again, ‘Can I replace this painful emotion with love?’ So, he started looking back through his entire life, and sometimes it took minutes, sometimes it took days to release those negative feelings.

P: Mmm hmm, yeah.

M: He went through his whole memory and transformed his anger to love for all people. And then once he practised that and spent all this time doing that, he’s developed the ability just like training a muscle to do it in the moment.

P: Uh, yeah, that’s a gift. That’s such a gift. And there are people like that who are out there who have this innate ability to look at a situation and go hang on pause. Take the emotion out of it. Let’s look at that a bit more objectively and they turn the situation around. They turn the emotion around and they stop their emotions from ruling their consciousness. And I think that’s the crux of what we’re talking about here. It’s like, Let’s just pause. Let’s not react. Let’s address.

M: Yep, absolutely. So in a way, he healed his heart.

P: Mmm.

M: That broken heart.

P: Laugh. Yeah, though it’s interesting, Marie, because you’re saying he had a two week sentence. And yet now you’re talking about the rest of his life. I mean, how much longer did he live for?

M: So, he did heal his heart and as he let go of that negativity and that anger and resentment and other people and all the things that they had wronged him with. And the things they did wrong at work and the bus driver who was late and all of that. He eventually became a spiritual teacher on all of this, and he died in his eighties.

P: No way.

M: So, almost twice as long as he had previously lived.

P: That’s great.

M: So, he was 42 when the doctor gave him a few weeks to live.

P: Goodness.

M: And we’ve spoken before about happiness, and one of the biggest blockers or stoppers of happiness is negativity and negative events.

P: Oh yeah, oh yeah.

M: And negative affect and if you’re in that spiral and circle of negativity, it’s really hard to be happy. And so, what Lester Levenson did was create a whole movement and books and followers and really kick-started cognitive reframing.

P: Yeah, wow.

M: And he did that by asking himself. So, his technique about reframing is,

‘Can I change this negative feeling into a positive one?’

‘Can I change this feeling of X into a feeling of Y?’

P: Yeah.

M: When he looked at his doctor? ‘Can I change this feeling of anger towards the doctor who gave me information that was bad –

P: Negative and horrible.

M: – to a feeling of love?’ And eventually, when the bus driver was late, he didn’t take that personally.

P: Laugh.

M: He didn’t even get upset about it because he had refrained how he looked at life.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: By doing this activity deliberately over time repeatedly.

P: There’s a really contemporary aspect of this argument who hasn’t got mad at the call centre person.

M: Oh, yes.

P: So you ring up the call centre and you’re so frustrated and I think a really practical example of this is when you’re in that moment, ‘I just want to yell at you!’

M: Laugh, mmm hmm.

P: You have to take it back and go, ‘It’s not this person’s fault.’ This is a person on the other end of the line. So, I think that is an opportunity to exercise this cognitive reframing and go ‘ah, it’s the situation that I’m angry at and frustrated by.’ I need to dial it back, bring the emotion out of it and address how I’m going to overcome the situation rather than trying to make this person on the other end of the line who I don’t even know work with me as opposed to against me. And I think that’s a really practical application of this entire concept.

M: And to take that even further, why are you angry in the first place?

P: Ah, yeah. Well, that’s more of an existential question, isn’t it?

M: Well, not really because if… Do we expect people to be perfect?

P: Mmm, yeah…

M: Do you think that the banker or the bank that you work with or the telco or the power company deliberately cut power to your house this Saturday afternoon.

P: Laugh.

M: Or decided that their technology wasn’t going to work when you needed to make your transaction.

P: Yep sure.

M: There’s actually nothing deliberate and malicious about a lot of the things that make us angry when we call into a call centre.

P & M: Laugh.

P: Yeah.

M: And it’s not about you at all. And some poor person who caused the problem is having a far worse day than you are I’m sure.

P: Laugh!

M: But reframing that into – again what we spoke about a few weeks ago with layers of control, control versus and influence.

P: Yeah.

M: When we talk about that, just letting go of the anger and knowing that there’s nothing you can do about it, especially not at the time.

P: Mmm hmm. Yep.

M: And that it’s not within your control to do anything to fix a lot of these things and that it wasn’t personal at all, that that can be really empowering. So, you don’t have to yell at the person.

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: You don’t even have to try and control that emotion because it’s not there.

P & M: Laugh!

M: I’ve got a quote here from Lester Levenson, I do love that name.

P: Laugh.

M: It’s just old-school.

P: It is.

M: Especially with the black and white pic.

P: Yeah, definitely. It’s this sort of, you know, Clark Gable-esque kind of vibe.

M: Mmm hmm.

M: So he said, Lester said:

P: It’s very Buddhist Marie. It’s a very Buddhist concept as well. The Dalai Lama talks a lot about this in terms of forgiveness and how to approach conflict with a forgiving heart. And, you know, he talks about it a lot in his dealings with the Chinese leadership over Tibet and being able to stand opposite someone and still come at the situation with a forgiving heart. It’s, it’s a huge lesson to learn.

M: And it’s more than anything, when I started looking into forgiveness and it’s one of the chapters in our book, actually, just checking that in there.

P: Laugh!

M: When we started researching forgiveness, one of the things that I’d never stopped to think about was that forgiveness is not about the other person. It’s not about the person who harmed you or hurt you.

P: No, no.

M: Or whatever it is that they did. It’s about you, releasing that pain and that anger.

P: Absolutely.

M: Yep.

P: I’ve got a great quote from the Dalai Lama on that, and he says, he’s talking about forgiveness, and he says,

“We won’t often get the closure from another that we desire. This means that we must discover it on our own. Forgiveness is how we find peace, no matter if they want to give it to us or not.”

M: I love it.

P: Mmm.

M: It’s about taking back control and not letting that other person dictate your emotions.

P: Completely.

M: But you saying, ‘no, enough is enough. I’m going to be at peace with this and I’m going to move on and not let it be part of my emotional baggage that shapes and taints the way I view the world.’

P: There’s a lot of talk about surrendering and releasing that with behavioural therapists. They talk about standing in the midst of the storm and surrendering to it. Yeah you’re going to get buffeted around you’re going to get blown off your feet. You’re going to get picked up like Dorothy in the vortex of atmospheric pressure.

M: Laugh.

P: Out of Kansas, and dumped down in the land of Oz. Laugh. But if you go, if you don’t fight against it, sometimes it’s best to surrender to it and in that becomes a certain amount of peace and understanding. And with that and then out of that comes opportunity.

M: Absolutely.

P: That’s another conversation, laugh.

M: I guess. Look, we haven’t gone into the how and all of the workings, but there’s a great article which deep dives into this, which we will put into our show notes. So, the article is called cognitive reframing. It’s not about what happens to you, but how you frame it.

P: Mmm.

M: And really, how you frame your life has such an impact on your life.

P: Yes, definitely.

M: Walking around with rose coloured glasses. Even if the world is not rosy right now, it can definitely help with resilience and mental well-being.

P: Yep, hugely.

M: Or even if you’re just kind of in neutral, better than negative.

P & M: Laugh.

M: Because there is a lot going on right now and a lot of people are struggling with their mental health. So, it is really important right now for us to just be a bit more aware, more cognizant of our emotions and of things like this, so that we can potentially make things a little bit better and nicer and shiny.

P: And as the story of Lester Levenson proves:

Unhappy people die!

M & P: Laughter!

P: Our little mantra, laugh.

M: Our mantra? Unhappy people die? Oh dear, laugh.

P: Get happy people!

M: Laugh. I think we need a tag line, Unhappy people die on Happiness for Cynics.

P: Laugh.

M & P: And on that note – Laughter!

P: Have a happy day!

M: I can’t even say it, bye folks.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

Please note that I get a small commission if you buy something from my site. Your support helps to keep this site going at no additional cost to you. Thanks!

Happiness Literacy (E80)

16/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics

This week, Marie and Pete talk about your level of Happiness Literacy – how aware of your own happiness are you?

Transcript

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: So, we’re back Pete!

P: [Singing] Hi.

M: [Singing] Hi.

P: Laugh.

M: So, I have a question for you, as we are into week three of lockdown, which will tell you how long ago we recorded this.

P: Laugh.

M: ‘Cause who knows when we’ll be up to when we actually play this.

P: Is it week three? I think it’s four.

M: Week four. Then my question is, Are you okay?

…

P: NOOOOO!!

M & P: Laugh!

P: I’M STRUGGLING! [Nervous laughter]

M: And I want to say that I am, too, and I’m not in lockdown. We talk about Sydney and Melbourne being in lockdown.

P: Yep.

M: And we’ve been very, very, very blessed in Australia that this is our second a few weeks of lockdown in Sydney.

P: Mmm, gosh yes.

M: And I’m actually up in Tamworth. But I think it’s worth acknowledging that we’ve all had our moments of… I’m going to call it instability.

P: Mmm.

M: I’m going to go there, laugh. Moments of irrationality.

P: Laughter! Moments of hurting?

M: Moments of feeling like crap.

P: Laugh.

M: Low resilience.

P: Laugh.

M: Manic.

P: Laugh.

M: Swings of emotion.

P: Laughter.

M: And that is okay. I think one of, I have no idea who said it. But one of my favourite quotes or mantras I have is that ‘No emotion is bad, only behaviours are bad.’

P: Oooh, I like that. Yeah, I like that a lot, I think that’s great.

M: Yeah, absolutely. And I think we talk so much about positivity and happiness on this podcast that when we were catching up before we got onto this recording, we both decided that we needed to be a bit vulnerable and share with the listeners that it’s not all about being happy all the time.

P: Mmm.

M: Sustainable happiness, which is what we strive for here, still has moments of low resilience and sadness and anger and fear and all those emotions which are neither positive nor negative. They’re just emotions, and that we feel low and sad and angry and all those things at various times, and that’s part of your spectrum of emotions of healthy emotions, even if you’re aiming for sustainable happiness. And you’ve got a great example of where it caught you off guard Pete, don’t you?

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: Will you share.

P: I’ve actually got two, I’ve got two. Yeah, Petey had a little, I call it my man period, laugh.

M: Don’t go there, you’re about to piss off a whole lot of people.

P: Laugh, I know. I believe you sisters, I’m with you.

M: Laugh!

P: I will survive.

M: Still don’t go there. You’re still digging, Pete. You’re still digging.

P & M: Laugh!

P: Yeah, I had a low week a couple of weeks ago, and I was catastrophizing a lot. I’d like to classify myself as a creative person, and the bad side of that is that you can get quite creative with your negative emotions and your negative projections, And I was getting really into them.

M: You can indulge them and feed them.

P: Oh, yeah, yeah.

M: And they don’t need indulging or feeding.

P: There’s a reason why Salvador Dali cut his ear off.

M: [Nervous laugh]

P: I’m there, I get it. Laugh.

So my first moment was I was just feeling really low, and I caught up with a friend because I thought, ‘no, no, no. It’s good to go out and see friends and do things.’ So we went for a lovely workout in one of the outdoor parks here in Sydney, and it was a beautiful, sunny day, it was lovely. And we were walking away from the exercise area because in Sydney we’re only allowed to exercise and then we have to go home. We were going for a quick coffee and my friend turned and said to me, Pete, are you okay?

P: I’m like, ‘I’m fine.’

M: [Fake laugh]

P: And he touched me, which was very non-covid because we were trying to be really covid aware. Um and he just put his hand on my forearm, and I went “I’M NOT OK!”

M & P: Laugh!!

M: Sorry, I laugh now only because you’re dramatizing it, not because my heart doesn’t go out to you.

P: Laugh! So, we sat down in the gutter. We were literally in front of some random garden. I’m like, “Can we have a seat?” And so, we sat down in the gutter and all it took was a good 15 minutes of my friend saying, “Okay, talk. Spill it.” And I spilled and I let it all out, and I had a little cry and expressed my emotions and so forth. And God, I felt better.

M: Oh, it’s so cathartic. And you kind of come out the other side going now I feel so much better that I’m a bit embarrassed that I went there.

P: Exactly, you do!

M: Laugh.

P: You get that swing back of like, I really shouldn’t have [been], you know holding it in.

M: Laugh, that was a bit OTT (Over The Top) wasn’t it!

P & M: Laugh!

P: [Singing] Drama queen!

M: Laugh. Oh, but that breakdown in that moment, and particularly if you’ve got someone there who can listen and just let you get it out. No matter how insane it might sound at times or whatever. Or is not, right? It is all valid emotion.

P: Oh, absolutely. It’s so valid and it’s validating to actually go, ‘yeah, I’m feeling low.’

M: Mmm hmm.

P: So, if you are feeling low at this moment, for whatever reason, for those people who are, you know, going we’re all going through this whole covid nightmare. Put yourself in the path of being able to open up, and that means just go to an exercise area if that’s all you can do and hang out with a friend and put yourself in that path of intervention. And when it comes up, go there, dive deep, open up, unzip the heart of your thoracic cage and let it all come out!

M: Laugh! I was with you until the unzipping of the thoracic cage. I thought it was a Superman [reference].

P: Laugh.

M: People at home you can’t see that we’re on video.

P: Laugh.

M: Pete was opening the suit, the Clark Kent suit and Superman was flying out it felt like.

P: Yep, laugh! It’s more about being exposed and being vulnerable. It’s more about the image of unzipping the body down to the heart and having that beating pulsating organ and Cain saying, ‘Come at me world, take your best stab at me.’

M: And that organ we’re talking about is his heart.

P: Yeah, we’re not going there.

M & P: Laugh!

M: Just to make sure we’re all on the same page here. Laugh.

P: Yes, there we go. So, what was your vulnerable moment, Marie?

M: Look, So I wanted to do a… So, it’s tough when you’re in a different town and you haven’t found your tribe or your people yet. And that can be, I think, even more isolating than being stuck surrounded by your tribe but not able to see them because you’re in lockdown.

P: Yep.

M: So that’s difficult at times. But my, my breakdown, my tanty moment –

P: Laugh.

M: – came when, I gave myself a Bunning’s project. I was building a shelf above my treadmill so that I can do some walking meetings here.

P: Ooh, yeah.

M: And my wonderful husband was trying to help –

P: Laugh! Whoops!

M: – and because it was my project, I had a tanty and I was trying to build this lovely, beautiful, you know, and he’s very practical and pragmatic. He was nailing things in the front side –

P: Laugh!

M: – and it was ugly. I had a bit of a strop. So, that was my emotional outburst.

P: Laugh.

M: Bless him, he puts up with a lot my husband.

P: It’s the role you do, with your intimate people, you do. You put up with things, but you’re also there when it’s necessary.

M: Yeah, and I think again there are no incorrect or wrong emotions or bad emotions, only bad behaviours. So, you know, I think if you behave badly, it’s about apologising and acknowledging that everyone is human.

P: Yes.

M: And actually, today we’re here to talk about happiness literacy.

P: Ooh, we are.

M: And this leads right in. And we wanted to start today’s episode by acknowledging that a lot of people are going through tough times. A lot of people have been going consistently through tough times since March of last year around the world, and we have, I think we’ve seeing today about 50% of our audience is in the States.

P: Shout out to The States.

M: Yeah, and a lot of people in the UK, Germany and a few weeks ago were trending in Ireland as well. So, hi to everyone. Thank you for listening.

P: Laugh, it’s really nice that we have an international cohort. I feel a bit special about that.

M: Laugh.

P: It’s like ‘Oh wow!’ Laugh.

M: We want to acknowledge that what we’re experiencing here in Australia pales in comparison to what a lot of our listeners have been going through, and that doesn’t make anything less valid. But we talk about happiness, and today we’re going to talk about happiness literacy. And really for me, happiness literacy is about being able to put the words around what you’re feeling and understand what you need to do and how to action your emotions and to proactively take care of your well-being, your mental well-being.

P: Mmm. To me, it goes right along those lines of financial literacy, health literacy, understanding the system and being able to use it. And if we talk about happiness in terms of a system, there are lots of options out there for us to access happiness. If you know how to work it.

M: Yep, or if you’ve got the base knowledge, you’ve got to have a base level of knowledge.

P: Definitely.

M: And unfortunately, we’ve spoken about this before, you don’t get that base level of knowledge from school, generally. Nowadays, there’s a little bit more education on what makes us mentally healthy.

P: Yep.

M: But mental health is still stigmatised in many parts of the world and is still associated with a lot of shame a lot of the time for many people. So, we’re on a learning curve here and many people who aren’t in school right now and who are grown, grown ass adults like us.

P: Laugh.

M: don’t have base levels of happiness literacy the way that we might have financial literacy or health literacy.

P: Mmm. Yeah, no I agree. Yeah, and they’re very much linked. So, I’ll reference a study here that I came across by Erik Angner at the University of Alabama in Birmingham, along with Miller, Ray, Saag and Allison, who asked 383 people who were aged 50 and older if they can read and answer questions on medical forms without assistance.

He then asked them to rate their level of happiness. And the findings in the research study indicated that personal control impacts on your ability to be more happy. Ergo, feeling in control – which can be undermined by poor health literacy or knowing about how to fill out a form, have access to the tasks – links to higher happiness scorers.

M: Could being more educated, link to higher happiness?

P: Yep, it could, because you have more control.

M: It’s a bit of a leap but I think it’s a fairly –

P: The leap is proven because you have a level of control.

M: Well, we haven’t proven education. Well, anyway, sidebar. I’m not getting into semantics.

P: Laugh!

M: Yeah. So really what we’re saying here is educate yourself and you will, by default, open yourself up to more happiness.

P: Yes, I agree to quote another study, Dan Buettner from the National Geographic, he’s a National Geographic Fellow, has written a book on the lessons from the world’s happiest people. And one of his main points is that literacy means you grow up making informed decisions. So, whether it’s financial, whether it’s health, whether it’s happiness, if you’re literate about happiness and the study of happiness and the study of mental health, you’re going to make better decisions about it, he cites –

M: So listen to our podcast, people!

P & M: Laughter!

P: Ooh nice! Now available on itunes.

M & P: Laugh!

M: Sorry… back to what you were saying Pete.

P: Oh no. You totally interrupted my flow! Laugh.

M: This add was proudly brought to you by Marie and her Martini.

P: Laugh! Out of a jam jar.

M: Laugh, yes. This is the definition of sadness people.

P: Laugh.

M: Marie drinking a martini out of a jam jar.

P: Laugh.

M: We’re in Tamworth where we don’t have all of our kitchen items.

P: It shows that you can still have access to your things just by being creative.

M: Laugh. Jam jar it is.

P: Finding a solution, there we go.

M: Minimalism.

P: Okay, so we’re talking about literacy making meaning that you make informed decisions.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And he cites this in terms of reference to female education. So, in areas such as Denmark and Costa Rica, which are incidentally some of the happiest countries in the world, he cites that female education is a top indicator for informed decisions. Ergo, happiness. Denmark and Costa Rica were the first to educate the daughters of lower socioeconomic farmers who passed on education to their children, and this led to a re-investment in health literacy. So, these girls grew up knowing about what to access and how to access knowledge, and that gave them a sense of control.

M: I think the other thing to bring into that research is that Denmark, along with a lot of other very happy countries like Finland, which always tops or for the last four years, has topped the world happiness report, have high levels of equality and so educating women.

P: Mmm.

M: And getting started on that earlier and giving them right to vote and all the rest of it leads to higher levels of equality rather than inequality which has been shown to lead to less happiness. So, in countries like America, there are real problems at the moment due to inequality, the top 1% owning far more than the next 80% or something along those lines.

P: Mmm.

M: The inequality in their society is staggering compared to a lot of countries like Australia, New Zealand and European, Western European countries.

P: I’d even, I’d even go further there Marie because Australia is actually number five on the list of wealth inequality, and we pale in comparison to some of the other countries, such as Sweden and Japan, that actually –

M: We do, however, we’ve got a strong social network, which means that our bottom poorest are still not as poor as those in America for instance. So again… like and Asia and many countries, not all of Asia but many countries. So, inequality is also a really good indicator of overall country happiness.

P: Mmm, mmm.

M: Well, which is made up of individuals. But also, I would argue that New Zealand and a lot of the Nordic countries have higher representation of women in their politics in their representative roles. Yeah, so again, back to women being more educated and the early you get started on educating women in your society, the sooner they get up into those representative roles.

P: Well, Buettner talks about that in terms of education, generally. Getting access to education.

M: Power to the women!

P: Laugh.

M: One day we’ll rule the world, Pete.

P: Laugh. Am I included in that? Do I flip my wig now?

M: Oh, no, I’m not going to go there. I’m not going to bash the men.

P: Ok.

M: Love. Love, everyone.

P: Laugh. So if we take happiness literacy along with the lines of emotional literacy. So, we’ve talked about emotional literacy and having your emotional toolkit understanding emotional first aid. That was one of our episodes that we’ve talked about previously. If you want to have a look looking up.

Emotional First Aid (E65)

P: Christine Carter, who is from the Greater Good Magazine in America.

M: Oh, they’re great, Berkely. Really good resources there.

P: Yeah, yeah, yeah. She talks about teaching happiness and happiness as a skill that can be taught to kids. And so, getting into this education aspect of getting children understanding what it means to be happy. Positive emotions of presents, ice cream, partying, playing are all fabulous but also drawing pleasure in those moments of the past, such as gratitude, appreciation and also projecting these as well in the future as in terms of optimism, confidence, even faith, which I thought was an interesting one.

M: And I’m going to side car there, talking about understanding positive emotions in the future and say that one of the reasons why people are struggling with lockdowns around the world is that we’ve had all of our hope and planning and things that we’re looking forward to ripped away from us.

P: Yes.

M: I think in the last week alone, I’ve had to theatre ticket refunds and a wineries trip cancelled, right?

P: Yep.

M: And so, we’ve got nothing to look forward to at the moment.

P: Yeah, mmm.

M: Now, that doesn’t mean that you can’t plan for some great activities in lockdown. And actually, if you are struggling in lockdown at the moment, then my happiness literacy tip for you.

P: Laugh.

M: You need to plan something that you know you will be able to do, whether or not you come out of lockdown.

P: Yeah.

M: Plan a little mini tea party in your lounge room with your flatmate. Or plan a WebEx dress up party with a few friends.

P: Yep.

M: Or do something that you can do and plan it and enjoy the planning process. Cook a three-course dinner for you.

P: Mmm. Yeah.

M: Whatever it is that you can get excited behind, do a movie marathon that you’re going to do in your pyjamas all day Saturday with ice cream and chocolate, whatever it is, because we need to be kind to ourselves and not judge about all that chocolate and ice cream.

P: Laugh! …champagne.

M: Laugh, but plan is the key here, and that is one of the big reasons why we’re struggling right now. There are many.

P: Mmm.

M: Don’t get me wrong. There’s financial insecurity for a lot of people as well, layered on top of the social isolation, which is really harmful to people’s mental health. But also having something to plan for and looking forward to is a really good tip to help recalibrate this manic emotion that a lot of us are feeling.

P: Mmm, it’s hard going on to something that you can control. If you’ve got something that you’re planning for, it gives you a sense of control. You can’t control the cancelling of the winery trip.

M: Mmm.

P: You can’t control the government saying, ‘No, you’re not allowed to leave your house or see your intimate partner.’ You cannot control that, so find something that you can control and that is having a dress up party, perhaps with all your workmates or your friends and going right ‘The theme is eighties funk, and everybody has to wear MC Hammer pants.’ People will get into it, they’ll contribute, and that gives you a sense of control which we know from all the stuff we talked about before gives you an access to happiness.

M: Yep, absolutely. All right. We are out of time yet again. But be vulnerable people. Let your emotions out.

P: Yes.

M: Feel your emotions and take action. Take action to plan some happiness activities that can balance out the bad things that are going on right now.

P: Take back control.

M: And that will show your emotional and your happiness literacy by putting in place some of the stuff that we talked about on this show.

P: Fabulous, lovely note to end on. Have a great happy week.

M: Have a happy week, bye everyone.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Does Where You Live Impact Your Happiness? (E79)

09/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about how our environment and where we live impacts our health and happiness levels.

Show notes

Wealth distribution, Happiness and Quintiles

In the podcast Marie and Pete were discussing the wealth distribution in Australia and how research has shown a correlation between wealth distribution and physical health which can have a direct negative impact on our overall happiness. Pete also mentions quintiles in the podcast. A quintile is any of five equal groups into which a population can be divided according to the distribution of values of a particular variable. Put simply a quintile is one-fifth of a ranked list.

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

… [Whispered conversation]

M: That’s you… you’re up.

P: Are we on?

M: Yes, we’re on.

P: We’re on? Microphone’s on?

M: We’re on!

P: [Starts intro drumming theme song] Da da da!

M: Hey!

P: Laugh! It’s a bit like the Muppets, isn’t it? [High pitched Muppet voice singing] “It’s time to make the music. It’s time to light the lights.”

M: Laugh. We’re showing our age again.

P: I don’t care, the Muppets were brilliant, Jim Henson was a God.

M: I’ll give you that, definitely.

P: I watched Willow this week.

M: Oh!

P: That was my favourite little movie.

M: Yeah, I love it.

P: Yeah, yeah, it was cool.

M: Were you happy? Did it bring you happiness?

P: It did. I laughed and smiled a lot about Val Kilmer’s really bad acting, laugh.

M: The other one to watch if you were a Muppets fan is Dark Crystal.

P: Oh! That’s on a different level!

M: That’s gave me nightmares.

P: Yeah. It’s brilliant.

M & P: Laugh!

P: Mmm..mm, the Skeksies.

M: Yes, oh that’s it.

P: So, I’m going to get all hippie and back to my yogi routes. So, imagine me in my sarongs in a garden and clinging my little symbols and my singing bowls.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: I just want everyone to join hands for a second.

M: We can’t. We’re in lockdown.

P: Yeah, this is the whole point. We’re doing a virtual hand.

M: Doing a virtual handhold?

P: Doing virtual hands, yes.

M: I’m with you, I’m with you.

P: Okay, so. Unless you’re driving – everybody close your eyes join hands and just scan –

M: I’m in the correct pose and my belly’s rising.

P: Laugh.

M: Marie’s been doing meditation courses.

P: Laugh. So, this is a virtual handhold, because in Sydney, we are in lockdown.

Melbourne has just gone into its fifth lockdown. It’s a bit tough at the moment, and I want everyone to just scan their bodies and breathe into their backs, not into your belly. I want you to breathe into your back, into your lower spine. Think of your pelvis just above your pelvis at the back of your body, breathe.

Really important for us all to realise that there’s a lot of stuff going on at the moment and this is a really good way to get into your seat of power. Not only your seat of power, but it is also the best way to diaphragmatic breathe. And for those people out there who were sitting lots and getting a little bit of neck tension and upper a back tension. If you can increase your diaphragmatic breathing and breathe into your lower spine, feel your lower back against the back of the chair and push into it when you breathe. That is the best breath you’re going to take. And namaste. Laugh.

M: I feel great.

P: There we go. There’s a little tip for you. So, I hope no one was doing that when they were driving and then crashed into a pole, laugh.

M: Where are they going? We’re all in lockdown because the only the only people that we talk to is Sydney and Melbourne people, of course.

P & M: Laugh.

M: We were trending in Ireland the other week! So, hello –

P: Really the Irish like us?

M: – hello to our listeners in Ireland. I had a trip planned to your country last year that never happened.

P: We had a trip planned. Hello to County Cork.

M: We were going to kiss the… what is it?

P: Blarney Stone.

M: Yeah. I mean, that is disgusting if you think about it. Not covid safe.

P: Laugh, very not covid safe!

M: Laugh.

P: Mmm brimstone, yummy, laugh.

M: Mmm hmm. All right, well, what are we going to talk about today Pete?

P: So, I’m taking the lead I’m going to lead everyone down the rabbit hole here and I’m asking Marie specifically here to just hold my hand and make a jump here because I’m going to go down a path and I’m hoping you’ll all come with me. Laugh.

M: I’ve got sweats, I don’t like giving up control.

P: Laugh. Ah! Interesting you say that because this does have relevance to control.

M: Oooh.

P: So, coming across some information in my research in my first semester of university health and happiness are very much linked. And we’ve talked about this before, and some of the information that came out of the Torrens University by Professor John Glover of the Public Health and Information Service unit was all about healthy suburbs. And how in Australia in particular we can actually correlate your suburb to your health condition.

And the interesting thing is that suburbs that are next door to each other have vastly different presenting diseases. And they did a little example of this on the talk that I was listening to. So, something like Surry Hills in Sydney could be next to Erskineville and Erskineville could have high incidences of cardio heart disease, and Surry Hills has influenza. And this comes down to your suburb and what they did with the research was to find that there are differences, according to where you live to determine your health profile.

M: So, what you’re saying Pete is, you live up the hill from me, when we’re in Sydney.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: You could have high instances of diabetes in your area and I could have high instances of flu in my area.

P: Exactly.

M: Why?

P: It comes down to the access that we have in terms of where we live. The neighbourhoods that we have. It can also come down to a wealth distribution as well. We’ve talked before about money distribution –

M: So, money makes you healthier?

P: – being part of the factors of access to happiness. Money buys happiness, yes?

M: Money buys access to happiness.

P: There we go, laugh. So, in the same way, money buys access to health, healthy actions, healthy eating, healthy lifestyle choices.

M: So, if you can afford to buy organic that’s going to benefit you.

P: Mmm. Absolutely. To eat healthfully is more expensive than to eat unhealthily in the current Western society.

M: Yep, absolutely.

P: Okay, so if we go down the rabbit hole with this, doctor’s Glover talks about the quintiles and that Australia is divided into five quintiles of advantage and disadvantage. So, the quintile number one is 61% and above, quintile number five is 44% and below in terms of income, equality and wealth equality. Now –

M: Sorry, backtrack, backtrack, not following.

P: Okay, back it up. Laugh.

M: 65% are in the first of five quintiles?

P: No, in terms of wealth, wealth, inequality in Australia.

M: Yep.

P: So, if you’re in the top quintile, you’re 61% and above. If you’re in the bottom line, you’re 44% –

M: 61% of what?

P: Of wealth distribution. Income earning, basically.

The top income earners are 61% above the average median, whereas the low-income earners are 44% below.

P: Still not following?

M: What does that have to do with quintiles?

P: That’s got to do with… he’s classifying these quintiles for advantage and disadvantage. This comes back to the health factor. Keep coming with me. Keep coming down the rabbit hole.

M: Yep.

P: I know it’s a long, long process, laugh.

M: Yep.

P: So, it got me thinking in terms of health, correlation to happiness, can suburbs make a difference to our happiness levels? Where we live, does that impact our happiness? The answer is yes, laugh.

M: Absolutely. Well, we’ve already drawn the conclusion before or shown that the research and drawn the conclusion that physical health impacts your mental wellbeing and therefore your happiness. So, yeah, this is really interesting.

P: And mental well-being is a real term.

M: Yeah.

P: Yeah. So, I went further down the rabbit hole, and I found some publications by Helen L. Berry from the National Centre for Epidemiology and Population Health at the Australian National University. And she cites certain characteristics of areas that are highly concentrated in terms of sharing health-damaging factors. And some of the things that she came out with, I won’t read them all, but I highlighted a few.

One was including pride in one’s home, and home as a refuge.

And this comes back to Maslow’s hierarchy of needs and feeling secure. It also comes back to the UN sustainable goals of being secure in your house.

M: And also the research that we showed, you know, once you’ve got the basic needs met, which in countries like Australia and Ireland there are very, very, very, very small proportion of people who don’t have that.

P: Mmm.

M: Generally, your homeless population only, which is a small percentage.

P: Mmm.

M: But the pride in the home piece we’ve explored as well with how your immediate environment can impact your mood and wellbeing. So just putting some plants in and making sure you have watered them, not let them die.

P & M: Laughter.

M: I have to keep remembering that, laugh. [It] can make a difference to, you know, your mood, your lighting, all of those things.

P: Definitely.

M: I’m really interested though Pete, to understand if you are not earning as much as the people around you. But you live in the crappiest house on an expensive street, whether you get the health benefits that everyone else around you gets or whether it is truly tied to money income only?

P: I’m probably not the person to answer that, but I’m going to I’m going to make an attempt. I would say that it is tied to income only because of the sense of control.

M: Ok. So, it’s got nothing to do with where you live. It’s just that where you live correlates to how much income you have.

P: That totally takes my argument in the opposite direction.

M & P: Laugh!

P: I wouldn’t say that it is actually.

M: It is your show! Your rabbit hole!

P: Laugh. Yeah, you’ve taken a sidebar ‘like Whoa!’

M: Laugh.

P: I think that there is a certain factor of where you live that does impact on your happiness levels, and that comes down to the environment.

M: Yeah.

P: And one of the things that Berry talks about is the cleanliness of environment. So, we know that neighbourhood areas that are well kept that looked after by the local community have a sense of care at a sense of pride, and that correlates with what she’s talking about in terms of the characteristics of highly concentrated areas that don’t have health-damaging characteristics.

M: And I’m going to bail you out a little bit here.

P: Laugh.

M: I asked a question that I know the answer to.

P & M: Laugh!

M: There is a fabulous article in Ms magazine, which is titled Want to Make Your Country Happier? – Elect Women.

P: Ahh.

M: Yes, and it talks about how certain nations come out year, year on year as more happy in the World Happiness Report.

P: Mmm.

M: And those nations have higher levels of government spending on human infrastructure. And so, taking that down to the suburb level. These are the suburbs that probably have public libraries, community centres, parks that are well kept, good roads without potholes, nice areas where people can gather and be social, all of those things with the good infrastructure.

P: Yes, exactly.

M: They may also have female mayors.

P: That would be interesting to look at, at the data.

M: Laugh.

P: I wonder if we can search out and find some of those stats that that would be really interesting. And I’ve come across that as well in terms of the female quotient of leadership. And there’s a fabulous series on ABC, which is a national broadcaster here in Australia at the moment called Ms Represented and it’s hosted by Anitta Crabb –

M: Ah, Anabelle Crabbe.

P: – and, oh sorry, Annabelle, my apologies. But FABULOUS series. Really interesting.

M: It’s great.

P: I’ve liked the first ten episodes and yeah, worth a look if you’re going down that road. Um, bringing it back, if we can bring it back to your point exactly about the environment, Marie and how they impact [health and happiness]. Berry states that exposure to clearly visible symbols of poverty and degradation send powerful messages that nobody cares about the neighbourhood or its residents. This has a direct correlation to mental health.

M: Yep, absolutely.

P: So, characteristics that generate direct health risks, such as:

Facilitating spread of disease,
Discouraging physical activity, and
Negative health behaviours.

[These] can be reduced by:

An increased perception of community involvement,
[Good] health,
Pleasant surroundings.

M: Safety.

P: Yeah.

M: So, if you feel that you’re safe in your neighbourhood and can walk around or go to the park or meet people in local areas and enjoy the space, you would get out more.

P: Absolutely. Yeah. There was a study done by Dalgard and Tambs published in the British Journal of Psychology where they studied 503 people in Oslo in Norway and their mental health issues were declining initially in poorly functioning neighbourhoods. This improved over a decade after they were shifted into slightly more encouraging neighbourhoods with [better] environmental factors. It did take 10 years, but science says that it had a decrease in psychiatric morbidity.

M: There are, I was just, I was doing some research for my book, and I can’t even remember the name of the city anymore. There’s a city in South America that is held up as the shining example of good investment in infrastructure, and they turned around their city from being one of the most crime riddled cities in the world to being a tourism hub with great world class universities.

P: Mmm.

M: And it was all due to, I think, we’ve spoken before about the 15 minute city?

P: Yep.

M: It was due to investment in infrastructure and gardens and ponds and bringing wildlife back into the city, creating trees for birds and all of those fabulous things, you know, fixing graffitied walls and cleaning that up. And all of the things that we’re talking about.

P: Mmm, yeah. We talked about that before in terms of Vancouver. Vancouver did that as well.

M: I think quite a few cities. Well, France. Paris is definitely one of the city’s that’s held up as a model for the 15 minute city, they’ve done a lot of work. London’s doing a lot of work on that, Melbourne as well.

P: Mmm.

M: A lot of big cities are including Vancouver, I’m sure.

P: Mmm, yeah. Reclaiming the space and turning it by changing your environment, you can actually directly impact your mental health and thus your happiness levels.

M: Another great example is Singapore, and one of the things I noticed when I visited Singapore was it is so dense it is denser than Sydney. I don’t know how dense it is compared to New York, but I imagine it’s pretty similar. They’ve run out of space. They can’t go into New Jersey.

P: Laugh.

M: Like New York can. They’ve only got a tiny little island for their country, and every single inch of it is planned and built on. However, every block has a certain amount of land that is, that must go towards green gardens, so you’ll find these beautiful big skyscrapers with a whole lot of beautiful gardens as part of the entryway and foyer area. Whereas we would build all the way to the sidewalk here.

P: Mmm, yeah.

M: So, our concrete jungle is truly a concrete jungle, whereas a far more densely packed city like Singapore, just looks really green. When you walk around it, it’s beautiful.

P: Yeah. That comes down to city planning and architecture design.

M: Yeah, yep and prioritising that over more buildings.

P: Yeah, density of population.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Ah, we’re going to run out of time. So, I’m going to quickly bring this back to what can you do if you’re living in a disadvantaged area about [your] happiness levels?

M: Ahh.

P: So, what are some practical things to do? And I’ll come back to the original discussion that we had with Helen Berry.

Invest in your community.
Make some gardens.

It can be as simple as creating a little laneway garden in the back-alley way if you can get the community to be a part of the environment and bringing that up. We saw this with the rise of graffiti artists in places like New York and San Francisco, where all of a sudden, they were being employed to do their graffiti art and the community was involved.

M: Yes.

P: So, that encourages social connection, which we know has a huge impact on our happiness. And even if you can just make that slight change. As the study in Oslo showed, it’s enough to tip the balance in your favour coming back to what we talked about before Marie in terms of looking at your home de-cluttering the whole, what was it, Mariko? What was her name? [Click, click]

M: Marie Kondo.

P: Marie Kondo yeah! Laugh. The Marie Kondo effect.

M: De-cluttering, yep.

P: And getting rid of those what they call psychosocial stresses, enabling yourself to be part of – to eliminate social instabilities, things that are distressing to you. Try and minimise those in the home.

M: I think that’s a really good point, because if you don’t have a lot of money a lot of times… And when I was in UNI, I was a lot more materialistic. When you don’t have and you see other people around you who have more than you, I found that I used to buy stuff I didn’t need a lot more often than I do now when I have a full-time job and I’ve been saving for a number of years.

P: Mmm.

M: And now I’m really finding the mental health benefits of being a bit more minimalistic in what I have in my home.

P: Mmm.

M: You have to clean or dust or look after as much. And it’s much easier to come home to a house that you can be proud of that isn’t cluttered.

P: Mmm. And you could also invite other people into which, again, that increases social connection.

M: Yep.

P: Yeah. So, in summary, we’re going to wrap it up. Looking after the social environment and the physical environment around you and in your local area is actually a real key to happiness. So, if you’re not happy with your current neighbourhood environment, maybe this is your chance to do one activity to try and bring that into a better space or an easier space for you to be a part of where you can experience better happiness.

M: What I love about we’ve spoken about tonight is that you can take control.

P: Mmm.

M: So, if you are in lockdown right now, a lot of things have been taken out of our control. So, particularly with working out of your own home, minimalising, decluttering or bringing some greenery in, you can control all of that right now and then maybe when we’re out of lockdown or if you’re not in lockdown currently, getting a crew together to work on your neighbourhood is such a valuable and joyful thing to do.

P: Yeah, very much so. And on that note, have a happy week.

M: Bye.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

Please note that I get a small commission if you buy something from my site. Your support helps to keep this site going at no additional cost to you. Thanks!

Roller Coasters, Time to Let Go! (E78)

02/08/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week, Marie and Pete talk about the thrill of Roller Coasters, good stress and when it’s time to put up your hands and just let go!

Show notes

The Science of the Thrill Marvin Zuckerman

4 personality types

Adventure seekers
New experience seekers
People seeking to lose inhibitions
People susceptible to boredom

Grey matter vs. white matter

Kelly McGonigal Ted talk on good stress

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

M: And we’re back!

P: Ta da! Here we are again. It’s like Groundhog Day.

M: Thanks?

P: Same day, same spot.

M: I thought this was bonding?

P: Yeah.

M: But you think of it as Groundhog Day?

P: Laugh, it is. I look forward to this every single week because we always do it at the same time. Laugh.

M: Same bat time, same bat channel.

P: [Pew] Laugh.

M: We age ourselves every week, you do know that, laugh.

P: Hey, I’m 48 proud of it. I’m not quite 48 but I’m nearly there. Laugh.

M: And I’m 28 and keeping busy.

P: Laugh! I went, I went with the real factor.

M: Laugh! So, what are we talking about today Pete?

P: We’re talking about roller coasters. Woo hoo, what fun!? Laugh!

M: Yay!

P: Who doesn’t love roller coasters? …Aah me.

M: Really?

P: Well actually, we have a mutual friend that converted me from a non-roller coaster lover to a roller coaster lover. God Bless him.

M: It’s all about opting in.

P: Yeah, it totally was. I got forced. I got dragged through the gates of a theme park and hearing “we’re going here!” And I’m like, “Oh, shit.” Laugh!

M: I wouldn’t recommend forcing people who are not inclined onto rollercoasters because it can be petrifying and that could actually be quite traumatic.

P: Exactly. Yeah, it was. It was, I was that person that doesn’t scream. I’m the one that just sits there with this panicked expression on their face, holding their breath for the three minutes.

M: Oh, I love watching those!

P: Laugh.

M: Because when you’re on the other side and loving it, watching people who are petrified is just like a whole other thing that you just don’t wrap your head around.

P: Laugh. It was, Jeffrey was very good, though. He took me on one that was indoors, which was great.

M: Nice.

P: Yeah, it was good. So, it was just black. We got out of the roller coaster and I said, “Did we go upside down?” He said, “I think so.”

M: Laugh!

P: We better, we better do it again just to check. So, we did, laugh.

M: Space Mountain? The best indoor, dark.

P: No, actually it wasn’t Space Mountain. It was something, something else. It was at the MGM one in Miami, and it had it had Aerosmith playing that’s all I remember.

M: Oh! The Aerosmith ride! That’s awesome!

P: Yeah, yeah. That one.

M: Ok. Alright, I’m with you.

P: That was my first roller coaster.

M: That’s a big roller coaster, too.

P: It is.

M: So, Space Mountain at Disneyland is small compared to Aerosmith.

P: Yeah, I take it hard core. Laugh!

M: So, I’m feeling happy just talking about roller coasters.

P: Laugh. There’s a reason why Marie, there’s such a reason why.

M: There is.

P: You are hard wired for this.

M: There’s a child inside me, I’m sure.

P: Yeah.

M: Disney, roller coasters, I’m there every time.

P & M: Laughter.

M: But please explain more. So, what is the draw of roller coasters?

P: Thrill seeking.

M: I’m down.

P: Yeah, we as humans are hardwired to go thrill seeking and have that almost petrifying response in our bodies because it does stuff to our system. And by our system, I mean our brain and also a physical system.

M: I feel like it wakes you up.

P: There’s a huge release of dopamine and adrenaline [epinephrine] and norepinephrine [noradrenaline] and all those lovely happy hormones –

M: Mmm hmm.

P: – after an event like this. And this is why we go seeking it, because that high that you have afterwards is intoxicating and you want more!

M: It’s legal drugs.

P: Yep, completely. There’s lots of science and research behind this.

M: And we don’t even have to pay for the drugs because the body produces them naturally.

P: Laugh, it does. And so, it’s that whole idea of having a hit, and we want to go and get more of it. And this comes from a real primal idea of taking on the woolly mammoth with a spear. You know, something –

M: The fight or flight response.

P: Yep, completely. It’s an absolute primal mechanism, which we love. And this is the weird thing, it’s the concept of the thing that may kill us but that doesn’t that actually makes us want it more. It’s like, ‘Oh wow, cool. I survived that. Let’s do it again!’ Laugh!

M: I love it. Well, actually, there’s a lot to this. So, when I was doing public speaking training, we learned that public speaking is one of the biggest fears.

P: Yes.

M: In the world. Number one fear for a lot of people, and there’s a way that you can train your brain to see that fear as not fear but excitement and your response that fight or flight reaction that your body has to a threat can be controlled and redirected into a positive psychological experience.

P: Ok.

M: So, someone who gets on a roller coaster and who is petrified and they’re the person at the front who somehow got shuffled into the front even though they didn’t want to be there and has a look of sheer terror and doesn’t scream.

P: Laugh.

M: Research shows that people who are enjoying themselves are the ones screaming the ones who shut up wish they weren’t there.

P: Laugh!

M: And so, with public speaking, you know you’re about to get up on stage, you check that you’re wearing your pants –

P: Laugh!

M: And you’re feeling jittery, and your stomach is tied in knots. And if you do some power poses – have we talk about power poses on the podcast before?

P: Is that the bicep flex in front of the mirror of the gym.

M: That works. Yes, it’s about expanding your stance. Spread your legs a little bit –

P: Oh! Oof.

M: Shoulders up, and make yourself big and do some jumping or exercise to get the blood pumping even more.

P: Yep, yep.

M: But you could be going down the wrong path if you’re directing this new energy or increased energy into more fear.

P: Yep.

M: And the big one, put a big smile on your face, even though you might not be feeling it.

P: Yeah, fake it. Laugh.

M: Right, So yep. And you’re going to tell yourself I’m excited, I’m pumped, this is going to be awesome. And if you do that enough with that big smile on your face, which starts to release those chemicals as well the positive chemicals, you can trick your brain into not thinking of your physiological reaction as fear.

P: Yeah.

M: Yet actually, start to think of it as excitement.

P: Mmm.

M: And so many speakers you’ll see come bounding onto the stage. Not because they’re just super cheery, happy, crazy over the top people who need more ADHD meds.

P: Laugh!

M: But because they’re trying to control their public speaking fears.

P: Yep, it’s the Tony Robbins effect.

M: Absolutely. Oh, I’m not sure. I think Tony Robbins actually might need those ADHD meds.

P & M: Laughter!

M: A lot of other people aren’t that naturally hyper, laugh.

P: Well, I don’t think he is. He’s not naturally hyper, but he gets himself into that hyper state. And the interesting thing that I think Tony Robbins has clocked is that he gets his audience into that hyper state. It’s all about the fluffer Marie.

M: Oh, the fluffer, we’re back to the fluffer.

P: The fluffer.

M: And for those of you who have joined us recently –

P: Laugh!

M: – there was a whole sidebar conversation very early on, where Pete had to explain what a fluffer does.

P: Google it, it’s fun.

M: I now know.

P & M: Laughter.

M: Back to roller coasters, laugh.

P: Back to roller coasters, so are roller coasters good or bad for us?

M: It comes down to the good or bad stress argument.

P: Ah, which is?

M: That stress is not bad or good. It’s both.

P: Now we’ve talked a little bit about this before in a previous episode about eustress and I love this eustress is spelt EU stress. I kind of think of it as European stress.

M: Laugh!

P: It’s like, ‘Eustress doesn’t kill me because I look fabulous while I’m smoking in my French beret and my Jean-Claude Gaultier T-shirt.’ Laugh.

M: Insert disclaimer here about smoking. Yes, laugh. Eustress got it. And that is the positive stress and roller coasters fall into that bucket, right?

P: There we go, yep. So, you don’t have to be a CEO of a company and thrive on having deadlines. You’ve just got to jump on a roller coaster.

M: Love it, or there’s a range of other things you can do. So, this isn’t just roller coasters. You can watch scary movies, for instance, and I’m out of ideas. [literally any thrill-seeking activity!] You got anything else? Laugh.

P: Bungee jumping.

M: Laugh, there you go.

P: Bungee jumping.

M: Laugh.

P: Well this brings me to a little bit of research that I found when I was looking at some stuff behind this of a gentleman by the name of Marvin Zuckerman. And Zuckerman has been studying The Science of the Thrill for the last 40 years. He started in the 1970’s, actually 1960’s and got through to the 1970’s, and he came up with the four personality types of humans.

Now, apparently, we all fit into one of these four types, and number one is the adventure seeker, and these are the people that seek physical challenges. The second is the new experience seeker. These are your travellers, the people that go to exotic places, try new foods, have chilli. Yeah, Marie’s ticking the box on both of these.

Right now, laugh.

M: I am. Especially the second one, but both laugh.

P: Laugh.

M: If you can do them together, I’m in.

P: Laugh, you usually do.

M: Laugh.

P: The third one is people seeking to lose inhibitions. Now I find this an interesting one.

M: I don’t have any of those.

P: Laugh. Neither do I, I get naked at a moment’s notice? I’m happy, you know.. let my inhibitions loose. Laugh.

M: I’d just like to say that Brené Brown taught me how to be vulnerable. Not that I have no inhibitions, laugh.

P: Laughter!

M: Moving on, yes.

P: Moving on.

M: Those people in that group they’re got no inhibitions – oh, they’re trying to get rid of their inhibitions?

P: They’re trying to lose their inhibitions. So, these are the ones –

M: Oh, ok. I love it.

P: – they thrive on making social connections, so they love the crowds, they love the groups. They like being in touch with people or dinner parties and things like that. They enjoyed meeting new people.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Because it allows them to open themselves up a little bit more.

M: Yeah.

P: And the final group are the people who are susceptible to boredom. People who get bored easily.

M: I think I’ve got three out of four.

P & M: Laugh!

P: These people crave novelty. They crave new stimulus.

M: And so many people do. For anyone who’s ever been in a long-term relationship, you can’t tell me that you look at your partner 10 years later and feel the same butterflies and honeymoon excitement to that person as you did when you first got together.

P: Laugh.

M: It just doesn’t happen. If you do know the secret, though I’m all ears.

P: Laugh, that could be another episode.

M: Laugh, but it’s the reason why there’s a period called the honeymoon period, because when there is novelty with someone new that you click with and connect with.

P: Mmm.

M: That’s you know, I’ve just got this huge grin on my face, and I can’t talk now, right?

P: Laugh.

M: Like it’s a great feeling. It’s an absolutely amazing feeling to be falling in love with someone. But then, once you know that they never put their socks in the hamper and they like to go the bathroom with the door open –

P: Laugh.

M: Like all of that stuff, laugh.

P: Laugh, not naming any names, of course. You only have one husband, don’t you Marie?

M: Yep, only one. I’m working on that.

P: Laugh! We love you, Francis.

M: I do, one is enough.

P & M: Laugh.

P: So, Zuckerman talks about these four personality types and that, yes, we all fall in the middle of these, and you can be part of more than one. So, there is that type, but I think it’s an interesting one to put your if you had to choose one. It says something about your personality, but also something about your brain makeup.

So, there are certain – all our brains are different. We all have different ways of using our brain. Some of us have more grey matter than white matter. And I found this really interesting.

M: But what does that mean?

P: Being the newly developed scientist that I am.

M & P: Laugh.

P: So, grey matter are nerve cells.

M: Yep.

P: They are on the outside of our brain because they’re the neurons, the cells that do all the connections and make all the connections. Whereas the white matter is the axons they’re the terminals, the nerve conduction is they take the pathways through. So, our spinal cord has white matter on the outside and grey matter on the inside, our brain is inverted.

M: Ok.

P: It has the grey matter on the outside because we need all those neural connections to be firing off each other. We don’t want them protected by axons and tucked away where they can’t form connections.

M: And the grey matter is smarts?

P: …Well, yeah. If you’ve got more grey matter. So, this is why the human brain is more developed and say are primates and birds, for example, it’s the folds of our brain creates more surface area. And that’s why the grain matters on the outside of our brain because it allows us so many millions of connections, which is why our brains are so well developed.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: And if you compare a human brain with a chimpanzee brain, it has less folds. So, the dexterity of those connections is less. And then, if you look at a bird brain, for example, it’s almost smooth.

M: Mmm.

P: So, the ability to have those different connections is reduced by the shape of the brain if you like.

M: What’s the name of the dog breeds that have all the folds? [Shar-Pei]

P: Laugh. Oh, is it Shih tzu, no… what are they called? Oh, I can’t remember.

M: I’ve got a dog in my head, laugh.

P: Fluffy with wrinkles.

M & P: Laugh.

P: So, some of us have more grey matter than others, and that determines our personality type, so that might determine what kind of a thrill seeker you are. And if you’re, if you know someone that is constantly putting themselves in harm’s way, this could be the reason why they actually need that sense of excitement or that adventure of nearly dying to stimulate all those lovely fear and flight responses which do wonderful things for their happiness levels.

M: So, my risk taking, and lack of self-control is purely biological and not my fault.

P: Yep, yep. Completely, I absolve you of all responsibility Marie, Laugh!

M: Shar-Peis.

P: There we go! You are a Shar-Pei.

M: Love it.

P: Laugh!

M: So, there’s an actual physical need, then, for that novelty and thrill seeking.

P: Definitely, you can fall into that adventure seeker personality type, which means you have to be going, you should be going on roller coasters lots. Whereas if you fall into one of the other categories, like people who are susceptible to boredom. You don’t necessarily need to go and jump on to roller coasters, you could just read a new book or find a new game to play or take up a new sport. So, it’s different horses for different courses if you like.

M: Always. I do have one last, – before we wrap up – one last study that I thought was really interesting. Researchers put a bunch of asthmatics on roller coasters.

P: Oh, I like this one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, laugh!

M: I don’t know how they got permission to do this one.

P: I think there were some very enthusiastic volunteers.

M: Laugh.

P: It was like, ‘we’re going to take you to a theme park and study your brain, woo!’

M: Study your asthma reactions?

P: Laugh, yeah.

M: So, when asthmatics feel short of breath, that can be a really, truly traumatic feeling and can spiral into very negative feelings and reactions and physiological reactions that often lead to attacks.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: So, researchers took a bunch of asthmatics and put them on roller coasters to recreate that shortness of breath, but they wanted to see whether or not they would go down that negative thinking and physiological response.

P: Consequential response, yeah.

M: Or whether the release of – so this is the difference between good stress and bad stress.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: -the good stress from the roller coaster, whether the release of all the endorphins and the dopamine and…

P: Serotonin. [Not scientifically backed]

M: All of that would have an impact in another way. And lo and behold, it did.

P: Yay.

M: These guys had the same types of initial physiological reactions when they were excited. So, shortness of breath, faster heart rate, etcetera, blood pressure. But the positive emotions that we’re going along with it meant that they recovered and moved on. Got off the roller coaster went and got a hot dog.

P: Laugh. It’s good. There’s a positivity to stress, and I’ll throw this one in there as well. There’s a speaker called Kelly McGonigal, not Professor McGonigal out of Harry Potter.

M: Laugh, yep.

P: She does a lovely Ted talk that talks about the positive you eustress’s and how it’s all about our response to stress and how we can use stress in a real positive way. I really will put this in the show, notes Leandra, laugh.

M: He says that every week and then doesn’t, just so you know listeners.

P: Yeah, I know…

M: Laugh.

P: But she does actually talk about the Harvard University stress tests and how they turn stress into a real positive reaction for us. So that’s worth having a little look at if you’re interested in what we’re talking about today.

M: And on a final note on that one. If you are a procrastinator, like most students, a lot of students and you wait until the last minute to get your assignments or to cram for your exams. There’s two ways to view that.

One is ‘Oh, my gosh, I’m never going to pass. I have so much to do.’

Or two, ‘I’m G’d up and I’m going to do this and let’s just power through it and get it done.’

P: Yeah, I can fly by the seat of my pants, and I can still ace this, yeah.

M: Exactly. And again, I come back to all of that positive affirmation and positive self-talk and glass are full and we’re seeing themes here Pete.

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: You’d think our podcast is about happiness, wouldn’t you?

P: Laugh!

M: Absolutely. All right, well, that wraps up our discussion of roller coasters with a resounding yes.

P: Laugh and being a former/ newly subscribed person to roller coasters, I say go for it. Loads of fun. Go with a friend and just remember, screaming is obligatory, laugh!

M: Oh, absolutely. You’ve got to let loose, and you’ve got to let go. Hands up!

P: Oh, let loose! Let go! And hands up!

M: Hands up!

P: Have a happy week.

M: See you next time.

M: Whether you should actually be letting them take up that space in your brain.

P: And if you like our little show, we would absolutely love for you to leave a comment or rating to help us out.

M: Until next time.

M & P: Choose happiness.

[Exit music fadeout]

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Sphere of Control and Chaos! (E77)

26/07/2021 by Marie

Happiness for Cynics podcast

This week Marie and Pete talk about your sphere of control and chaos, and how to focus on things you can control or should just let go.

Show notes

Exercise in letting go.

Write down all your worries and concerns that you have right now.
Put a mark next to each one for:
- within your control,
- within your influence, or
- out of your control.
Acknowledge where most of your worries and concerns are and think about whether you should be letting them take up that space in your brain.
Read aloud the worries/concerns that are outside of your control and notice how they make you feel. How does your body react to those issues and concerns that are outside of your control? Analise them and try to look at them differently or reframe them.
The next step is hard, you need to make the decision to let them go.
Imagine putting them in a balloon and having them float away, this is hard for people who have never done visualisation before but well worth the effort.
Make this an annual event with a close friend or family member.

Transcript

[Happy intro music -background]

M: Welcome to happiness for cynics and thanks for joining us as we explore all the things I wish I’d known earlier in life but didn’t.

P: This podcast is about how to live the good life. Whether we’re talking about a new study or the latest news or eastern philosophy, our show is all about discovering what makes people happy.

M: So, if you’re like me and you want more out of life, listen in and more importantly, buy in because I guarantee if you do, the science of happiness can change your life.

P: Plus, sometimes I think we’re kind of funny.

[Intro music fadeout]

M: Hey, hey.

P: And we’re back.

M: And we’re back.

P: (High voice) Hi Muz, how are you?

M: I am good. How are you?

P: I did sound like Mickey Mouse there. [Mickey Mouse voice] Hi Muz, how are you? Woo hoo!

M & P: Laugh!

M: I’m going back to the, like the thirties, the real original Mickey Mouse.

P: Yeah, the really high pitched Mickey Mouse.

M: My mind is on the steam train. [Steam boat!]

P: Yeah.

M: [Failed attempt at whistling] …

P: I’m going to let that go.

M & P: Laughter!

M: And how are you?

P: I’m going crazy, laugh.

M: Obviously. You’re in week three of lockdown, aren’t you? It only took two and a half weeks.

P: [Horror movie voice] The walls are bleeding.

M & P: Laugh!

P: I am going slightly so crazy. It’s not good for my mental health, laugh.

M: So, so far in lockdown. Because even though I’m up in Tamworth, I have been locked down because I was in Sydney within the last two weeks. So, been locked down up here. I have started growing four plants that I can’t pronounce, and I have no idea what I’m growing.

P: Laugh!

M: I have made rock cakes.

P: Oh, wow.

M: Which really brought back memories from being a child.

P: CWA recess lollies.

M: Right? They even had actual CWA jam on them, thank you very much.

P: Oh! Wow, wow.

M: It had a handwritten note with when it was made.

P: Ohh. My mum does that, ohh.

M: Laugh.

P: Memories, there so good.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Anyway! Getting onto the story.

M: We are talking about spheres of control –

P: And chaos!

M: Bah, Bow..

P: Ha, ha, ha! Chaos theory! [Extremely high-pitched voice] Everything is vibrating at very high frequencies.

M: We’re absolutely not talking chaos theory. That would be biting off way more than we could chew, laugh.

P: Yeah, laugh. Existential scientists would be raiding my house.

M: Mmm hmm. Yeah. I picture like the crew of Big Bang theory-

P: Yeah, pretty much.

M: – going “you’re wrong!”

P: Very much. But we’re not talking about that, we’re talking about the sphere of control. What is this supposed, sphere of control that you talk about, Marie? Enlighten me.

M: So, if you imagine an M&M-

P: Mmm, num num num.

M: – in the middle, so the smallest.

P: Ok.

M: And that is what you can control in the world.

P: Ok, yep.

M: And then you have an orange.

P: Wow…

M: The M&M is in the middle of the orange, right?

P: Ok.

M: This is a really bad analogy.

P: Laugh!

M: So, what you can control is the M&M, the orange is what you can influence.

P: Oh.

M: And then the orange is in a watermelon.

P: Woah!

M: And the watermelon represents everything else outside of your control and influence.

P: Oh, my lord. Are they all inside each other like a turducken?

M: Yes, like a turducken.

P: Ahh. Got it.

M: Yes. Now, where crazy things us humans.

P: Laugh.

M: And unfortunately, we are wired to worry. We’ve talked about wired for negativity wired to look out for us and our kind. And we have this nasty habit if it’s left unchecked of worrying and being anxious about things that are in the watermelon…

P & M: Laugh.

M: That are outside of our control and influence.

P: [Life coach/instructional voice] Be the watermelon. No! don’t be the watermelon.

M: Don’t be the watermelon. Leave the watermelon alone.

P: Laugh.

M: Yeah. What you should, in a controlled and measured way, worry and be anxious about is what you can control.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: And I would argue that you should get through your worry and anxious phase quickly into action rather than dwelling in a negative mind space.

P: Yep.

M: What you can again spend time worrying about is the orange, what you can influence. But again, you need to give up a little bit of control there and understand that you may be able to influence things in that sphere, but they still may not go your way.

P: Oh.

M: And there’s nothing you can do about that sometimes.

P: Ok, all right, all right.

M: Everything else. Don’t worry about it. Let it go!

P: [Singing] Let it go, let it go…

M: Mmm hmm.

P: Laugh.

M: Now, that is far easier said than done.

P & M: Laugh!

M: For myself included.

P: So, it’s be the M&M. Don’t be the watermelon.

M: Yes.

P: And try to recognise the orange.

M: I really need to work on my stories before –

P: No, I like it. It’s working for me, it’s animated.

M: – we go on air.

P & M: Laugh!

M: So really, what we’re talking about is something that, if left unchecked, can lead to people having high anxiety and worrying unnecessarily. And if any of you have ever known someone who worries all the time, it can take over your life.

P: Definitely, that obsession over… and again, obsessions are one of the elements that are outside of your control.

M: Mmm hmm.

P: They’re unattainable. Why do we spend so much time worrying about it when we actually have no control over what it can do?

M: Yep, and not only that, if you’re worrying about all of those things, you can’t control your probably not moving through the concerns of issues that you can control and getting to the point where you actually just take some action and drive it to a conclusion that’s satisfying for you.

P: So, is this a case of distraction? Are we being distracted by our external worries or things outside of our immediate control?

M: It can be that. It can be distraction. There is always the procrastinator amongst us, laugh.

P: Yes, yes. Laugh.

M: So, it could be that. But a lot of people are not good with uncertainty.

P: Ahh.

M: And so, the fear of what could go wrong stops them from taking any action.

P: That’s beyond risk takers?

M: Absolutely. Generally, risk takers and just move forward.

P: Yep.

M: That’s a very big generalisation there.

P: Laugh.

M: But it’s the people who worry and who are anxious that we’re talking about here.

P: Hmm.

M: And day to day, if you’re on a healthy mental health spectrum, people worry and they get anxious all the time. But they move through it quickly and they don’t dwell. And they tend to have enough self-understanding to know when to let some worry go and just go ‘Meh, what are you going to do about it.’

P: Yeah.

M: You know covid, ‘what are you going to do about it.’

P: Mmm, yep.

M: Covid has been paralysing for some people.

P: Mmm, definitely.

M: Yeah. So, we do have an exercise you can do –

P: Ooh, audience participation. Yay.

M: – if you find yourself too tied to that watermelon.

P: Laugh. I love the watermelon analogy. You’ve got to keep that in, that’s brilliant, laugh.

M: Oh dear.

P: I can just see a big room full of people with a watermelon and an orange and an M&M just going, “What the?”

M: Laugh!

P: Where are we going with this? And then you’ve got to start stuffing things inside each other, it’s gonna get messy. It’s gonna be awesome.

M: Laugh. Oh, dear. All right. Well, the exercise.

P: Laugh.

M: So, if you find that you are anxious just as a rule.

P: Yep.

M: Or that you’re feeling a lot of anxiety or worry at this particular point because we can definitely have triggers or things in our life, periods of our life where we’re more anxious or worried than others.

P: Yes, I agree.

M: Particularly if there’s a lot of change happening around you. This is a great little exercise. So, the first thing you want to do is get a pen and paper and write down all the things in your work and personal and different lives, all of your life, laugh.

P: Laugh, ok.

M: All the things in your life that are crappy or that are not going well or that you’re not happy with.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: So, for me right now, if I had to do this thing on my list would be: I’m not getting enough exercise.

P: Yep.

M: I’m feeling tired from work a lot of the time, you know, and so on and so forth.

P: Ok.

M: And so, you write them all down and then next to them. You’re going to write M&M, orange or watermelon.

P: Laugh!

M: In my control –

P: Still laughing.

M: Within my control. [M&M]

P: Okay,

M: Within my influence; [Orange]

or Outside of my control and influence. [Watermelon]

P: Can we just digress a little bit there Marie, and can we define the difference between control and influence?

M: Sure. So, I can control what time I wake up in the morning.

P: Yeah.

M: 100% control over that.

P: Ok.

M: I can. Some people may not be able to.

P: Yep, ok.

M: I can’t control how high my rent is. I can potentially influence it by having a conversation and seeing if someone can reduce my rent because I’ve lost my job during covid.

P: Ok, yeah.

M: So, I could influence that possibly.

P: Mmm yeah.

M: There are steps I can take.

P: Yeah.

M: Or I could move house.

P: Ok.

M: I cannot at all – The watermelon is covid a great example.

P: Yep.

M: I can’t control that, outside of my control and influence. Can’t do anything about it.

P: Yeah, yeah.

M: All right. The influence is a bit, it’s the one in between, the grey area, where you may be able to do a whole range of things that still don’t lead to any change in situation.

P: Mmm hmm. Yep, ok.

M: All right, so you are going to write your list, and then you’re going to mark next to it control, influence or outside of control and influence, and have a quick look at what the majority of your complaints and issues fall into.

P: Ok, yeah.

M: So, that’s a good just first step to see whether your anxiety or complaints or annoyances or things that are… it’s like having a million thorns stuck in your hand just getting to you in your brain.

P: Yep.

P: Right.

M: The complaints that are outside of your control read them out loud and notice how they make you feel.

P: Oh, that’s a good one.

M: And if you’ve ever done meditation, this will line up quite nicely.

P: What are your feeling when you say them?

M: Yeah.

P: Tap into that feeling.

M: Are your shoulders tight? Do you breathe differently?

P: Hmm.

M: How does your body react to those issues and concerns that are outside of your control.

P: Yes.

M: And really get to know them. Have a look at them, and are there any of them that you can look at differently? Reframe.

P: Be honest in assessing.

M: Mmm hmm. Yep. And once you’ve had a look through them and really looked under the covers at what they are and how they make you feel.

P: Ok,

M: The big work is, can you let them go?

P: Oh! …How do you do that? Laugh.

M: Once your rational brain has written them down, identified them, you’ve acknowledged the way they make you feel, but you know that they’re outside of your control. Can you let any of them go?

P: Mmm.

M: A great way to do this is with a bit of visualisation.

P: I like this one.

M: Yeah. What you can do is picture in your brain that you’re putting your concern, so covid, into a balloon. Blow up your balloon, you pop it in there and you let it go… You don’t blow it up sorry, you’ve got helium, sorry.

P: Laugh.

M: You let it go up and watch it float away and disappear.

P: Ahh. It’s like the Disney movie Tangled. When they do the lights, they send them all up into the sky.

M: Yes, yes, the Chinese lights.

P: And there’s a festival in Thailand, isn’t there where they do that as well? With, um, with I’m not sure if I’m quoting the right one is the Lantern Festival? [Magical Lanterns Festival in Thailand]

M: They definitely do it in Vietnam.

P: Oh, sorry Vietnam. My apologies.

M: I have a feeling it might be part of quite a few different cultures.

P: Mmm, mmm. It’s a lovely image because it’s a real releasing and letting it go. It’s like going into it into a big paddock and screaming stuff out to get it out of your body. I like the peaceful image of a balloon and, you know, writing things on a piece of paper and then watching it waft off into the nether lands and saying goodbye to my lost long lost obsession.

M & P: Laughter!

M: Your anxiety or something that was keeping you up at night.

P: Yes.

M: Yeah, and there’s power in writing these things down.

P: Yeah. I was just about to say the exact same thing Muz, because there’s so much power in that.

M: If Pete can do it?

P: Yeah, laugh.

M: Yeah, again if you’re prone to anxiety and worry, sit down with the pen and paper is the first step.

P: Mmm.

M: Really just labelling it, understanding it, mucking in and getting dirty and feeling it and putting a name on it.

P: Mmm hmm.

M: All of that stuff is really valuable to then being able to let it go and understanding the subconscious reaction that was maybe happening in your brain. Making it conscious and letting your rational brain throw it away.

P: Yeah.

M: And go “Actually, that’s really silly, I can’t do anything about that.”

P: Not necessary.

M: Can’t do anything about Covid.

P: Yeah. So, find your path through.

M: Now there’s a few things in there –

P: I’m going to jump in.

M: Yeah, I was going to throw to you, laugh.

P: Yeah, laugh. See we’re in sync tonight Muz.

M: Laugh.

P: I’m going to jump in because I came across this wonderful little concept and this is to do with the sphere of influence. So, this is the orange section of the Watermelon M&M and Orange scenario, and this is the concept of Sisu and Sisu actually comes from the Finnish culture in Scandinavia, and it’s described as stoic determination.

M: Mmm.

P: Now, apparently, the Finns take this as a bit of a national pride in terms of being able to display this quality in moments of great, great trial or great adversity. There isn’t actually an English equivalent for sisu, but they say the word gutsy invokes the same sort of character. So, it’s that stoic determination. It’s standing in the face of great adversity and taking action.

M: Mmm.

P: And this action may not actually be the best step, but it’s a step. It’s a step forward. So even by taking this action and adhering to it, you may continue to fail. It may still not bring about the right result.

M: You’re not selling it for me, Pete.

P: Hang on.

M: Laugh.

P: Go with me here. Come with here.

M: Laugh, alright. Alright, I’m with you, the orange, go!

P: Laugh, but it’s that idea of taking action and taking a step. And with that step comes refinement. So, you go ‘okay well, that didn’t work, but let’s change it slightly, let’s approach it from a slightly different perspective.’ And it’s actually taking control by doing actions and steps. Eventually, you reach that point where you’ve taken the right step that brings you out of the sphere of orange and into the sphere of M&M.

M: Laugh.

P: Was that nicely tied up?

M: It’s not out of the sphere of Orange into M&M. Because you still can’t change their external factors? What you are getting out of, is that place of anxiety because you’re shifting from the purely emotional, primordial, gutsy reaction to a controlled, rational thinking, proactive action, and that really can get you out of that anxious space.

P: Yes, definitely.

M: That reactionary space, yep.

P: And again because you’re taking a level of control.

M: Yes.

P: And that’s the most important part of that, that concept.

M: I love it. Sisu.

P: Sisu. Yes. Not to be confused with the character out of Raya and The Last Dragon, which Marie and I both watched this week, and loved.

M: Laugh. Mmm hmm.

P: Who was also called Sisu. [The last dragon – Sisudatu. Nicknamed Sisu]

M: Good movie, you should watch it.

P: Yeah.

M: Even if you’re not five.

P & M: Laugh.

P: There was another reading that I did around this subject, which was done by John Leland, who’s a journalist in America, and he’s written a book called Happiness Is a Choice You Make, and he talks about framing and how you can frame different ideas. And for me, this was the glass half full/ half empty scenario. Marie, you don’t look quite on board with that analogy, but you sort of understand where we’re going with this idea-

M: Oh, definitely.

P: – of looking, looking at issues in a certain light and trying to find instead of trying to find the positive or negative, find the element that you can control.

M: Yep.

P: So, there’s got to be one element in the issue, and there are lots of elements that you may not have any influence over. But there’ll be one that you do or one that you can actually exert some control on. So reframing that idea and looking at a problem in a slightly more creative or lateral way than being linear could possibly bring about a different approach, which again gives you a sense of control, gives you a sense of action, which reinforces your process of addressing it as opposed to being stuck in a circle of anxiety.

M: Yeah, absolutely. And we’ve spoken before about reinforcing neural pathways.

P: Mmm.

M: So for all of those people who are experiencing high levels of anxiety, particularly with covid, which absolutely not judging.

P: Mmm.

M: It is completely fair to be experiencing high levels of anxiety right now.

P: Yeah.

M: If you are experiencing high levels of anxiety and you let that run rampant, what you’re doing is reinforcing anxiety as a way to cope with life in general.

P: Yeah.

M: So, covid may move on.

P: Mmm.

M: We may get herd immunity with vaccines. Borders may reopen, you might win lotto. Everything will be great. And what you’ve done is reinforced that neural pathway that makes you go to anxiety as your default.

P: Yep, exactly.

M: So, for every time that you’ve gone to anxiety as your default reaction over the last year or over your life or over a period in your life, you’ve got to do the exact same amount of work on the flip side to get yourself out of there. And reframing, as you said Peter, glass half full glass or half empty –

P: Mmm.

M: – that reframing is a great way to start to break or build that new neural pathway.

P: And it is breaking that other habit. It’s finding an intervention that actually works against that negative habit.

M: Yep. And if that habit has been reinforced for a very long time. You have got to put just as much work in, unfortunately.

P: Yep, totally agree.

M: I’m going to take 10 days, 20 days, 30 days. It will take just as long to make that new neural pathway the stronger and more dominant one.

P: Yep, unfortunately. Laugh, nothing’s ever easy.

M: [Exasperated voice] Nothing is ever easy.

P: Laugh.

M: Unless you’re a dragon called Sisu.

P: Laugh! You could have a dragon called Sisu, that makes a difference. I’d do that, laugh.

M: I’d do that.

P: So, we’ve got homework Marie?

M: Homework?

P: Yeah. Didn’t you have homework for us?

M: We went through the –

P: Oh ok.

M: We’ve done the homework.

P: So, we’ve done the homework. We’re going out. We’re writing out our issues. We’re addressing the M&M and the Orange.

M: Labelling them.

P: Labelling them, putting them in a balloon and floating them up in the air, laugh.

M: Before you do that, though. Really look at how they make you feel. Say them out loud and identify the ones to let go.

P: It’s going to be ridiculous for some people who have never done visualisation or that kind of action before. You’re going to feel stupid. And yes, it’s good for you.

M: Let me just say as the cynic on this show, you wouldn’t catch me dead doing these.

P: Laugh, that’s it.

M: There is a scientific theory behind this, but there’s no chance in hell that I would be doing it.

P: Laugh.

M: I would be stubborn and dig my heels in and be a cranky old fart until I died before I was visualising stuff in balloons. I have to throw that out there.

P: We’re so doing it. I’m coming to Tamworth and we’re doing it. I’m so going to come and make you do this and we’re going to make this an annual thing. We’re going to have a balloon night once every year.

M: Although, a visualisation of balloons because releasing actual balloons is bad for the environment and animals choke on them.

P: It is, yeah.

M: Alright.

P: On that note, folks imagine balloons have fun, fun with it, and we hope you’re all going well and staying strong and safe during this time.

M: And that you have a happy and safe week, we’ll see you next time.

P: Bye.